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Lil
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01 Feb 2007, 7:38 pm

I am a nearly, or maybe really, old person. I have always been out of sync with others socially. I guess I would call myself socally inept. I have a letter the teacher wrote my mother lamenting my shyness. Never changed. I wouldn't really guess that us oldsters could be really diagnosed with Aspergers and don't know what good it would do anyway. Yet, recently I read of a book by someone or about someone (don't remember the book or author, perhaps someone does) and the protagonist said that she 'used a script for social interractions and that it exhausted her'. This is me. Can you believe that I thought no one had learned to deal in such a bizarre way. I am retired now and pretty much avoid other people so I don't have the stress anymore. Perhaps, others are finding that they are not alone and won't end up like me.



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01 Feb 2007, 7:53 pm

Hi Lil & welcome to WP. I hope you find some insights on the website.

I've never been diagnosed with AS either, but I am pretty convinced that I have it. I'm not sure it was a condition that was particularly recognised when I was a kid, and like you I'm not sure what good it could do now. Having said that, I tried once to get some action by my GP, but he just wasn't having it.

I live by learnt rules (or I guess a script) and yes it can be exhausting and stressful. As a teenager I took a lot of flak and ridicule for my bizarre behaviour, but I've learnt how to cope better over the years. In fact I can now usually pass as NT (neurotypical or "normal", though I hate to use the word), but it still doesn't make it any less tiring.

Once again, welcome :)



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01 Feb 2007, 8:15 pm

Welcome to WP!

Tim


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MrMark
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01 Feb 2007, 8:16 pm

Hi Lil, I'm Mark. Welcome to the Wrong Planet. I'm over 40 so I'm almost old too.


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killer_cupcake
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01 Feb 2007, 9:17 pm

I'm curious, Lil; is it a relief to fit yourself into the world of AS (or however you'd like to see your discovery) or does it not make much difference? And I don't mean that in any way as an offence, I am just curious as to what it feels like to have found a description of something you thought was entirely your own way of thinking after all these years.



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01 Feb 2007, 10:07 pm

Welcome to WP! I am 42 years old, so I am on the older end of the spectrum here.



Starr
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02 Feb 2007, 6:03 am

Hello Lil,

Glad you found us. I'm getting on a bit too :lol: and found out about AS only a few years ago after 40+ years of pretending to be an NT. What a relief to drop that act!

Welcome to WP.

Do you have any hobbies/interests?



BubbaHoTep
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02 Feb 2007, 7:30 am

Greetings Lil. I'm still south of 40, but it's fast approaching. I like your 'used a script for social interractions and that it exhausted her' analogy. Over the years I've built up an internal wikipedia of appropriate things to do and/or say in particular social situations so that I can pass for NT. However, as others have said, socializing is very hard work and mentally draining and I don't enjoy it very much.

When did you find out about AS?



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02 Feb 2007, 8:25 am

Greetings, and welcome to WP. How old are you? I'm 50, and only realized last year that I'm ASpic. We have quite the age range on this website, so don't feel left out...


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bookwerm
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02 Feb 2007, 3:02 pm

I am 43, and have felt the "odd duck" for my entire concious life..
never seem to act the way I was supposed to act, so many behaviours that were odd that, once I found this website, info on AS etc. that so matched me, that it was rapidly apparent that such commonality was more than coincidental.

Mostly I have been "loud" or talking too much, being a "know it all", not really knowing how to play those reindeer games and the like.

My 4th grade teacher thought my behavior odd enough to warrant meeting with school psych in Ann Arbor about 1973, but that far predated AS being defined.. they sent me to a summer camp with other odd ball boys hoping the extra "socialization" would fix me! yep, sure worked, I am 100% normal, excelllent use of taxpayer money (and my poor parents!). NOT.

My dad is likely AS, had "hated" me (his words) due to my being like himself, and that plus all the extra fun bullying easily found in 70s midwest era (PRE anti bullying policy) really made my life a joy.

Thankfully I did find that being a very smart person, per standardized testing and the like, at least gave me something where I was not a total loser.

I did not think I was AS person even after seeing the character on Boston Legal, a USA tv show.. but then I saw the movie, and read up on it .. and once I took the various questionaires online it was apparent that my matching so many of the behaviors was more than coincidental.

Anyone who reaches our advanced age has adapted and modified themselves so much that comparing to the "virgin" definition of someone with AS can be misleading.. more appropriate is to think back to what you were like when young and not adapted..

for instance, my voice now has emotion and tone.. but if caught unaware I sound like a robot. When talking with friends in conversation I sound mostly normal, barring interuppting and talking too loud.. but if someone has question.. I am professor and have every answer in very formal voice. Unnoticed by me.. noticed and mentioned by wife now that she is aware of AS and me.

She thankfully is teacher for young kids, has had AS kids (pre diagnosis) and well knows the little professor personality. She has her own issues but we seem to match up well. It has helped her so much to know that when I appear to be arbitrarily difficult I am as much a victim of my reactions as she is. So again, having some clue means I can now access the pool of knowledge for the general AS folks, and not my own unique "i am uniquely f****d up what to do what to do" pool of knowledge which I am sure is much smaller.

My main manifestations at this late age of AS are still having to ask questions in meetings, correct bosses mistakes publicly, being a picky eater, liking toknow the "plan" for the day even if that IS no plan, and a myriad of other idiosyncrasies that, goodness, are wholly consistent with AS. That consistency is a positive, as now I can build on what others have done and learned! And I feel less alone.

I still am stupid at times and argue for no rational reason about silly things that seem to be important at the time.. I have done by observation and intellect what others do naturally.. but if it looks similar enough, well, one blends in.

I still walk oddly, and was surprised that something others commented on is apparently typical of AS.. like my knees are bad or something.

And I want to study the hell out of anything, have a hard time doing something I am supposed to do but don't want to do, like enter in my reason for releasing satellite hardware drawings into a database for accountablity... got behind and now it is some huge tasks that has me typing this instead. Really, I am supposed to be doing NEW work for the same thing but again, I get distracted.. My wife and I say "saw something blue!" as for some reason things that are blue catch my eye and it is my fave color haha.

Some of you folks talk about "dropping the act" but after so many years, I AM the act.. hmmm and not like I get to go live on a planet with you all beyond cyberspace.. so no, I still can't drop the act.. but at least now I feel like I am not just an individual failure, I have company! so heartwarming.

There has been a lot of cognitive dissonance for me with all this.. how can a fairly smart "normal" fellow have so much trouble with simple things! Why do I talk in a meeting when I tell myself NOT to do so? one minute of inattention and bing bang boom I am noticed by correcting the CEO. Thankfully they mostly think that I am (I guess!) annoying but very smart and worth keeping around.. Now, with awareness that AS IS applicable to me, not just some hand flapping guy on boston Legal (I do doodle, twiddle my fingers, bite my nails, etc. but heaven forbid I flap my hands, that is completely different... NOT), it does help.

well, per expression of AS, I have entirely overwritten and now must apologize for my lengthy diatribe.

T


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BazzaMcKenzie
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02 Feb 2007, 4:40 pm

Hi & welcome


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03 Feb 2007, 3:20 pm

HI! I am 53, and like so many of our mouldy oldies I have foundhow to live in the realm of the normal. Not that I can claim that i am fluent in normalacy, but I make it. people still consider me to be an odd duck, but some actually like me! And I like them too! Welcome!



jonrkc
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04 Feb 2007, 12:24 pm

I was born in 1940, and became 67 a week and a day ago as I write this. I'm self-diagnosed and have no doubt whatever I'd get a formal diagnosis if I applied for one. I scored 38 recently on the online test that gives a pretty good indication if you're Asperger material; the cutoff for NT's being 16. I answered with complete honesty, too.

I wouldn't say I'm overjoyed to consider myself an aspie, as I don't get overjoyed by anything (another story for another time). But I am very glad to have found a name, and a community, for the way I've felt and behaved all my life; I never even considered it very odd, but I did consider NT's to be odd, and still do, quite often. Hence I really do feel I'm living on the wrong planet!

I first learned about Asperger Syndrome when I saw a "Nova" TV special about the syndrome years ago; it dealt with a summer camp for aspie teens, where they could be in a safe place immune to the bullying and ridicule that they often suffered at school. I *instantly* identified with those teens, even though I was in my 50's when I saw the show. I didn't really think about applying the name to my own makeup, though, for a long time. Not sure why.

There have only been two groups in my entire life I've felt comfortable in, and I've dropped out quickly from every other group I've tried. The first comfortable group was Alcoholics Anonymous, whose members helped me quit drinking in 1986. I was killing myself with alcohol and simply cannot drink it because my compulsive personality leads me to drink till I'm sick or unconscious just about every time, and that meant every day after work in those days.

The second group is the widespread and generally disorganized universe of Asperger Syndrome people; I am not fond of the term "aspie" but am trying to make myself use it because it seems widely accepted now. For instance, I feel very much at home on these forums. Sometimes I feel it could just as well be me writing, or making a video about daily life.

This is one of the nicest things that has happened to me in many years--finding a group of people I can identify with, not just in terms of shared interests, but in a deeper sense of how I, and we, feel about things in our daily existence, and what we have to put up with--and also the benefits that come along with AS. Because for a lot of us, there are good things as well as nuisances about being in this condition.

I'm glad older visitors here have posted so much, and I hope it continues! And I find myself loving total strangers here who, regardless of their age, whether it be 13 or 80, express what I've felt all my life and not had anyone to share it with.

I'm so glad Alex started this site. Thanks again, Alex. You'll never know how much good you have done.



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04 Feb 2007, 12:56 pm

To some extent i too habe become the act.
I read a short story years ago, a fantasy with a very mean spirit, in which a witch has repeatedly cursed one person. He had been a trouble to her so many times, and each time she hit him with a "frog curse". yes, and after so many of these, he became somewhat froggie even when not cursed. Like he is sitting in a pub with pals when suddenly he shoots out his tongue and nails a fly on the window.
I have accepted something of an NT curse for sure.
But some of this personal NT emulation is not so set in stone. I determined about a year ago that even if people around me look at me for so doing, that i will no lonnger attempt not to move my mouth when alone and talking to myself. there are a few other things too.
This frog arises!



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20 Feb 2007, 3:26 pm

I am 60, I am, and have always been, perfect. Being above it all I have looked down on the world in amusement. What we have here is a twenty-five watt bulb with a hundred watt darkness. Being dim bulbs humanity has to feel their way along, with lots of touching, and group identity social rituals. Without the constant social markers they quickly become disoriented and start coming apart.

They are primitive and insecure. without dancing like bees entering the hive, body language, or meaningless verbal exchanges, small talk, they cannot function. They quickly go into hyper danceing, and verbalizing, and if this does not get an affirming response, they become angry, threatening, and when I move to the side of them, my own dance, making eye contact with their feet, watching as they try to pivot and face me, becoming unbalanced, as they are, seeing the strange and non hive way I move, they flee.

While trying to coverup and protect myself from a school bully I accidently scratched his cornea with my finger nail. As he was the class bully, and I the nurd, I apoligised, but was once again rejected, he refused to bully me after that. Bruce Lee called the move a Dragon searching for Pearls. Humans are mostly hands and eyes, any move to the eye will be defended, and that leaves the neck open, push button one, then button two, and when they regain their wits, be standing behind them smiling. If they turn, the weight moves to one leg, and a small foot push to the back of the knee topples them.

No human is worthless, a very nice drum can be made from the hide.

All childhood is one long trama, no one is spared. The only thing worse is being a teenager. Family abuse, school abuse, and self abuse, combine, and the learning of the dance steps, the senseless chitchat is tiring. Instead of joining a larger world, the teen years impose walls, everyone you know is in the Ninth Grade. Can you think of a worse hell?

Being a young adult is no fun, Get a job, pick a major, and the social pressure to get married, have children, join the army, spend money, more than you ever had, now every symester. I hear whining from the AS, but at least some of you can pass math. Pushed out of home, what that dysfunctional group of defectives calls family, suddenly changing from, If you do not go to school the Truent Officer will come with the Police and take you, to You have to pay the price of a really cool car to the State if you want an education. Unless you are rich, Freshmen girls are working the Seniors, you have no chance, no one wants you, except McDonalds.

If you make it through, you have long had the desire to learn ripped out by education, all you want is a sheet of paper, for four years of your life, many thousands of dollars, and having all of the youth and life, all of the joy, smashed while you are forced to watch and smile. Now you are prepared to go to work.

Work is more demeaning than school, they only threaten to flunk you at the end of the year, at work they can have you clean out your desk, with the Security Guard watching, and out of the building in ten minutes. This is called job security. Friends at work are people who want to get to know all about you, so they can make sure you never get a promotion.

People who do not want to work are called mothers, their ticket is to start a family. For an hour's work they become set for life. It happens, and like grammer school, if you do not pay for it, the Sex Police come and put you in jail, so you cannot work, so you cannot pay for it, so you can be sent to jail. Some people prefer jail, it is just like home, the people who run it do not like you, but they feed you, and you can spend your days reading.

If you do pay, work two jobs, and save to buy a house, which now start at something the size of a phone number, the government notices you, and they send two guys in suits, named Vito and Guido to tell you the Don needs your help. Pay them, for they have nothing else to do. By the time you see daylight again you will be fifty, and send your own kids to college, with a smile, knowing what lays before them.

Now you can plan for your retirment. If you put away $100,000 a year, the interest will pay for the insurance, utilities, taxes, medical insurance, and all the dog food you can eat. As you only make $54,000, and you are being pushed out, you might become a greeter at Walmart, or go back to McDonalds. You discover that if unemployed, all that Social Security you paid evaporates. Your best finicial plan is to sell everything, buy a trailer, and live with a close packed cluster of others who retire. I hope you like horse shoes.

This is the NT world you are trying to enter?

AS is a long childhood, I was a teenager for thirty years, like all teens I was rejected, insulted, and the earthquake of 1343 that hit North China blamed on me. Like all teens, I apoligised, and the next quake hit Lisbon. They tired of listing my faults. If only I had become a mass murderer, someone people like, girls marry, but not liking people, I could not stand the involvment.

No one liked me, so I at least have that to be thankful for. I just hung out with machines, talked to them, and myself, and as I had a large wrench, not needed, the 12" Crescent is only for tightening the nuts on a human, I had a fairly peaceful life. Humans are sure they do not need to be fixed, but will pay well to get machines fixed, and as my material needs were low, I did well.

To me machines are pure logic, like computers, on/off is all, but people, being educated, are too complex to understand logic. I went from fixing cars, to being an IT Professional, cars are complex, IT is one step from nothing. All my tools fit in a brief case.

I made things, mostly one off, and thought I should make something I could sell thousands of copies of. I Patented a system of teaching Mathematics. Being me, in a world that finds math daunting, I chose the company motto, "Simple ideas, from simple minds." That has gotten a reaction I truly do not understand. What I mean is like Elegant Code.

The reaction was I was being culturally insensitive to myself. I am, but who cares.

Now all of the world I have known is fast fading, I have spent twenty years building myself, and the world is catching up. IT and machines are merging, they are becoming like me. Being a strange old guy is expected, gettting dropped by a nurd is nothing compared to being beatup by a Senior Citizen. It is my world now.

I was going to spread hell and discord, traditional business, but now that I have discovered WP, I see how to do it at a higher level.

Lil, you are free now, there are thousands like you, and you sparked one of the livest forums I have seen. Here you lead, but some of the coolest people are in their teens. I am sure they watch the old folks sit and talk about the weather.



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20 Feb 2007, 3:50 pm

This might be a good time to mention that Paolo is proposing a forum for more senior members to discuss issues which may be particularly relevant to older people on the AS spectrum. Please add your support to this thread if you feel such a forum would be welcome :-

http://www.wrongplanet.net/modules.php? ... ht=#463929