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Masuna
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19 May 2009, 6:45 pm

How do you feel about pirating software? the way i see it is, if i have the money i'll pay , and if not, i'll pirate. share your opinions! I've bought so much crappy software i would at least like to try them out first! let me know!


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GustavHolst
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19 May 2009, 7:33 pm

I don't steal software, then again, I've rarely ran into any software, that I had to buy.

Hey, can I break into your home and steal your sink? I just want to make sure it's the same type of sink I want. I'll return, but won't put it back together.



Fuzzy
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19 May 2009, 7:34 pm

I wont pirate. I will find something free or I will purchase. I am exceedingly unlikely to buy something I cannot try.


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19 May 2009, 7:39 pm

Pirating software doesn't bother me. Probably has something to do with my inability to see it as/like physical property...


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MattShizzle
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19 May 2009, 7:55 pm

GustavHolst wrote:
Hey, can I break into your home and steal your sink? I just want to make sure it's the same type of sink I want. I'll return, but won't put it back together.


There's a big difference - when someone steals something they have it and the person they took it from doesn't have it anymore. When someone pirates they have it, and nobody else loses anything. I see nothing wrong with it whatsoever especially as unethical as the movie/music/software companies are with gouging the public. Even worse are the software ones - like EA - that put extremely draconian copy protection that can damage someones computer on their software (ie Securom.) So the people that buy it are screwed and the pirates get a better, safer product for free.



As far as what I do........

Arrrrr!


:pirat:



Orwell
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19 May 2009, 8:04 pm

I don't pirate, and never will. Theft is theft, and theft is immoral.

And I don't want to hear any lame justifications based on the "evil" of the people you are stealing from. People have rights over things that they create, period. If you don't like the way in which they exercise those rights, don't use what they produce. There are free (as in beer and as in speech) alternatives to cover any actual need you have in computing, so there is no justification for piracy. You don't like the license terms, then boycott and find something else to use.


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Orwell
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19 May 2009, 8:08 pm

Fuzzy wrote:
I am exceedingly unlikely to buy something I cannot try.

Same here. Also, I'm hesitant to rely on anything with a product key or activation code, as I don't know for certain if I'm going to make changes in my system, and if I lose my right to use a product because I am on a new operating system, that's money down the drain. I'd accept paying for a quality product so long as I was assured I would be able to continue using it unhindered.


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Elfnote
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19 May 2009, 8:08 pm

BelindatheNobody wrote:
Pirating software doesn't bother me. Probably has something to do with my inability to see it as/like physical property...


I feel the same way. When I can, I'll use free alternatives, but if they don't work very well or there are none, I'll hit the torrent trackers. However, I pirate for different reasons. I find software prices outrageous. The medium that software is sold on is usually quite cheap, as is its packaging. Even more so for downloaded content. An OS should be no more than $75-100 at the most, and desktop software should be $20-50.

To those who say that developers need money too, yes, I completely agree. But their profit margins are outrageous, and this can be proven by pointing at video games, particularly back in the days of cartridges. Cartridges are very expensive to manufacture, and yet the switch to CD/DVD/Blueray has only reduced the price by about $10 or $20. What gives? For this reason my non-pirated stuff is either used or heavily discounted.



Orwell
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19 May 2009, 8:25 pm

Elfnote wrote:
BelindatheNobody wrote:
Pirating software doesn't bother me. Probably has something to do with my inability to see it as/like physical property...


I feel the same way. When I can, I'll use free alternatives, but if they don't work very well or there are none, I'll hit the torrent trackers. However, I pirate for different reasons. I find software prices outrageous. The medium that software is sold on is usually quite cheap, as is its packaging. Even more so for downloaded content. An OS should be no more than $75-100 at the most, and desktop software should be $20-50.

To those who say that developers need money too, yes, I completely agree. But their profit margins are outrageous, and this can be proven by pointing at video games, particularly back in the days of cartridges. Cartridges are very expensive to manufacture, and yet the switch to CD/DVD/Blueray has only reduced the price by about $10 or $20. What gives? For this reason my non-pirated stuff is either used or heavily discounted.

In other words, you pirate because you're a cheapskate. It is not up to you to determine what is a "fair" price for any of the software. The people who write the software offer it at whatever price they see fit. If that price is too high for you, don't buy that piece of software.


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normally_impaired
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19 May 2009, 8:29 pm

I'd far rather encounter a software pirate than an actual pirate, at least software pirates don't kill people for their money.



Masuna
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19 May 2009, 8:54 pm

Nice to see a little humor! There are a few ways being able to download software is ethical,the time limit on patents in canada for software is like music i think 50 years after patent issue it becomes public domain, and your legally entitled to make 1 copy of software you purchase, so for stuff you've lost or broken. Don't get me wrong, I fully try to support the software industry (When i can) but with the little money i have i would prefer to support the companies that i think worthy of the little i got. The computer and software industry is a human endevour of the highest creative order! Besides, I think its the only thing keeping me SANE! hahaha! I just felt guilty and wanted to talk about it. I don't think any of us will change each others view, But your opinions are still worth something to me. keep it coming!


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19 May 2009, 9:04 pm

There's never a need to pirate software as software developers for a long time have known that their product will sell more if they let consumers try it first through trial versions. These are often full fledged versions that are only limited in that after a certain time they will be disabled until you send money to the developer, and you usually get a decent length of time to use the software.

Music on the other hand I will download to try, and then if I like it I will buy it. This I do because unlike with the software industry there is often no way to 'try' music legally before a purchase outside of listening to online versions of radio singles, if indeed there are any released. Before anyone accuses me of being a pirate or of hypocrisy, at the time of writing I have 196 albums on my iPod, 100% of which are legally owned (on cd or vinyl, not mp3, as I dislike digitally distributed music), and I delete all digital music that I do not intend to later purchase.



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19 May 2009, 9:13 pm

Orwell wrote:
I don't pirate, and never will. Theft is theft, and theft is immoral.

This.

Kids these days. Got no respect for nothin'.


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GustavHolst
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19 May 2009, 9:43 pm

MattShizzle wrote:
GustavHolst wrote:
Hey, can I break into your home and steal your sink? I just want to make sure it's the same type of sink I want. I'll return, but won't put it back together.


There's a big difference - when someone steals something they have it and the person they took it from doesn't have it anymore.
I said I would return the sink, I just wouldn't put it back together. When someone pirates software and people use that pirated software instead of buying it. Well buddy, that's considered stealing. Someone is not getting paid because you decided stealing is A-OK.
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When someone pirates they have it, and nobody else loses anything.
Nobody else loses anything? Are you being serious? If the programmers and the company wanted people to have their software for free, they would give it away. Wouldn't they?
Quote:
I see nothing wrong with it whatsoever especially as unethical as the movie/music/software companies are with gouging the public. Even worse are the software ones - like EA - that put extremely draconian copy protection that can damage someones computer on their software (ie Securom.) So the people that buy it are screwed and the pirates get a better, safer product for free.
So, in other words ,you believe stealing is perfectly acceptable.

You attempt to justify your actions by writing silly stuff like, "well EA is evil, so I'm entitled to steal their software." and "EA is ripping us off." You're a thief, plain and simple. You can come up with all the justifications you want for stealing (pirating) software. But the fact of the matter is, you're a thief.

Do you think it's ok for me to not pay for the gas I put in my car? I mean, the big oil companies are evil. Plus, they're not losing anything, really. Maybe when I need a new car, i'll just drive it off the lot without paying for it. I'll even scratch the serial number off, and if I get caught, I'll just tell the cops, that car companies are evil. Big car companies are evil and they're ripping me off. I'm entitled to take the cars they're trying to sell because they're a ripoff. They're not losing anything, really.

You know, you're free to program your own video games, if you hate EA so much.

Pirates don't really get better and safer product for free. You probably have no idea what's you're getting in all that warez garbage you're downloading.



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19 May 2009, 9:51 pm

GustavHolst wrote:
You know, you're free to program your own video games, if you hate EA so much.

QFT.

One of my best friends is currently boycotting the latest Command and Conquer because he disagrees with EA's DRM scheme. He loves the games, and he's quite upset that he can't play the newest one. But he actually has a sense of decency, so he's going without rather than pirating.

Anyways, games aren't something you want to talk about "needing" to pirate. Is it to the point where you're stealing toys? Is that how pathetic software piracy really is? I mean, it's not even something you actually need to do your work.


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DNForrest
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19 May 2009, 10:04 pm

It's intellectual property, pretty much the same as a patented process. If you use a patented process to make a product, the owner of the patent loses money. Same thing happens when you use pirated software, the intellectual property owner loses out on money. How is it not stealing?