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RubyWings91
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12 Nov 2011, 4:29 pm

Math is the comprehendible description of how the universe works. The language used is one of numbers rather than letters.



Sunshine7
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13 Nov 2011, 3:00 pm

Quote:
"Random" has a vague, and controversial, definition in Quantum Mechanics. "Random" has self-contradictory definitions in mathematics, and "Random" has more of an ignorance/religious definitional usage in physics.


Yeah, as far as I know, there isn't a formal definition of randomness in mathematics. I still find this quite a surprising fact given the definitive mathematician's fanaticism for rigour.

What do physicists think of randomness? I would love to hear that.

Quote:
You actually do and you just don't realize it. Whether 2 choices, 2 million, or an infinite possible number of choices per scenario...if all events have an equally likely event of happening given the limits of the laws, than You have a random element.


Pseudorandom number generators, such as the ones used in Excel, are very definitely deterministic, but are precisely engineered to generate i.i.d. samples.

Quote:
The main, and most accurate, is "unpredictable". A random event is still determined, we just don't know what it is. That dice roll of a six was always going to be a six, and if we could take the precise enough measurements and work out the calculations, we could predict it would be a six, but such a task is beyond us. We only think of there being alternative outcomes because we can predict six likely phase spaces, each of which is actually a pretty much infinite range of possibilities.


I believe probability is used extensively in QM simply because using the Lebesgue measure and axioms in probability are so tractable. i.e. "because we can write down equations and solve for them." I know very little about QM, so I can't speak with any authority.

All in all, I believe nothing about the universe, and the universe doesn't appear to be bothered by that. Light particles may be a wave, or a particle, or doing a Hawaiian hula dance for all I know.



ryanclearwater
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14 Nov 2011, 7:43 am

Math is more powerful than the most powerful nations and the largest human armies.

What is more powerful than math is the minds that truly understands math ....The minds
that can apply math to everything not only physics and engineering ...The math gene
did not emerge until about 500 years ago ...and is natures way of furthering the human
species ...and i think mathematics is the only way the human species will survive.

Math IS the only solution to ALL the problems in the world ....A small group of mathematicians
could be more powerful than thousands of neurotypical CEO'S who control them and the world and science.

Mathematicians with there POWER could create an objective platform for science ...
they are the only ones that can further us.

Math should not only be used to understand the universe ....It should also be an objective basis for everything

My questions is why don't mathematicians truly understand there power group together and use it
to further the rest of us......

I want to start a project that truly will show the POWER of math ....I am a business owner in las vegas
and am very willing to give what evermoney is needed.

I would like to talk to like minded people who would be interested in starting this with me.

If interested google millenniumparty for a basic idea or contact me.


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ruveyn
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14 Nov 2011, 8:33 am

ryanclearwater wrote:
Math is more powerful than the most powerful nations and the largest human armies.

What is more powerful than math is the minds that truly understands math ....The minds
that can apply math to everything not only physics and engineering ...The math gene
did not emerge until about 500 years ago ...and is natures way of furthering the human
species ...and i think mathematics is the only way the human species will survive.

.


Really? Euclid wrote -The Elements- 2300 years ago. Archimedes invented calculus 2100 years ago. Diaphantos invented equation solving 1600 years ago. Hasan ibn Al Jabir invented the kind of math named aftger him a thousand years ago. (Al Jabir = Algebra).

Long before that the Babylonian invented the positional notation number system (base 60, not base 10) and we still use some of it. How many minutes to the hour and how many seconds to the minute? The Egyptians were able to lay out their pyramids correctly in line with the cardinal directions. And they were able to hew stone blocks with perpendicular sides to a precision not much less than modern stone cutting. They used a special case of Pythagoras Theorem two thousand years before Pythagoras was born.

I think you ought to study some of the history of mathematics.

ruveyn



Sunshine7
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15 Nov 2011, 5:49 am

I tried to prove to my girlfriend that I love her more than anything else in the world by defining L = {set of all lovable objects} and deriving conclusively that she was the global maxima - why didn't she believe me??



ZakFiend
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15 Nov 2011, 11:14 am

Sunshine7 wrote:
I tried to prove to my girlfriend that I love her more than anything else in the world by defining L = {set of all lovable objects} and deriving conclusively that she was the global maxima - why didn't she believe me??


This is why:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYmi0DLzBdQ



graywyvern
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29 Nov 2011, 11:38 am

first, i just want to say that this is an uncommonly good thread on an extremely good question to ask.

however, asking it doesn't mean it is at all answerable.

"The illusion that everything is sayable comes from having dwelt too long among the things that have been said." (TTAPOOC)

substitute: 'countable'. actually, very little of what happens to me corresponds either to a mathematical model, or classical logic in terms of discrete cause & effect. these are assumptions i make to keep from being overly bewildered, but i typically cannot determine a deep cause for almost anything that happens. my experience has rough regularity. this can be enumerated. saying the numbers is satisfying. --so is, saying magic words.

the power of mathematics in the service of technology is actually the power of trial & error, if you think about it. one does not simply draw a picture of a device & then build it & find it works perfectly. predictions are neat, certainly. having a life full of prediction & control is less frightening than a life that lacks it (though less & less is ours the former!). but let's not give the physicists more credit than the engineers. and i think even the most complete theory is ultimately still a "black box". we don't know what's inside.

the guessing, fortunately, keeps us going.


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Yoghourt
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01 Dec 2011, 2:33 am

That's easy. artists use math as a tool to draw. at same point math was used to create the world by god.