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open source ecology

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Oodain
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27 May 2011, 8:12 am

open source cology

"It is a life-size lego-like set of modular tools that can create entire economies. "

i have no idea what to think, just found this and wanted to share.


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richie
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27 May 2011, 8:52 am

What about communications? Remember information is the difference that makes a difference......


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ruveyn
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27 May 2011, 9:32 am

Oodain wrote:
open source cology

"It is a life-size lego-like set of modular tools that can create entire economies. "

i have no idea what to think, just found this and wanted to share.


I know what to think. Nonsense! Economies are too complex to model accurately. If we could control our economy we would not be in a financial crisis.

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Oodain
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27 May 2011, 2:55 pm

they are not talking of anything but free open source designs for cheap building, it could be helpfull to large parts of the world if used correctly.
so to call it a whole economy is nonsense, other than that i think the concept has some merit, including a way to improve bio-oil while neutralising red mud(waste from aluminium production)


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LordoftheMonkeys
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27 May 2011, 3:38 pm

Don't know what the fu¢k that means, but whatever.


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LordoftheMonkeys
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27 May 2011, 3:41 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Oodain wrote:
open source cology

"It is a life-size lego-like set of modular tools that can create entire economies. "

i have no idea what to think, just found this and wanted to share.


I know what to think. Nonsense! Economies are too complex to model accurately. If we could control our economy we would not be in a financial crisis.

ruveyn


That's why America needs to be more socialist. The rest of the developed world has universal health care, and several other advantages, while the US currently has one of the lowest standards of living of any developed nation. We could learn a thing or two from countries like Canada and the UK. Unfortunately, socialism is a four-letter word here, and the vast majority of the US population seems to believe that it's a synonym for communism.


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ruveyn
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27 May 2011, 5:38 pm

LordoftheMonkeys wrote:

That's why America needs to be more socialist. The rest of the developed world has universal health care, and several other advantages, while the US currently has one of the lowest standards of living of any developed nation. We could learn a thing or two from countries like Canada and the UK. Unfortunately, socialism is a four-letter word here, and the vast majority of the US population seems to believe that it's a synonym for communism.


A Command Economy is a guaranteed failure. Socialism will never get rid of the black (free) market. Even Stalin with his death squads and gulags couldn't do it.

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Oodain
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27 May 2011, 8:44 pm

socialism has nothing to do with the market, a free market and socialism go quite well together.


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ruveyn
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27 May 2011, 8:48 pm

Oodain wrote:
socialism has nothing to do with the market, a free market and socialism go quite well together.


Free market requires the private ownership of the means of production.

When prices are controlled by the Committee or the Collective it is no long free.

Also one must be free to hire labor at a privately agreed upon wage. This flies right in the face of socialism.

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LordoftheMonkeys
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28 May 2011, 11:47 am

ruveyn wrote:
LordoftheMonkeys wrote:

That's why America needs to be more socialist. The rest of the developed world has universal health care, and several other advantages, while the US currently has one of the lowest standards of living of any developed nation. We could learn a thing or two from countries like Canada and the UK. Unfortunately, socialism is a four-letter word here, and the vast majority of the US population seems to believe that it's a synonym for communism.


A Command Economy is a guaranteed failure. Socialism will never get rid of the black (free) market. Even Stalin with his death squads and gulags couldn't do it.

ruveyn


Socialism is not the same thing as communism. The vast majority of the developed world is more socialist than the US, and they have a much higher standard of living than we do.


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ruveyn
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28 May 2011, 12:04 pm

LordoftheMonkeys wrote:

Socialism is not the same thing as communism. The vast majority of the developed world is more socialist than the US, and they have a much higher standard of living than we do.


You mean regulated. Yes, most mostly capitalistic system are regulated. Some more, some less. Hong Kong under the British was one of the least regulated capitalistic markets that ever existed.

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28 May 2011, 12:48 pm

LordoftheMonkeys wrote:
That's why America needs to be more socialist. The rest of the developed world has universal health care, and several other advantages, while the US currently has one of the lowest standards of living of any developed nation. We could learn a thing or two from countries like Canada and the UK.

Canada has one of the freest markets in the world.

By 'developed world' are you perhaps referring to nations like Australia or New Zealand? They are among the most economically free nations in the world. Guess what? They also have the second and third highest HDI in the world, respectively.

By the way, from where are you sourcing your claim that the USA has one of the lowest standards of living of any developed nation? That is nonsense, the USA has the fourth highest HDI in the world.

And no, socialism and free markets can't go hand in hand. Socialism involves forcibly redistributing resources, which is the opposite of free.

Socialism is not communism, no. I like to think of it as a one dimensional graph, with economic freedom at the left end, communism at the right end, and socialism anywhere inbetween. Almost all developed nations are near the left end.



Oodain
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29 May 2011, 8:02 am

if you use the inequality adjusted HDI denmark has a higher one than the us.
but in the end it is just numbers.
we have just as high an economic freedom with much more redistribution.

i


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ruveyn
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29 May 2011, 12:03 pm

Burzum wrote:

Socialism is not communism, no. I like to think of it as a one dimensional graph, with economic freedom at the left end, communism at the right end, and socialism anywhere inbetween. Almost all developed nations are near the left end.


Socialism is based on envy and will instantiate mediocrity. It is a terminal disease. It starts off blah and ends up deadly and nasty. Socialism is the natural system for the congenitally incompetent.

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Burzum
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29 May 2011, 1:04 pm

Oodain wrote:
if you use the inequality adjusted HDI denmark has a higher one than the us.

Using the inequality adjusted HDI it ranks in 12th, which is still far higher than the "lowest standard of living for any developed country".

Oodain wrote:
we have just as high an economic freedom with much more redistribution.

If by "redistribution" you mean wealth equality, sure.

If by "redistribution", you mean forcibly redistributed resources, then no. Economic freedom and forceful control of resources are mutually exclusive.



Oodain
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29 May 2011, 1:25 pm

by redistribution i mean taxation to pay for services that help the less fortunate, as well as the general citizen.

as for your first reply i am slightly at a loss, i never said anything about the US.


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