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charcoalsketches
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22 Dec 2014, 12:30 pm

Perhaps, I am not the only one who has went through this, but I really need to talk about this: what is going on with some of the teachers today?

You know the teachers who fill in the high majority of the time sharing stories and anecdotes that only loosely, if ever, have anything to do with the subject matter. At the end of the day, you walk away learning nothing that you are supposed to. No use of books, boards or anything important.

What's up with that?


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VIDEODROME
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23 Dec 2014, 1:52 am

Most teachers I had shared anecdotes that I thought were relevant.

I did have one lazy teacher who just read power point slides to us who was so horribly boring. I was getting mad and badly wanted to hack his computer. He was teaching Networking Fundamentals and I wanted to confront him directly on the subject and see if he could stop me.



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23 Dec 2014, 7:26 pm

This may be pessimistic but in my experience it seems true. Teachers have come to learn that in this day and age most students don't care and will just cheat their way through any test. Same goes for college. The majority of students spend the period on their smartphones, and cut class whenever there is a test or presentation. So, teachers put in less effort.

I have the same experience. In classes I am required to take to get a high school diploma my teachers do not actually teach. More than half of my classes have been yawn-fests of the teachers listing off random factoids or whittling away the period because they know they have no lesson plans or no one is paying attention. We are in a ""top-ranked"" district, but that is only because of the extremely rich parents who get their kids tutored all the time.
They only ever actually do something that resembles their job descriptions when they are being evaluated by their bosses. If they did surprise evaluations they'd have to fire almost all of the teachers...


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23 Dec 2014, 7:35 pm

I've never understood teachers who don't teach. Unfortunately I had one in my final year of college. As a result, my course work was either crap, or just not done at all. Miraculously though, I still passed the unit.

I have had other teachers who don't do things in the more formal way (sticking to the syllabus, books etc), but usually the stories they tell are highly relevant and interesting.

There are also times when the class involves 'Look it up on the internet'. I really don't like that.



zer0netgain
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24 Dec 2014, 4:23 am

In the USA, the education system has become more about preparing a kid to pass a standardized test rather than teaching them stuff and critical thinking skills.

Most teachers just give up and go with the flow because they have student loans to repay.



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24 Dec 2014, 9:48 am

Happens mostly where I live. Teachers would either leave us something to write from the board or pointing which page on the book; or the more lazier way of photo copying the notes.
Teaching critical thinking is almost nonexistent until somewhere at college, that is if you got lucky picking the right school, with the right teacher on the right place regardless of it's reputation.

But it's not the teacher from where I'm from being the problem tho, but the students and parents not caring at all; they just teach on the standardized test, get a diploma, then get on with it. People here just want to get a job and be done with it. The diploma only gives them more chances and more jobs available. To them, ambition is EXPENSIVE. That's why K to 12 implementation here is quite reluctant.

The rich ones on the other hand prefer studying abroad, if not, only at private schools or any schools/colleges/universities with high reputation. It's not the knowledge itself tho, but bragging the diploma showing where they studied. If not the 'bragging rights', they're forced to because of their family businesses. The rich ones here rarely gets to choose the course they want or what they aspired to.


To the real topic:
With students being lazy, then graduating so easily, what would happen if they become teachers themselves? Then there's this cycle...

zer0netgain wrote:
In the USA, the education system has become more about preparing a kid to pass a standardized test rather than teaching them stuff and critical thinking skills.


Indeed. It's the same here too, mostly at elementary to high school.


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25 Dec 2014, 10:50 am

I have mixed feelings about the stories. If an instructor is giving people a little extra information on how degaussing works when the subject is computers, that's not necessarily something you're going to do in the workplace yourself but contributes to your knowledge of the subject at hand. I'd rather have someone who'll help me obtain a general comfort and understanding than someone who's training me to jump on command like a circus animal. If it's a substitute giggling about the exam she's taking soon while students are trying to alert her to a problem with the coursework, not so much (I still pray she failed; I helped students more than she did).



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26 Dec 2014, 6:37 pm

Being a college professor, I can attest that there exist those who teach for the test only and not for student learning skills. That has been something that has always bothered me, even when I was in college many years ago. I equate it to the teacher shortchanging the student, as they overpaid for what they actually learned in the class. This can and will eventually change when students start demanding more out of their teachers/professors. It is a two way street though. In demanding more out of the teaching, students should also demand more out of themselves when it comes to studying the material being taught. Remember, ultimately you are in control on what you want to learn or not to learn in your college career.

As for my teaching techniques, the first thing I point out to my new students is that you have to earn your grade in my courses. Not paying attention during class does not bother me (as long as it is not disruptive to others), as you are making a choice on what you want to do. My classes are not easy A courses by any means. However, good grades can be earned if one tries hard enough (and masters the required material). It is my job to try to help students along the way. I try to challenge students in their critical thinking skills as I teach them my area of science. Some hate this, some love this. Yes, I occasionally use stories (with an overall important lesson) to get certain points across. In my student evaluations, I have many that like it that way as it is entertaining to them and feels less like a traditional class "lecture" over the material. I employ both PowerPoint and chalk talk in my lectures at the same time. The PPs are for the overall picture of where we are at in the textbook and the chalk talk board is for the finite details that I cover during the class time. For some, I can go very fast through the material, while others say I go too slow. I know I cannot teach everyone perfectly, but I try to do the best that I can with the time available to me to do so. One of the things I have learned about teaching is there is always something that can be done better the next time around...



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29 Dec 2014, 1:32 am

The United States education system is dysfunctional as all hell, and this probably applies to other countries as well. Everyone now has to worry about these really annoying, difficult, and oft-criticized tests, which don't really mean anything.

Barely anyone wants to learn jack s**t anyway. Hell, in a sense, you're taught that you're not even supposed to want to learn, but you have to worry about the typical popularity BS. I mean what kind of message does that send to people? Plus, out-dated 19th century ways of teaching that especially don't work for aspies.

But it's definitely true though. Since no one cares, why bother? I mean education these days means = shoving content in your face. You might like it anyway, but there's no way to really advance your learning because no one else in there cares, and the content is limited anyway for, guess what, a test.



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29 Dec 2014, 9:24 am

QuantumChemist wrote:
Being a college professor, I can attest that there exist those who teach for the test only and not for student learning skills. That has been something that has always bothered me, even when I was in college many years ago. I equate it to the teacher shortchanging the student, as they overpaid for what they actually learned in the class. This can and will eventually change when students start demanding more out of their teachers/professors. It is a two way street though. In demanding more out of the teaching, students should also demand more out of themselves when it comes to studying the material being taught. Remember, ultimately you are in control on what you want to learn or not to learn in your college career.

As for my teaching techniques, the first thing I point out to my new students is that you have to earn your grade in my courses. Not paying attention during class does not bother me (as long as it is not disruptive to others), as you are making a choice on what you want to do. My classes are not easy A courses by any means. However, good grades can be earned if one tries hard enough (and masters the required material). It is my job to try to help students along the way. I try to challenge students in their critical thinking skills as I teach them my area of science. Some hate this, some love this.

:lol:
When I returned to school as part of a program at work, there was a small group of students who kept complaining and petitioning to the school about how 'horrible' a couple of our professors were. They felt that they put in the work but didn't get satisfaction from the class and blamed the teachers for it. Strangely, the teachers they complained about were my favorites. It was clear they just didn't grasp the topics (Philosophy was one course in particular I remember). I, and another student, got our teacher off on a discussion of dystopian literature, as an illustration of some of the concepts we were discussing. For those people in class who had read any of those books or seen any of their movies, it was a good way to provide perspective and additional context, but, it was one thing they complained about... that he was 'babbling' about something that wasn't even on the course reading list.
Another complaint came during our ancient history class, when I started discussing etymology with the professor and he was kind enough to trace some words and their changes across migratory paths. It was fascinating. They actually complained under their breaths the whole time. But, again, for those students in the class who studied language, it was a great way to add depth to the learning and help us remember.

Those students didn't make it to our 'halfway' party (they spent two years together, completing gen ed courses, before we broke off to our individual degrees... I actually only spent about 9 months with them before breaking off, but, as part of the program was still invited back for this celebration).
I think they were just used to complaining about their kids schools and getting everything handed to them on a platter that they expected college to be the same, you show up and do work, you pass... no need to actually comprehend.

But, being as those same people somehow made it into their 40's without comprehending a heliocentric model (this was a long wasted discussion during that same philosophy course as well, but, I didn't complain, I was too busy suppressing incredulity and laughter).



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29 Dec 2014, 1:31 pm

charcoalsketches wrote:
You know the teachers who fill in the high majority of the time sharing stories and anecdotes that only loosely, if ever, have anything to do with the subject matter.


1) It could be that the teacher is unprepared and just winging it,

2) It could be that the teacher doesn't have the skills. He or she simply does not have the skills to present material in an organized fashion of step by medium step, including the basics without overly harping on them and getting to the good stuff in a way which makes sense. And regardless of what education courses the teacher took, he or she never really developed these skills in a practical, useful way, or

3) The teacher may be a story / narrative thinker, and think everyone else is, too.

===========

In a speech Temple Grandin said people on the spectrum tend to have one of three preferred thinking styles, with some overlap of course: abstract thinking, verbal logic (what I call story/narrative thinking), and visual thinking. This is such a good idea I think this might apply to people in general!



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30 Dec 2014, 1:35 pm

Sorry for the rant in advance, but I think it needs to be said:

I have noticed that it seems that many of the incoming college students are so unprepared for the world we live in. What I mean is that they do not see the big picture of what college is for: to prepare you for your potential career outside of school. Rather than to mentally challenge themselves, many avoid "hard" classes because it may lower their overall GPA if they happen to do bad. It is as if they believe having a high GPA will instantly give you a great-paying job at graduation, but alas it does not. What good is a high GPA if you never learned what you needed to for your career? I realize that even when I went to college as a student, many thought college as a place to party rather than study. However, the economic times have changed to a point that just having a Bachelor's, Masters or PhD in certain areas will not lock you into a good job anymore. I would think that more students would take that as a sign that they need to pick the right careers and prepare for it as best they can in college to get where they want to be. For those that have their future planned out by taking the "hard route" in school, it will pay off with enough hard work and the right choices. Sometimes others might make fun of you for this, but remember it is your life to plan on, not theirs.

For those in college or soon to be in college: spend some quality time thinking things over and make sure you will be prepared for the job field when you graduate. If not, you need to change your path of study while you still can. Employers look into college transcripts to see not only your GPA, but what classes you took while there, to see what can be matched up for what they want in a job opening. If you match up with what they want, you might get the job you applied for. Otherwise, the job you likely end up with will not always be the one you wanted at all...



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30 Dec 2014, 3:12 pm

QuantumChemist wrote:
I have noticed that it seems that many of the incoming college students are so unprepared for the world we live in. What I mean is that they do not see the big picture of what college is for: to prepare you for your potential career outside of school. Rather than to mentally challenge themselves, many avoid "hard" classes because it may lower their overall GPA if they happen to do bad. It is as if they believe having a high GPA will instantly give you a great-paying job at graduation, but alas it does not. What good is a high GPA if you never learned what you needed to for your career? I realize that even when I went to college as a student, many thought college as a place to party rather than study. However, the economic times have changed to a point that just having a Bachelor's, Masters or PhD in certain areas will not lock you into a good job anymore.

:lol:
I only spent one year with pre-career youngsters in college... the other ~5 years I went, it was with working adults. I think they had a sense of entitlement that since they were paying (or their employer was paying) and since they'd 'proven themselves' by having been in the working world for a few years, that they shouldn't have to be held to a higher standard (and, as I mentioned, they already knew that they could get grades or standards changed for their kids if they complained at their schools, so it should work for them at the university level... insane).

It's hard to pick a field of study when you haven't worked yet, I was much more confident in picking my classes when I finished up, because I knew how I could apply it. Too bad high schoolers can't be all given the option of picking apprenticeships to give them context for what they'll study in college.



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30 Dec 2014, 5:17 pm

Yep...I would agree with that. When I went back to college, many of the "adult students" felt that "sense of entitlement." They didn't feel like it was worth the time to do term papers, for example.



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04 Jan 2015, 8:57 pm

VIDEODROME wrote:
Most teachers I had shared anecdotes that I thought were relevant.

I did have one lazy teacher who just read power point slides to us who was so horribly boring. I was getting mad and badly wanted to hack his computer. He was teaching Networking Fundamentals and I wanted to confront him directly on the subject and see if he could stop me.


That sounds like something I would have done... actually I did something similar once. It was in middle school and I didn't like the teacher so I disrupted his powerpoints by causing messages to pop up on his screen. I did it off and on throughout the year, didn't get caught until the second semester and I didn't get caught by him but by another computer teacher


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04 Jan 2015, 9:03 pm

My father is a science teacher and he has been accused many times for having irrelevant anecdotes. I've been in his class and I know that isn't true. He teaches science in far greater detail than required. He also supplements the raw science with the history of science and how different historic scientist worked out the problems they were working on. He even tries to schedule extra labs where he attempts us to replicate historic experiments.

The students complain because he isn't giving them the minimum required for the standardized tests. He worked in both the public highschool and then a private school and teaches at a local university. It's all the same.
He also constantly takes courses in teaching and in the subjects he teaches so that he can improve his skill as a teacher.


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