ASP.net

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Yea, I got a copy of visual studio and have hosting on a friends IIS server. I'm trying to figure out where to start. ASP is a new language to me and I want to learn it to expand my resume.

Suggestions?

ASP.net may have been well intentioned (Microsoft's idea of gathering data; maybe with good intent?) but it's also a gateway for hackers; I found that, though I'd never entertained any user than myself, I once discovered a "user" which I'd never agreed, and who's identity, nor password, I could not access.

IN real time: I'm no computer wizz, but I'm not stupid either: Nothing I tried could give me access to the Asp.net user. No passport (though I was Admin) No information, whatsoever!

I would like to see a reference for this vulnerbility.

there are much better thing than asp. Like php or ruby. IIS is also a royal pain in the arse.

It is really hard to answer a question, eh? Advertising PHP or anything does not answer the question. ASP.net is a popular technology in the Microsoft world and there are companies who run Microsoft products exclusively. That is reality.

Learning ASP.net is like any other technology, get yourself a project, plan what features you want to have, give it a structure and then fill it. Books are great for learning too! They are written a special way so the later chapters build on the ealier stuff and quite often there is an example project referred to that gets more complex while you go on.

Programming languages always initiate fanboy wars about platforms. ASP.NET, while not appreciated by all, is a solid and productive platform, imho, and no more insecure or buggy than the alternatives. It also comes with a really nice, totally free IDE.

ASP.NET can be written in any .NET language, but I'd suggest learning C#. It's more in demand than VB.NET (do a keyword search on monster for both languages), and using C++.NET would just be silly.

To get started, buy a decent primer, like this one, and download the Visual Web Developer software. You might also want to grab SQL Server 2005 Express, to gain familiarity with database access, which is a primary purpose of most web sites.

It took me about a year to become fully proficient with ASP.NET. There are a lot of "wizards" and controls which Microsoft provides to make things easier. You can use these until you're advanced enough to write your own implementations, as the wizards don't always do what you want. As a previous poster said, there is a perception that ASP.NET "leads to hack" code, but that's only true for hack coders who never bother to learn how things work "under the covers". I've seen plenty of mediocre Ruby/Rails apps, too.

The nice thing about ASP.NET is that it's easy to get your mind around. Installation is simple, and IIS is easy to maneuver.

Anyone for Mono?

I see no relation of Mono and learning ASP.net. I would further expect it to introducr further complexity into the learning situation while the Microsoft tools Visual Studio/IIS/SQL Server provide a good base that is fairly easy to get familiar with.

Btw, I would not agree to the statement "It must be good because it is "Microsoft-free". Porting existing .NET applications to the unix/linux platform might make some sense but then: While not running Java technology here?

Interesting points. I disagree strongly with every sentence.

"Insidious" is a good adjective for Microsoft. They do indeed provide "a good base that is fairly easy to get familiar with", so that once you are locked in, it becomes hard to break out. I associate "learning" with "understanding the principles behind", not with "managing to use a spoon-fed bit of Microsoft software".

Still, it's nice that they've come out with Vista. That seems to be providing huge incentives to people to move away from MS.

Rant over.

I cannot really disagree with you, but that is not the point. Usage of the Lock-In-Effect is a well known strategy in our business world and the Lock-In-Effect is taught at every business school. Any company who is able to use it will use it. Fighting those paradigms means fighting against windmills the Don Quixote style. I too see those problems but I prefer to live with them because the opposite means worrying about other people's business. The Microsoft tools are made very well and their usability is great.

The notion Microsoft would simply copy Java to make up a new langauge (C#) or that they make it harder or unattractive to use fully compatible web services by introducing .NET remoting would most certainly be correct. But that is not the point either. Disliking that strategy for political reasons is okay, but the MS tools work.

I too agree with you that using Microsoft products in an education environment is not the most wise thing to do and many institutions are aware of that. However, there are financial issues here, sponsoring makes a point in education. You can teach application development, database design etc. with the Microsoft tools.

You certainly can learn how to build web appications using ASP.NET. I would prefer Java technology all the way but if somebody asks me "I want to learn ASP. NET" I am not going to tell him to learn something else because I would feel politically uneasy about that decision. There are companies running Microsoft products only and they have reasons to do so. There are integration, migration and support issues and Microsoft has good training programms as well.

The tactics and strategies of Microsoft are well known to the business community and Microsoft did not invent them. What do you expect from them? "Yes, we could make a big big heap of money this way but hey, let us be nice and friendly people." Is is that what you want? Sorry, that is ridiculous.

I also fully agree, bar for the last bit.

Fast rewind a bit, and consider IBM. I can see a parallel to MS. IBM, at their peak, had 80% of the market. The reasoning behind managers buying IBM kit was - "It's IBM. We always buy IBM".

IBM then badged (and that's all they did - stuck a badge on it) the "IBM PC", but didn't take it seriously. There was a point where IBM could have vanished. They now seem to be quite "the good guys".

There are some signs that MS may be following a similar pattern. They invented C# (the best language I've seen for quite a while), but made it a public standard. The community took it and ran away with it.

Monopolies and monocultures bother me.

I am sorry for that last bit. Never mind.



I am not sure this is really about monopolies. I think it is more about capitalism, the good guys, the bad guys and an overal lack of justice and fairness in the business world.

I quite like the analogy with IBM but I yet wait to see real consumer alternatives for Microsoft software. I do not see any yet. Unfortunately anyone could build IBM compatible PCs, but we still wait to see a Windows-compatible operating system that is not made by Microsoft. Yes sure, we have got Linux and the interested and motivated people can run their computers with it. But let us face reality: It is still not the same. Perhaps stopping OEM bundling Microsoft OSes with new PCs would have broken the curse but our legal authorities failed to do that all the way. Oh yes, we now can insist on Media Player and Internet Explorer free Windows. Fascinating! There is no hope and worrying means wasting time.

'Locked in' is anti competition. Better to fight that than have other protectionism. A large part of Microsoft strategy is suing and countersuing. ‘Board room in the court room’ style of business. I’m not so sure how big Microsoft would be if it didn’t originate in the US. Many countries have pretty low threshold for civil courts to be used purely for commercial gain.

Completion is supposed to provide choice and also increase the overall quality overtime, spur innovation.

The software industry is different compared to other industries in terms of quality control due to its history and the intangible nature of its ‘products’. Nobody goes ‘You buy this cot and put your baby in it, if it falls apart file a report and we may get back to you with a part or a screw or whatever, or possibly some instructions on how to use household goods to prop/patch it back together’. There is going to have to be full production / beta testing for a long time, but it is about time everyone pulls their socks up. There is little incentive for companies like Microsoft to build quality software. Microsoft have supported whole industries based on problems they have directly caused and have profited directly themselves. At the very least this comes under graymail fraud. In fact I don’t believe they are in a position to improve quality anyway. Microsoft has diseconomies of scale in terms of quality control. They do have a lot of the money in the bank, but who knows if they could really use this buffer continually for that end. What is the most depressing is of all the resources that have, they haven’t come up with very much truly new or original in a long time. Arguably they have stalled progress.

TheZach is an individual there is no reason to choose an inferior and more problematic product. Lau is right, Microsoft don't want you to make programs they want to take control of the processes and prevent real understanding. They haven't achieved this entirely, but they sure have tried and made some headway. That is what makes programming by objective pointless. What is the point of buying into something that is working against you? Also this so called added functionality really doesn't amount to much apart from security problems, especially when they build in many needless barriers. Do you think any customers want this? Of course not.

ASP is beside the point it is IIS that is the main thing he should be avoiding.

Regarding PHP, yes it is very scrappy. PHP!=ASP. But it good enough for basic web based stuff. There are plenty of other things out there that you can use ruby, java, the list is endless.