Any advice on issues with job centre

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I'm UK based so not sure how much member here could help, but hell some support would be something
This is a long story, I'll try to avoid babbling and keep it as short and simple as I can.

I've been unemployed for 3 years - work can be a little challenging for me, but I can hold down jobs long-term and without work I just don't function (my aspie characteristics have become FAR worse since being unemployed). In the 3 years being unemployed I've had the same nonsense from the job centre as most people, but also ZERO support.

A few months back I made the mistake of telling my adviser that I have asperger's syndrome.
I hadn't in the past as I didn't think it was an issue, and as no one asked what problems I was facing, despite my repeatedly telling them I can't do the jobs they make me apply for. The adviser went from telling me to go for my nursing degree and continue applying for managerial jobs for the time being, to telling me I am only capable of working in check-out roles - because seemingly she thinks people with asperger's can't be managers or nurses. As I struggle using a phone she decided this meant I was not doing anything to find work so she was going to force me off job seekers benefit, and onto incapacity. She also told me that she thought I was "mentally incapable of working" purely based on the fact I have asperger's. Understandably I had a meltdown, which was hugely embarrassing.

I had to apply for incapacity - the only way to do this is via telephone, and to get enough 'points' to qualify for this benefit you seemingly have to be both seriously physically and mentally disabled, people constantly get refused even if they are severely disabled, and there are no categories for autism or similar conditions. SOOOOOO...I was denied incapacity and put back on job seekers benefit, so now I'm back dealing with prejudice moronic job centre staff.

I wrote a letter to my local politician relating to the National Autistic Societies Don't Write Me Off campaign.
This campaign is about how people on the spectrum are often unemployed and cannot find support back into work or access benefits, a call for the government to do something about this - I used my experience to explain what sort of issues people like us can face in the system. My local politician didn't address any of the issues I raised (bloody politicians) she just seems to have passed what I wrote straight to the job centre manager, which I suspect will cause greater problems...going by the dirty looks the manager gave me today when I went in.

The job centre manager had written a letter back to my local politician stressing all they had done to 'help' me - government schemes that do more harm than good, such as New Deal where I sat in a room full to bursting of the dregs of society, doing nothing, not being able to apply for work, and which I had to leave a volunteer position and two important college courses to attend. The job centre manager also discussed the issue with the adviser; according to the manager (and the adviser in question) the adviser did not threaten to kick me off job seekers benefit, she did not force me onto incapacity, did not just give me a telephone number scribbled on a scrap of paper and tell me if I was unable to phone them then that was my problem, that I agreed to wanting to work check-out jobs, and she absolutely did not call me 'mentally incapable'. The whole letter I was firmly blamed for being out of work, there was no apology, no suggestions to offer better support, and furthermore they made-out that my meltdown was my being difficult and overly sensitive.

The letter clearly shows what little regard they give me and that they don't take issues such as asperger's seriously, normally when someone writes a complaint you don't turn round and blame them, you address the issues and try to change for the better, I was disgusted by this letter. The job centre staff as far as I'm concerned are prejudice at worst, ignorant at best, they should have had training on how to deal with disabled people, so I'm not sure how they are getting away with this.

I have also just seen a disability adviser...everyone told me how great they are to help you get back into work...the disability adviser at my job centre however doesn't seem to know anything about autism/asperger's, and seemed to be mocking my problems or implying I can't have problems with things such as using a telephone given as I've used telephones in the past. He just really didn't seem to grasp why asperger's causes problems for me in finding work - he just wrote a letter requesting information from my GP and did a quick job search for check-out jobs for me the same as any other job centre staff would.

I'm going to write an official complaint to the job centre, although this letter from the local politician has complicated things slightly, I'm also going to write another letter to the local politician to explain not only my disgust with the job centre but also reiterate the issues I had originally raised about how people on the spectrum get treated when it comes to unemployment/employment and the benefits system.

Any other suggestions for how to deal with them or how to get some sort of support from somewhere?

Note: I LIVE IN THE U.S.

this may play to your advantage, in that they may treat you more formally but also more decently and also actually do their job of taking the steps to finding you good employment


It's outrageous. It's the lies of officialdom which are oh so readily told.

On the other hand, the fact that they are stating that they are not going to move to kick you off job seekers benefits, that they are not going to attempt to force you onto incapacity, that is good news.

I am here in the States. I have been a manager on at least two occasions. The low-level jobs, where you put up with abuse by co-workers and overbearing managers, are more difficult in absolute terms than high-level jobs! That needs to be said again and again and again. At least among ourselves. I was actually a pretty good manager and pretty decent about it. When I fired someone, I decided, brief, decent, informative, and most important was probably brief, because the person sure doesn't want to hear a speech from me.

I wish you all the best with nursing. I think anything in medicine is a good thing. And it's a gift to even consider it.

-----------------------------

During the Cuban Missile Crisis, Khruschev apparently wrote two letters to Kennedy (I think one sent to Bertrand Russell, who had written both on the horrors of war). One concilatory, one hardline. Bobby Kennedy, at least in one movie, argued hard, let's just ignore the one letter and go with the other.

So why not, take the parts you like, roll with them, and just ignore the other things they have said? (I mean, it's a matter of being very strategic)

And in truth, they probably like lording over people less smart than them. And they perceive you as equally smart or critical or 'nonappreciative,' and hard to be 'appreciative when they treat you like this.'

If you're like me, you're probably very smart regarding school skills and ability to analyze things, whether it logically makes sense, whether the practice follows the policy (often it doesn't!) And, if you're like me, you might also have 'patchy' social skills, very good in some areas, not so good in others (and like anything, it's hard to be aware of what you're not aware of!)

Treating them medium formal is probably the best bet.

When I worked at H&R Block, I discovered that I had better customer service skills than my average co-workers. Maybe it was longer, more in depth, more important to get right, and in large part because I took it seriously. For example, I made an effort to inform clients of "cross-collection" of third party bank debt (yes, very serious!). I would underline two lines on the loan application in blue pen (if I had to do it over again, I would not say anything, just underline it and hand it to them. That would be more likely to get a real conversation going.) It just wasn't on people's radar screens. They were concerned whether they could get rapid refund, and the fact that they could potentially lose their entire refund (and because of the crummy bank) just wasn't on their radar screen. I've even talked with CPAs who didn't seem to get it.

I also experimented with "Presidential election fund?" That is, I would streamline the less important parts.

And it occurred to me, it's not about me giving a virtuoso explanation of, say, the Hope Scholarship Credit. But rather asking, "What do you know about the Hope Scholarship Credit," and if they're generally right, roll with that. And the issue that came up again and again was "Is I paid for tuition with a student loan, am I still eligible?" As long as you're otherwise eligible, yes. So, it's noticing things like that.

PS If you're under 30, please consider medical school and becoming a doctor, yeah, the real deal. I think it's a gift to yourself just to consider it. Okay, I see that you're 27. For example, the swine flu, at first it was overhyped, then people decided it was nothing. Well, actually, it is medium serious. Usually nickles and dimes, but occasionally it can cause pneumonia (either direct viral or secondary bacteria). And so, the key thing, if you're having trouble breathing, get help pronto. And there's even a particular pattern, if a child (and presumably adult as well) seems to be recovering and then relapses with high fever, that relapse can be bacterial pneumonia. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/04/healt ... .html?_r=2 Yeah, that one is specific enough that I'll give a reference, and that one is New York Times and Thomas Frieden, maybe not across the board true but at least authoritative.

So, it you tell the patient, 'This should help make you feel better, probably self-limiting. But, if you start having trouble breathing, come back and see me, or call me, and I'll call in a prescription, because that can be pneumonia, okay. Or, if you're getting better, but then relapse with a high fever, that's not so good either. That can also be pneumonia. So, give me a call, okay?' So, you distill down the information, and then try and have a real conversation. And the fact that it doesn't come naturally to those of us with Asperger's, that we have to work on these conversational skills, that can almost play to strength.

I don't think you can expect staff at the job centre to understand aspergers - it's too complicated. I think you'd be better off finding someone who does understand it and talking through your work situation with them, even though they can't help you directly. Then you can go back with more specific requests; maybe you want coaching for interviews, maybe advice on how to get into a specific sector etc. etc.

That's my plan anyway. I'm lucky enough to be on ESA so I don't have to deal with the job centre until I'm prepared.

I'm surprised they made you do group sessions. I told my branch that I couldn't handle crowds and they excused me those bits. That really is poor.

I'd suggest to try everything else to find work but the job center. They never have been helpful here in Germany. Just apply for the jobs that interest you.

My wife isn't on the spectrum and has nothing but trouble from the job centre (Uk) they are very unsupportive, put her down and are generally unhelpful. There are other options for finding jobs and also the job centre can refer you to other companies (though you may of already done those) Have you tried applying for any other disability benefits? Think you can apply for some online. Perhaps you could get a letter from your doctor o anyone else who supports you to back up the fact that you can do te jobs you want and also give some insight into the AS.

Working and this sort of thing really freaks me out which is why I became self employed. I don't earn massive amounts but it's low stress and I enjoy what I do

Or, since you're interested in nursing, go for that. And since the communication is somewhat formalized, you might do rather well at it.

There's just no way I could afford to go to university, particularly not with fees as they are, and it would mean going even longer without money to support my partner and I - as much as I want to go into medicine (I'm not interested in nursing per-say, but health advisor, it's my second choice after doctor - to get onto that career path I'd have to tolerate training in nursing), I don't want to give up on the idea of ever having kids or being able to live with my partner. I have little choice but to get a normal job.

No to applying for other disability benefits - despite being forced onto ESA no one told me anything about it, I'm still clueless as to whether I should have been on it or not, I wish I knew if I could have appealed and stayed on ESA as it would have meant not dealing with these people...but I was scared that ESA might mean no support at all...ironic. Then there really does seem to be no help or allowances made for people on the spectrum - I wish I could do something to change that!

Whenever I try to get support - be it from job centre, online resources, CAB - I seem to hit a brick wall, can't seem to find anywhere to give me advice specific to my problem, which kinda sucks.

Right now the disability adviser is contacting my GP for information - my GP left, I've not seen the same GP more than once since so none know me or the problems I have, all GP's seem clueless about how to deal with the job centre or what information to provide to support the fact that I'm saying I struggle with certain points. Even my medical records would take some sifting through to find relevant information, I had an experience once with an old GP where I used to live where he broke privacy and sent a load of nonsense to my last employer undermining all I told them about another health problem of mine and almost getting me fired as a result - my point being is that I'm worried about what they'll send back to the job centre.

It's just so very frustrating how people (not just aspies/autistics - although we have a whole hell of a lot of prejudice in the system too) are screwed over so badly by this whole system, I don't understand why it is so bad, why they're allowed to treat us all so badly, act with prejudice and so insulting...and I just don't understand why there are so few people/organisations set-up to really help us with these problems. Ugh, sorry, venting a little. Thanks for your reply. x

I agree, no need to apologise In my area there is an outreach service for adults with ASDs who can help with anything you need, maybe there is something similar in yours? You could also contact the National Autistic Society. I found them really helpful when I needed some advice and also about getting diagnosed after I was told I couldn't as there was no one to do it here

Bloodheart wrote

Although what the Job Centre staff did to you was wrong, their denying responsibility and blaming the other person (you) is standard practice in many workplaces (albeit unofficial practice). What they did is known as CYA (Cover Your Ass), and unless you have recordings of your conversations with them, I'm afraid it is your word against theirs.

Anyway, there are several charitable organisations in the UK that help people with "disabilities" (including autism/ Asperger's syndrome) find and keep employment. I have heard that the National Autistic Society runs some programmes to help people on the spectrum find employment, but those programmes do not cover the whole country (and I have never dealt with NAS). There is also the employment services agency "Remploy" < http://www.remploy.co.uk/ >, which has branches in many of the major cities. (I have never dealt with them, but I know that several of my co-workers originally obtained their jobs via Remploy.)

In theory, your local JobCentre should be able to provide you with a list of such organisations. Unfortunately, in all likelihood JC employees are poorly trained, poorly paid, and hence bitter and disgruntled people. As such, I would not expect much help from them.

You mentioned you had thought about a medical career. Have you tried looking at both the low level medical and non-medical jobs on the NHS's website < http://www.jobs.nhs.uk/ >? Many of the low level jobs (e.g. clinical coder, equipment steriliser, basic lab technician, etc.) do not require a medical degree. (Inspired by Harvey Pekar, of "American Splendor" < http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0305206/ >, I spent several months applying for part-time filing clerk jobs in NHS hospitals, but I never received any interview requests .)

In terms of benefits, the information on the following website may be of some assistance
http://www.adviceguide.org.uk/index/life/benefits.htm .
Also, when I was having difficulty finding work, I bookmarked this website
http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/ .
(I never paid to become a member because I ending up getting a job, so I can not say for certain how helpful that second website will be.)

Best of luck with whatever you do.

Okay, so maybe this is not your season for medicine. But three years down the road, circumstances might change, maybe something as simple as loans being more readily available, and it might be your season, and at thirty you'll still be a very young person. In the book "A Not Entirely Benign Procedure: Four Years As A Medical Student" by Perri Klass, she talks about having a baby while in medical school. And while some professors viewed her having a child as a hinderance and so forth, others took the view that having a child makes her a better pediatrician. Of course it does. Heck, I think it would make her a better cardiologist if that was what she was interested in! And pursuing what she's really interested in makes her a better parent, in a very positive reciprocal kind of way.

I'm in Australia, so its slightly different. Here our job centres are outsourced, so private providers provide them all. They have quite a few in each area, city, etc and you get to choose which one you want and you can change if you want to. If you are assessed as having extra needs, ie, aspergers, you would automatically get to work with a disability employment service provider. We have a variety of different disability employment services and many of them specailise in different conditions.

I have had some absolutely useless service providers, but my psychologist knew someone who had recently stopped working for one and whom she respected and she rang him and asked him and he gave her a specific person to ask for and that person has to date been brillant. In the 4 months I have been with them I have applied for 4 jobs and had 3 interviews. All the jobs were a perfect match for me and they actually asked for and got my permission to go and talk to my psychologist in person as they felt that they could understand me more by talking to her in person, than getting a letter, talking on the phone, etc. Other services I was with for 18 months and never had one interview, and no suitable jobs to apply for. To say that no one in them will ever understand is wrong. I am the first person they have worked with on the spectrum, but they have been willing to learn and to work with me.

I have heard great things about the National Autistic Soceity in the UK and I would be contacting them and asking them for advice and support. I would assume that you would have the right to ask for a new worker at a minimum and I would be requesting that the NAS attend the first session with you to help them to understand you. I am sure they would also have booklets and stuff that you could give to them to help them to understand you better. They should also be able to help you to apply for other benefits if you want to.

While on welfare system is perfect and I have more complaints about our system than you can imagine we do now have a system where people can be assessed as having a partial capacity for work and they are only required to look for part time work and work that is suitable for them, as opposed to the general job seeker who is expected to look for any work at all.

But what I also know is that all of the employment centre staff have targets to reach and many of them are more interested in meeting those targets regardless of how they actualy do it. As my current worker said to me what they fail to see is that if you help someone as they need to be helped, and work with them as they want to be worked with, you actually get better outcomes anyway, but that never seems to enter their head.s

Do you have an ombudsman or something similar that you can appeal to. Managers always seem to protect their own staff and not consider that there are other ways of doing things. Further the staff are usually a very good reflection of the manager. Get a good manager and the staff either leave or change their behaviour.

Contact the NAS, it certainly cannot do you any harm.