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Which is your OS of choice?
Microsoft Windows 22%  22%  [ 12 ]
Mac OSX 29%  29%  [ 16 ]
Linux 49%  49%  [ 27 ]
Total votes : 55

oceandrop
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05 Sep 2011, 12:19 am

Which do you prefer overall (of these three)?



fuzzynavel
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05 Sep 2011, 2:13 am

I'm using my ipad at at the time I saw the question, so I voted on mac os even though it might not be exactly the same.



MarketAndChurch
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05 Sep 2011, 2:38 am

the mac osx for sure

Linux is not too bad


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Tom_Kakes
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05 Sep 2011, 3:18 am

Linux!! !

Please include iOS, Android and UNIX/BSD!



mcg
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05 Sep 2011, 4:03 am

Depends on the circumstances.



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05 Sep 2011, 8:22 am

I love Ubuntu but I have to use windows because its the only way my games would run. :(



oceandrop
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05 Sep 2011, 8:52 am

I like Ubuntu too. At least I like it for a while then usually get frustrated at the never ending terminal commands needed to do something simple. For example installing a new program which needs a new source to be added to the software repository along with keys etc. They really need to automate this stuff!



Tom_Kakes
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05 Sep 2011, 9:23 am

oceandrop wrote:
I like Ubuntu too. At least I like it for a while then usually get frustrated at the never ending terminal commands needed to do something simple. For example installing a new program which needs a new source to be added to the software repository along with keys etc. They really need to automate this stuff!


They have, its called apt-url.

In my view a decent shell gives you more control over your OS. If bash wasn't so powerful linux wouldnt be half the os that it is today and anyway most users should never need to go near the terminal.



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05 Sep 2011, 9:57 am

Tom_Kakes wrote:
oceandrop wrote:
I like Ubuntu too. At least I like it for a while then usually get frustrated at the never ending terminal commands needed to do something simple. For example installing a new program which needs a new source to be added to the software repository along with keys etc. They really need to automate this stuff!
They have, its called apt-url.
Or synaptic, for another clicky-tappy GUI-based approach.

Quote:
In my view a decent shell gives you more control over your OS.
Exactly. I despair when users complain about 'having to type commands'. It's not like you're expected to write a novel... :lol:
The shell is where the fun really starts.


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Tom_Kakes
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05 Sep 2011, 2:35 pm

Cornflake wrote:
Tom_Kakes wrote:
oceandrop wrote:
I like Ubuntu too. At least I like it for a while then usually get frustrated at the never ending terminal commands needed to do something simple. For example installing a new program which needs a new source to be added to the software repository along with keys etc. They really need to automate this stuff!
They have, its called apt-url.
Or synaptic, for another clicky-tappy GUI-based approach.

Quote:
In my view a decent shell gives you more control over your OS.
Exactly. I despair when users complain about 'having to type commands'. It's not like you're expected to write a novel... :lol:
The shell is where the fun really starts.


Lmao

Yeah its not like people don't have the choice to be a drone!

:D



oceandrop
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05 Sep 2011, 3:03 pm

I like a shell, I grew up with MS-DOS, but they still need to make routine tasks (like adding a new software source) automated -- i.e. click a button then answer yes/next/next/done. For example the instructions to install FocusWriter in Ubuntu are truly horrible (http://gottcode.org/focuswriter/). I'm sure it becomes easy with time but there really shouldn't be any learning curve for such a simple task.



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05 Sep 2011, 3:26 pm

oceandrop wrote:
they still need to make routine tasks (like adding a new software source) automated -- i.e. click a button then answer yes/next/next/done.
Er, that's not actually automated - you're clicking on buttons. :nerdy:
But Synaptic lets you browse through a list of applications, selecting stuff you'd like to install while you're browsing, and you'd eventually hit an "install" button to kick it all off.
Any dependencies are automatically accounted for - as they are with something like sudo apt-get install SomePackage from a shell prompt.

Quote:
For example the instructions to install FocusWriter in Ubuntu are truly horrible
What, you mean this:
1. sudo add-apt-repository ppa:gottcode/gcppa
2. sudo apt-get update
3. sudo apt-get install focuswriter

Which you'd type just once.
Or probably not even type: I'd just copy/paste from the website I found them on directly into a shell.

Quote:
there really shouldn't be any learning curve for such a simple task.
That's not a learning curve - it's a very short list of instructions. :lol:
I reckon you'd always have much more of a battle learning to use an application than installing it.


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oceandrop
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05 Sep 2011, 4:53 pm

Cornflake wrote:
oceandrop wrote:
they still need to make routine tasks (like adding a new software source) automated -- i.e. click a button then answer yes/next/next/done.
Er, that's not actually automated - you're clicking on buttons. :nerdy:
But Synaptic lets you browse through a list of applications, selecting stuff you'd like to install while you're browsing, and you'd eventually hit an "install" button to kick it all off.
Any dependencies are automatically accounted for - as they are with something like sudo apt-get install SomePackage from a shell prompt.

Quote:
For example the instructions to install FocusWriter in Ubuntu are truly horrible
What, you mean this:
1. sudo add-apt-repository ppa:gottcode/gcppa
2. sudo apt-get update
3. sudo apt-get install focuswriter

Which you'd type just once.
Or probably not even type: I'd just copy/paste from the website I found them on directly into a shell.

Quote:
there really shouldn't be any learning curve for such a simple task.
That's not a learning curve - it's a very short list of instructions. :lol:
I reckon you'd always have much more of a battle learning to use an application than installing it.


Well you make it sound easy, and from the looks of it this kind of thing actually would be easy once you get the hang of it. But, it can be frustrating having to open the terminal or make manual edits of files as a matter of routine. Things have certainly improved from the 90's when I last had Linux installed (Slackware), but there's still some way to go before the user friendliness catches up with other OS's. Don't get me wrong, I LIKE coding and I like the terminal, but not for installing software ;)



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05 Sep 2011, 5:54 pm

oceandrop wrote:
Well you make it sound easy, and from the looks of it this kind of thing actually would be easy once you get the hang of it.
But it is easy. :lol:

Quote:
there's still some way to go before the user friendliness catches up with other OS's.
Ah, but you have to bear in mind that you're likely much more familiar with one or more of those, so even the simple stuff in another OS would look a bit bizarre and over-complicated.

Here's a typical example from a Lightroom (Win32) upgrade:
1: right-click and save the upgrade zip file from the Adobe site
2: double-click the zip file
3: create/choose a directory in which to save the extracted contents
4: navigate to that directory and find "setup.exe"
5: double-click on that
6: click-through a couple of "do you agree?" type screens
7: remember to tidy up and delete the temporary directory once setup is finished

Rinse and repeat for all subsequent updates to this release.

To put that into some sort of perspective:
1: at some point in the past I learned about right-clicking and saving files from websites - after I'd learned what a file is and specifically, a zip file and what I'm supposed to do with it. Oh (not nowadays since the functionality is built-in) - learned to install WinZip and how to use that.
2: double-clicking to run an application had to be learned and I understand that the current versions of Windows pop up further dialogs which must be read and understood before you can continue. (except of course a zip file isn't an application, and so an understanding of file associations also had to be learned)
3: directories and what they're for/how they're navigated had to be learned - and where it's appropriate (or even possible) to create them
4: foreground/background windowing principles, window navigation & movement, use of scroll bars etc. all had to be learned too
5: (as 2)
6: yeah well no-one reads those things anyway
7: deleting files and directories had to be learned, along with what's not a good idea to delete - and what to do about it when Windows claims a file is open (when it's invariably not :roll: ); also the concept of a temporary directory which the installation process insisted on throwing at me - without explanation of why, I may add. Some idea of the Recycle Bin is useful too.

Yet it's not complex - we all do it without much thought.
But at least with something installed through an Ubuntu repository (or similar mechanism from another distro) the most I'd need to do in future is tell it to go ahead when an update is announced as being available. And that's clicking on one GUI button or typing about 20 characters at a shell prompt. I don't need to do anything else at all.
Now, remind me again - which method is more 'user-friendly'? :wink:

So...
It's more a case of familiarity with what's already learned, and what's unknown always looks difficult at first.
Just like Windows or a Mac does for anyone the first time they get to use them and Linux is no more difficult - it's just not any of the others.

Quote:
Don't get me wrong, I LIKE coding and I like the terminal, but not for installing software ;)
I don't differentiate between a GUI and a shell - they're both highly effective means to an end, depending on the task at hand, and there is sometimes overlap.
A mouse is nice - but fingers are faster! :lol:

Oh and BTW, I'm not knocking anything you said - I'm just trying to show how much we take for granted about what we've had to learn to do that's simply become a semi-automatic part of what we do.
Or something...


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05 Sep 2011, 8:25 pm

oceandrop wrote:
Things have certainly improved from the 90's when I last had Linux installed (Slackware), but there's still some way to go before the user friendliness catches up with other OS's.

Nonsense. Linux is FAR more user-friendly than Windows ever will be. I am not tech-savvy enough to deal with Windows 7, but Debian is simple to use.


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largosan
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05 Sep 2011, 10:20 pm

Linux is great and all, but WINE uses more resources than just running windows, and I'm already too short on power to run some games. Thus I would say my favorite OS is Linux, but I have to run windows on my desktop at the very least.