How much money has the Pirate Bay stolen from the RIAA?

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Yes.

How?

You're falling into the old trap of assuming that one pirated download = one lost sale. This isn't the case. Just coz I can get something for free, it don't mean I'd be willing to pay for it.

On the other hand, if - through filesharing - I discover an artist I really like, I may very well go and buy their next album legally.

Oh, and you do not need producers with massive paychecks to make good music. Just look at all the independent artists who make music of the same (or, as is often the case, better) quality with either donations from fans or absolutely nothing.

Would you download a car????

if you show me how, I'd love to download a car...

If everyone had that attitude, there would be no next album because of their lack of commercial viability.



One, thats irrelevant to the discussion, and two, most music is overseen by a producer including the majority of independant artists.

Is that so? Well, most people these days do have that attitude, and studies actually show that it increases album sales.



How is it not relevant when it shows that the current business model of the industry is redundant?

Even if some independent artists do have producers (which I doubt is actually true since production of music can be done quite easily by the artists these days anyway), do those producers take 90% of sales?

And since this can all be done without a record contract... Why does the RIAA need to exist?

Link to one of these studies please.



It is irrelevant because most music involves more people than simply the music artists/performers themselves, and you are singling out one of these groups of people and claiming based on zero evidence that they are irrelevant to the production of modern music, when it is clear that they have a major role in modern music production. The fact that you doubt that the task of music production isn't handled by someone other than the performers themselves in the vast majority of cases shows that you have little understanding of how music is actually produced.

Sure thing: http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/ap ... more-music



You're right, for music you also need distribution. Now, before the internet, you needed the RIAA and record labels to get that done. However, these days, anyone can make music on their computer, record the lyrics, and instantly send it all over the world all by themselves.

I will give you two examples: Ronald Jenkees and Dan Bull. Neither of these artists has a record label or anything, they make their music and put it online for their fans to listen to for free. If they like it, they can donate to the artist.

This is what music should be like. We don't need massive groups like the RIAA anymore - the only reason they're even making such a big deal about piracy is so they can save their old dead business model and therefore justify their own existence.

I recommend that you educate yourself a little by watching Steal This Film 2. You can download it from your favourite torrent site or just stream it from YouTube completely legally, it's owners have allowed it.

The record companies are the ones stealing from the artists. Having a contract with a record company is not all that glorious. Artists barely see and touch any of the profits because the producers and the record companies take a big fat sum of money from the profits. Plus artists don't earn anything from the record company until a certain amount of albums have been sold.

The indie artists with good quality recordings also usually try harder to make better music, and they don't get as much money. If everyone could download as much as they wanted, the music industry will effectively die. That will even the playing field. Eventually people will figure out that without money being involved, the music is the only thing that will matter.

So download and smile.

It may well be that the music industry is over paid and in need of a correction. This is what they are fighting against. They cannot accept that they get more than they deserve. They still cannot grasp their irrelevancy.

Related to this is the recent "humble Indie Bundle" which threw it in the face of the large gaming companies. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humble_Indie_Bundle Note that it says something interesting about piracy of even games that could cost 0.002 US Dollars.

Another even more recent? The machine of death anthology book. http://machineofdeath.net/a/mod-day

Fixed. Unless you are an extremely popular artist and stay that way, most and usually more money actually comes from doing live performances, and that also requires promotion and has other costs involved. In fact the total production costs for live performances can be much higher.

When I was seven we went camping. My sister, aged 4, was holding a stick that was burning(on one end). I preceded to light my stick from hers, to howls of "Mum! Hes stealing my FIIIRE!".

Some of you, ostensibly adults, still think like her.

Intellectual violation isnt right, and I oppose it, but it certainly isnt stealing. If I stand too close to you, am I stealing your electrons?

Remember the miracle of multiplication, where Jesus took some bread and fish then made enough copies so that everyone could eat?

"Mum! He's stealing my FIIISH!"

When you illegally copy bread and fish, you're killing the food industry!