The Dino-Aspie Ex-Café (for Those 40+... or feeling creaky)

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Oh my. Do you know if it ever got conserved?

Don't know the name of that river, Postie. Was too long ago and it rings no bells. But gramps never really traveled much more than 20 miles away from where he was born. I think he might have gone to NYC once in his life. Was at Lakehurst (Lyndhurst?) when the zepplin crashed, was an extra in a silent western filmed by Edison. Used to drive a wagon pulled by horses/mules "into the city" to deliver milk. I don't think "the city" was outside of Jersey.

So wherever Route 46 and Route 80 cross near the Passaic River, that would be the center of the 20 miles radius, I think. And I'm pretty sure it wouldn't have been more than 10 miles from there. Probably much fewer, where he got those.

Last edited by Nan on 09 Oct 2007, 4:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ok when it comes to typology there are some basics, but there never is two things exactly a like. That the shape and size, material and everything about them has variables, but still fits into a known class. What you drew still would fit into the full grooved axe, just fine. They didn't "chip" axes. In Eurpoe they did in some cases. A few rare exceptions here, but I talking really really rare. So you wouldn't see flake scares, what you might see, is little "pock marks" or peck marks, the impact of the shaping of it using a smaller hammer stone. If you were to see anything resembling flake scares, they would most likely be on the poll or the blade. If on the poll (the ass end) it might indicate a use. The blade scare would just be simple wear (impact fracture) and wear can show up as "polish" as well. Being in a plow zone it's likely there would be plow damage as well. Easy to tell because the patina isn't the same as the rest of the object. Axes aren't all the big, I have several that are amazingly small. I'll see if I can give you a rough date on it, if I can ever find my books in this mess. Off the top of my head I would say you're easily into the 5000BC range give or take 1000, need books to get closer. I can think of an exception, but I'm not horribly sure that culture made it that far to the east. My guess is you're in possession of an early archaic possibly pre-archaic but that is stretching it, not much known about that time. I would have to see the point types to pin it, even if it was of a mixed culture site, it could be done. I have seen axes like this not terribly far to the east of there, I think, the mind gets foggier on this stuff the further I have gotten out of it.

Preserved? Well it supposedly was padded to keep the machinery and the pipe from damaging it, but that's ify at best. You get use to it, you never like it and it makes you mad. Nothing you can really do to stop it. Thats what contract arch is all about, get it out of there if you can, it will be destroyed if you don't. Learn from it and take care of what you found. Once in a huge while you find something that they just can't ignore and it is saved, but that isn't often. I can't count how many times the huge earth movers were on top of us as we stuck it out till the very end trying to get things out of the way.

Last edited by postpaleo on 09 Oct 2007, 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Nan,my grandfather gave me something that looked similiar to your drawing.He was from Carlinville Illinois but I dont know if that is where he found it.Ironically,it is probably in a landfill right now because all my stuff was thrown out when I was evicted,very sad,as it was one of the few things I had to remember him.He also had a clay eagle head ,probably broken off from some kind of potery.They were two of my "prized possessions".


The cat was 16 years old and had been acting strange the past two days.Normal for it was hissing like the anti-christ when you came near the cage and lunging towards you.The past few days it had stopped this behavior and seemed more deoressed then scared(it had been there over a week).We figured it was getting used to us,but now I do wonder.The latchs are not cat or dog proof and both have gotten out.We have sort of clip to put on them,after we notice that they can open them,not before.Regaurdless,I should have notified my manager when I got to work and saw it's condition,not worried about some assistant manager getting mad at me for going over their heads...it was stuipid of me and I regret it.What really worries me is if my memory is so bad,that I didnt chech the door carefully enough after closing.It's a little depressing to think,even a job scooping animal feces is to "complicated" for me.This too,shall pass.This too,shall pass.

One thing about making mistakes....I dont usually make the same one twice(except in human relations,in which I never seem to "learn")

Illinois different animal out there, now you're into the mound cultures, very interesting stuff. Later time period then the Archaic.

I used a piece of a design I found off of an Owasco (pre Iroquois) pipe fragment when I designed SwampBloosom and my wedding rings. I didn't find a silver smith to do it justice and the stone I used wasn't good for the wearing of the rings. An Eagle head might possibly have been from a pipe, they had what are known as platform pipes, very unique, very special. That he thought enough of you to give them to you, is really something in itself. Just consider they went back to where they came.

Ok I shut up, you guys should know better then to get an aspie going on an obsession.

Ohmygod, and the kid used to use it's butt end to whack nails into the walls to hang her posters on.

I believe it's going in the china cabinet. Whenever I ever get one.

It is worn very smooth at the blade end. Maybe I put it in with the genealogy stuff. That's easier to get to. Will have to dig this out now. Hope it's in there, because otherwise it's in the 10'x10' store room that has all the furniture and at least 4 dozen boxes of books, all identical with all the boxes that have the household stuff in them, in there. {sigh}

Now see that is funny, because they did too. It's like using a butter knife to whack the lid of a stuck jar top or use it to screw a screw in. You pick up what ever is handy that does the job. It makes for some problems when doing analysis, lol. You know damn well the object started out being a projectile point and it ends up being used for something totally different. Waste not want not. Even the debitage was used, I mean what the hell, the waste still cut and if it was handy, use it. There is good that comes from being lazy. Why in hell would you take the 20 minutes to make a knife when you could just as easily whack off a flake and get the job done in less then 10 seconds. My esteem of those that were here before us is very high.

That is probably what primal man used for surgeries, flint flakes when a larger blade would be too clumsy.
I often wondered what the ancient Israelites used for circumcisions back in the bronze age.

That is probably what primal man used for surgeries, flint flakes when a larger blade would be too clumsy.
I often wondered what the ancient Israelites used for circumcisions back in the bronze age.[/quote]

Have you ever seen the microscopic view of an obsidian flake edge vs a metal? Don't know what became of Janis Cross, other then she got her PHD and moved to Israel, she was doing obsidian analysis on an island in the Med. We had a long talk one night and the pro's she was with there were all into the high points, the flakes were garbage to them. She hadn't heard of obsidian hydration. Don't think she got a chance to do it. They get fussy about what can leave a country. Her expertise for her PHD was dead languages, married an astronomer and lord know what those two are up to now. But she would know. Can't track her down on the net

Hi Krex. After reading and re-reading your above post (I omitted some of what you said for the sake
of brevity and my point could be made without it) I can see some connections between how you were treated in school and how you are now being treated at work. When you tried to help your classmates, your teachers reprimanded you for "going over their". Now, you hesitate to act in ways that other's (managers and assistant manager) will interpret as "going over their heads". It's a real Catch 22 that authority figures have got you caught up in. Especially because it's evident that you are totally capable of acting in the best interest of your workplace and the animals. Worrying about going against the call of the assistant manager and stepping on toes. It's got you immobilized and that's what they want. This way they can whisper about you. A very rude pastime for that type of mentality. Two or more people whispering in front of another is a way of bullying and crazy-making, especially when you know if you called them on it they would deny they were whispering about you. I've been there too many times not to know that this kind of behavior by "them" is vile and evil.

I am touched by your situation because it is so unfair, and because I can so readily identify with it.
I never had allies at work either, and when I knew something was moving in the wrong direction, I had to keep my mouth shut because of not stepping on toes. It's a system designed to keep you in your place and it stinks worse than the poop you scoop.



They tolerate you because you are not like them, you are superior to them and they know it. The hostile vibe is something else I can identify with and I pick up on those vibes extremely well. Trouble is, when you point out to someone that you feel hostile vibes, they will invariably deny that it's coming from them. The real trouble is, in your case, and mine when I was working, you can't call them like you see them and tell them to f**k off. They know that you need your job and they can treat you like s**t and you must endure it. But, my point is Krex, even if you did lose your job over this, which you probably won't, you will simply find another one. Well, maybe not simply, but you will find another one. They, poor, evil s**ts that they are, are doomed to go on being their ugly f*****g selves for the rest of their lives. Most likely. There are interventions and some wake up.

Fortunately for me, don't mean to rub it in, I no longer have to take s**t from people, when they mess with me I can tell them to f**k off and then I just scratch them off my list of credible, decent human beings. Yes, they will have their allies, they will conspire and twist reality and refuse to see the true picture so they can look at themselves in the mirror. I don't mind being labeled a b***h or even a crazy b***h. It's a priviledge that comes along with growing older.

Don't be so hard on your self, this too will pass.

CC, I wish you were my neighbour!

Thank you CC.

I grew up with a mom who would tell me to quit judging those people.I was either being paranoid or "holier then thou" if I pointed out what they were doing,so I have learned to doubt myself.Your words and validifying my impressions of the situations does help.

But I am your neighbor, Lauri. And I'm only a click away. How's your freak flag flyin'?

ADD. This is the type most often seen in women, but the type that I also have. It is often overlooked, because you aren't hyperactively running around drawing attention to yourself and bothering people. You are in the back of the school room quietly lost in the thoughts in your head, and nobody knows that you are doing it. Unless they call on you and you do not respond. Or the teacher walks around the room during math class, and you have the history book from 2 hours ago still on your desk.

A typical ADD scene: Nan is staring blankly, lost in thought. Chuck walks up to her and starts talking to her, sees the blank stare, waves his hand in front of her eyes. Nan "comes to" offers a smile as a recovery mechanism, hopes that smooths things over, hopes she has not just been asked something she hasn't heard, tries to read Chuck's face for clues. Chuck asks, "Well?" Nan realizes that Chuck has asked something. Just exactly what, she has no clue. She apologizes and asks him to repeat the question, embarrassed because this happens all the time. Chuck goes back into his overlong blatherings, and soon it is just blah, blah blah.... and Nan is off inside the thoughts in her head again. So they say you are "spacey/loopy". Actually, the thing is, you are attracted to the most interesting thing at any given moment and lock on to that. Quite often it is the thoughts inside your own head. And you lock on so tightly you may not hear sirens or anything.

Because your brain with ADD is "attracted to the most interesting thing at any given moment", you head into the kitchen meaning to get yourself a bowl of ice cream, but pass a window where you see a fire raging a block away. You watch the fire, and decide you had better go get your car keys in case you have to leave, you head back upstairs, searching for your car keys, whereupon you find the book you have been meaning to read. You start reading the book, which has a picture of ice cream in it. You remember you wanted some, and wonder what happened to prevent you from getting it. So, you head to the kitchen for some ice cream...

CC, You have no idea how much that means to me, especially today!! Thank you, thank you, thank you! My freak flag is flying at half mast.

Oh yeah. I have gotten and still get that "holier than thou" crap whenever I attempt to unveil an injustice.

"Nothing disturbs the clergy more than discovering they have a saint in the congregation". Can't remember who said that, but it's so true.

Take away the religiosity of that quote if you like, and use any nouns that fit the situation, it's all one and the same.

Nothing disturbs a group of stinkbugs more than discovering Coco Chanel in their midst.