what would happen if pinnochio actually said "my nose i

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my nose is going to grow now? if it grows, it creates a paradox. if it doesnt grow its a paradox. what would happen?

Won't work. There is no lie in that statement. If he said "my nose only grows when I am happy" that's a lie but "my nose will grow" is the truth.

The key word in the sentence is the adverb now, which claims his nose will grow as he is speaking and not at some future date.

That's an interesting variation of the liars paradox, similar to the statement "this statement is false". If his nose grows, that usually means that he's lying, however it also means that the statement "my nose is going to grow now" is true. Similarly if it doesn't grow. Either way, he appears to be both lying and telling the truth at the same time because that statement appears to be both true and false at the same time.

If he said: My nose is growing when it is not then his nose grows which makes the statement true and his nose will stop growing.

If he said My nose is growing when it is, then it will stop growing because the statement is true.

In either case asserting My nose is growing is stop any further growth. A sure fire cure to the Blue Fairy's curse.

ruveyn

Last edited by ruveyn on 07 Feb 2013, 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

People keep forgetting the "now" which totally changes the whole scenario.

This is just like the phrase, "I ALWAYS LIE".
If you always lie, you just told the truth = paradox.
You can't be at all truthful when using this phrase...


Personally, I think Pinocchio's head would implode and create a new black hole.

He says "my nose grows when I lie". His nose then- stays the same because its the truth.

He then says "My nose is going to grow starting riiigtht..NOW".

Its starts to grow-then stops and recedes to normal.

This is because it was a lie- but then started to become the truth.

a vortex will open up and sunder the entire universe.

his nose will become an undefined length, or maybe a black hole, or both.

does that mean pinnochio would end??

'now' does not necessarily change things.

If his nose growing it is reactive to the statement, then if it is not growing 'now' it will start growing, and he is no longer making the statement at this point, the event is past. It is only if the detection could be concurrent with the statement would he get himself in a wrangle, the flaw in that is you might only be able to detect the meaning of the statement until after it is over, in which case you couldn't necessarily know, if it is a lie until then. That is a boundary which needs definition.

You would have to know the lie algorithm to know whether it will stop, and when, and the true nature of the reactivity, and detection of the lie.

Programmer's answer.

Of course Pinocchio is going to be screwed, if every statement if he ever made is binding for all time, but that is not in any version of the story.

A lot of these meta-physics questions are usually missing clear bounds. They are just a discussion in ambiguity, and very often semantics.

This discussion kinds or reminds me of discussions of Jesus, and the intended falsehoods he made which are supposedly not lies.

If you mean he would die, then probably; but really this is all hypothetical. There is no law stating that the petty utterances of us humans can create large gravitational disturbances. The motions of all the planets in the galaxy could just as easily spell out the words "This statement is false" in some language yet to be invented (or discovered if it belongs to an alien race), and nothing would happen. In fact, I have proof. I hereby invent a language where, when you view the paths of all the planets in the Milky Way galaxy for 1 million years, from an angle precisely perpendicular to the plane of the galaxy, so that our sun is dead left of the center, the words "This statement is false" (in that language) are spelled out. The language is called Galadoxian, and I the only sentient being in the entire universe who can understand it (probably).

And here I am, still, and the universe is alive and well, business as usual.

Pinnochio will end only when the Mayan Calender says so.

Or...only on a day and on in an hour know to the Father. Even the son doesnt know.

One of those two.

It will also be a self fulfilling prophecy. By telling the lie his nose will grow but as soon as it does it will stop. I've always wondered though. If he thinks a lie is true will his nose still grow?

If you state something that you believe to be true, then it isnt a lie. ( it might be a repeat of someone else's lie, but for you it isnt a lie).

So if he said 'santa clause' brought me such-and-such believing that santa clause was real then his nose would not grow.