Hi, from the other end of the spectrum

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Hi, everyone. I hope it's ok for me to post here.

I'm Lilin, for the purposes of forums, and I'm here to learn a bit more about AS, from the side of what is considered to be the extreme end of empathy. I'm dating a man with AS, and I'm an empathic hyper-sensitive personality type, or "magic," as he calls it.

I think, in some ways, that makes it easier for me than it would be for most NT's. I understand empathy means nothing about caring. I understand external expression means nothing about internal feeling. I also really, really understand the need for alone time, and needing to limit sensory input (I have sensory integration issues, which are common to both HSP's as well as autistic people).

But perhaps what is harder for me than for people somewhere else on the empathy spectrum is that I am less sure how to conduct myself (empathy also means nothing about self-awareness!). As you might imagine, I am someone who relies a lot on subtly. And since all people tend to assume others do things in similar ways to how they do, I am verbally shy, because even though I know intellectually it's not true, I assume other people can read me as easily as I read them.

Obviously a potential landmine with someone who needs to have things verbally communicated to them to get it.

He's very good about asking me exactly what he needs to know -- funny enough, one of the most communicative people I've ever dated. He's said he has a particular liking for the empathic types, and a couple of his good friends are like me as well. So, perhaps he comes prepared. But it'd be better if I was more up to par myself.

There's a sense of uncertainty to me, when I can't make the heart of the relationship a series of relatively subtle communications of feeling that I'm sure make little to no sense to someone with AS. I don't know how to build it, or with what. What is the heart of a meaningful relationship to someone with AS?

I hope that makes some sort of sense. Anyway, I've rambled enough, and thanks for having me.

Welcome:)

From a communication perspective it might be difficult, it can be like learning a different language.
Speaking as honestly/directly/concisely as possible when the topic is important... No extra words to soften your meaning or shield your true feelings, it's a vulnerable experience but like learning any language with practice it feels more natural.

Thanks! Yes, that's what I gather, which is definitely different for me. But makes me feel less self-conscious in a way.

Well, to me a meaningful relationship (not only romantic kind) is all about:
1. Acceptance. No need to play games or pretend to be someone you are not because "it would be polite". I am myself next to you and I expect you to be yourself next to me. We may avoid the subjects we disagree on but we don't pretend anything.
2. Honesty. If something about you is bothering me, I will tell you and I expect you to do the same to me. This makes me feel safe.
3. Focus. If I value my relationship with you, you will have my focus. I will carefully listen to everything you tell me and do my best about it. This is my way of showing that I care.
4. Loyality. Does it need explanation?

But it's just me, everyone is different, esp. on the spectrum

BTW, my psychologist says I'm AS and HSP at the same time, so I share something with both of you

Thanks. I think these things are probably fairly common to want, but the difference is perhaps in the way it's portrayed.

I assume it's very strange for NT people to try to portray these things using subtle cues to someone with AS who can't see them, or is overwhelmed by them to the point where the end result is essentially the same, and can cause a sense of insecurity or not knowing where they stand. I know it is, actually. I've already made a mental note that I have to tell him what the intent of my statement is when I point out something interesting I notice about him (this is just something I do -- people are my thing -- but he understandably sometimes assumes these are judgemental statements, because I'm sure they often have been in the past). Saying, "that's interesting/unique/etc" helps clear away that uncertainty.

I feel a similar sense of uncertainty when there's not very many cues for me to pick up on, if that makes sense? When face reading doesn't offer me a ton (he does the big expressions, less so the small ones), when the tonal range is a bit more condensed, and although he is a very affectionate person, it has a different feel to it. The way I explained it to him was, I imagine it's what affection would be like if you completely wiped someone's mind of everything they knew about the expectation of how to touch or be. Like a tabula rasa.

And that's not a negative statement, or something I can't get anything out of. But it's very different for me, and leaves me a little less certain that I know what's going on in his mind than I would be with most people. The more I think about it, the more that seems weird. If anything, someone who expresses themselves in an utterly pure way is telling me much more about how they feel than someone whose expression is substantially altered by their social training. But at the same time, it makes me feel that I know less about how he feels about me. NT people express their focus and their loyalty by augmenting their subtle behavior in a way they hope you'll like. With NT people, that hedging of their words to be less direct if they sense they might sting is actually how they show they care! And I feel I know less about how to know when he cares than I would with an NT person.

But of course, I am someone who feels blind and paralyzed if I'm even just having an off-day from being tired that causes me miss some tiny irrelevant thing here or there. So my barometer of how much I feel I need to know about someone to feel secure is probably uniquely high.

I guess what all this rambling boils down to is: how do I know when an AS person cares and wants to do the things on that list? What is the thing I can look at to feel that? I'm looking for that sense of connection and understanding, and what set of goggles I need to be looking out of to see that with an AS person.

Welcome to Wrong Planet!