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ThisAdamGuy
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09 Mar 2017, 8:36 am

I've whined about my job and how I'm no good at it a lot on here. I mean, an aspie taking customer service calls is a recipe for disaster. But now it's come down to the wire: I've gotten two coachings in two weeks. If I screw up one more time, I'm fired. I can't afford to lose my job. As crappy as it is, it's one of the only jobs that I'm even somewhat qualified for, and can pay my rent too. Plus it's doubtful I'll be able to get another job if I have to put that I got fired from Walmart in the middle of the Walmart capitol. How do I get better, though? Talking to people is hard. All the problems my managers say I have sound like the right things to do to me.

Like, for example, I took a call for a store a while ago. There was something wrong with the customer's order that I couldn't fix myself, so I had to send it off to someone else. I was trying to explain this to the associate, but she wouldn't stop interrupting me. Like, she wanted me to explain how the process was going to work, but wouldn't let me explain how to the process worked. Finally, I told her that she was being rude, so go get me her manager. She refused, said she wasn't being rude, and demanded to talk to my manager. I kept telling her to get me her manager, she continued to refuse, and eventually I hung up on her and called the store, asked for her manager, and reported the rudeness and finished explaining what was wrong with the customer's order and how I was going to fix it. A couple days later, though, my manager calls me for a private meeting with her and the guy who's over our entire department, replays the call for us both to hear, and then they both proceed to chew me out for a half hour straight. The associate wasn't being rude, they said, I was. Despite the fact that I literally couldn't finish a sentence with this associate, the fact that she didn't understand was my fault because I wasn't speaking clearly and plainly enough. I hung up on her, which in an offense you can be fired for in and of itself-- the fact that I was getting nowhere with her didn't matter. And we don't get to complain to their managers, they only get to do that to us. I'm a bad, bad boy and I should go put my nose in the corner and think about what I've done.

I don't get it. What exactly did I do wrong? More importantly, how do I get better at my job so that I don't wind up getting fired?


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johntober
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09 Mar 2017, 8:57 am

I wish I could make a suggestion but I am in the same position. I have recently been released over "he said/she said" nonsense and nothing to do with job performance. I certainly don't have any marketable skills so I don't know how things will work out. Best of luck to you.



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09 Mar 2017, 9:24 am

I'd suggest spending more time listening. Most people aren't good at thinking and problem solving while trying to get a word in edgewise. This can be a very good technique with customer service. If you let someone vent you may get lucky. Sometimes all they need to do is vent, in which case you have just done your job perfectly, or at least as well as it could be done. Sometimes they will suggest a solution that you can reasonably implement, another big win for you. But, neither can happen if you are busy talking.



ThisAdamGuy
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09 Mar 2017, 9:34 am

The problem is, I usually only have one way to solve each problem. I don't know about other call centers, but at Walmart they set up a course of action for every type of problem. There is no "going about it another way" because our systems aren't meant to handle it any other way. If the customer wants a refund, they have to get it from the store. If they want their refund faster, they have to wait 5-7 days for it. If the store can't scan a customer's order when it's delivered, I have to send it to someone who can fix the barcode. It wasn't that I wasn't listening to the associate during that call. I had all the information, I knew exactly what was going on. They did not understand. They should have listened to me when I tried to explain things to them, and the whole problem would have been fixed. And yet, my managers decided the whole thing was my fault, despite me doing everything I could to do my job.


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johntober
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09 Mar 2017, 12:42 pm

The problem with NTs is that they do not want to approach a situation rationally to come up with a mutual solution that serves everybody equally.



ThisAdamGuy wrote:
The problem is, I usually only have one way to solve each problem. I don't know about other call centers, but at Walmart they set up a course of action for every type of problem. There is no "going about it another way" because our systems aren't meant to handle it any other way. If the customer wants a refund, they have to get it from the store. If they want their refund faster, they have to wait 5-7 days for it. If the store can't scan a customer's order when it's delivered, I have to send it to someone who can fix the barcode. It wasn't that I wasn't listening to the associate during that call. I had all the information, I knew exactly what was going on. They did not understand. They should have listened to me when I tried to explain things to them, and the whole problem would have been fixed. And yet, my managers decided the whole thing was my fault, despite me doing everything I could to do my job.



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12 Mar 2017, 2:08 pm

BTDT wrote:
I'd suggest spending more time listening. Most people aren't good at thinking and problem solving while trying to get a word in edgewise. This can be a very good technique with customer service. If you let someone vent you may get lucky. Sometimes all they need to do is vent, in which case you have just done your job perfectly, or at least as well as it could be done. Sometimes they will suggest a solution that you can reasonably implement, another big win for you. But, neither can happen if you are busy talking.


The person on the other end is loaded for bear.

BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH RANT RANT RANT RANT.

Let them rant and don't say anything other than, "I'm listening." and an okay or some other non-committal word here or there.

When you final sense the rampage mode has lessen, offer up what you can do. People can get unreal when they feel not listened or talked over.

Who was right? Probably you, but you came across as an loud mouthed jerk. I'm sure the tape was the other person yelling and you talking over them. Unfortunately, store service has to eat sh***y attitudes from associates, just like associates have to eat sh***y attitude from customers.

You are in the position of power. You can do whatever you can do. You didn't need to talk over drama queen princess. Instead of solving her problem, it escalated to the higher ups, which makes you the bad guy. The higher ups don't really want to know you exist except as a payroll number.

She should have shut up and listened to you, but the world is full of crazy. You don't need to prove you are right. Let the crazy roar and don't get sucked into the drama.

Give the mad and the furious space to rage. You don't even have to really listen. Then calmly go back and make your suggestions.

I used to put the phone on the desk for two minutes so they weren't screaming in my ear.

Good luck.



AJisHere
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12 Mar 2017, 2:25 pm

johntober wrote:
The problem with NTs is that they do not want to approach a situation rationally to come up with a mutual solution that serves everybody equally.


Pretty sure most of them do.


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15 Mar 2017, 7:48 pm

ThisAdamGuy wrote:
I've whined about my job and how I'm no good at it a lot on here. I mean, an aspie taking customer service calls is a recipe for disaster. But now it's come down to the wire: I've gotten two coachings in two weeks. If I screw up one more time, I'm fired. I can't afford to lose my job. As crappy as it is, it's one of the only jobs that I'm even somewhat qualified for, and can pay my rent too. Plus it's doubtful I'll be able to get another job if I have to put that I got fired from Walmart in the middle of the Walmart capitol. How do I get better, though? Talking to people is hard. All the problems my managers say I have sound like the right things to do to me.

Like, for example, I took a call for a store a while ago. There was something wrong with the customer's order that I couldn't fix myself, so I had to send it off to someone else. I was trying to explain this to the associate, but she wouldn't stop interrupting me. Like, she wanted me to explain how the process was going to work, but wouldn't let me explain how to the process worked. Finally, I told her that she was being rude, so go get me her manager. She refused, said she wasn't being rude, and demanded to talk to my manager. I kept telling her to get me her manager, she continued to refuse, and eventually I hung up on her and called the store, asked for her manager, and reported the rudeness and finished explaining what was wrong with the customer's order and how I was going to fix it. A couple days later, though, my manager calls me for a private meeting with her and the guy who's over our entire department, replays the call for us both to hear, and then they both proceed to chew me out for a half hour straight. The associate wasn't being rude, they said, I was. Despite the fact that I literally couldn't finish a sentence with this associate, the fact that she didn't understand was my fault because I wasn't speaking clearly and plainly enough. I hung up on her, which in an offense you can be fired for in and of itself-- the fact that I was getting nowhere with her didn't matter. And we don't get to complain to their managers, they only get to do that to us. I'm a bad, bad boy and I should go put my nose in the corner and think about what I've done.

I don't get it. What exactly did I do wrong? More importantly, how do I get better at my job so that I don't wind up getting fired?


I know the feeling, I'm in a similar boat as you are. I work in a call center for a major telecommunications company and I've been called in a few times to the boss' office. I admit I'm not always the model employee and I handled an occasional call poorly when I look back. Call center work is not for me and I'm looking for something else in the meantime but until I find something else I have to do my best. Even NT's, call center work is not or them, I'm even seen battle hardened Vietnam and Gulf War vets fall under pressure. Myself, ever since I've taken this job, I've been more prone to sickness ranging from colds to stomach/intestinal problems, most likely from the pressure. Because of that, I sometime regret taking the job although I had to in order to survive.

The place I work at is not run right. The big boss is very prejudicial, when you say your side of the story or have a concern, he blows you off and puts words in your mouth as well as just dismiss them. He also picks on me if I eat at my desk or have my coat on the back of my chair even though he does not pick on others. He looks like an bully I flattened on high school after being picked on many times but I'm afraid a left hook to the boss' chin does not look good on a resumé :jester: :roll: :ninja: All I can say is "I hear you and you are not the only one here suffering." THe only advice I can give is to try to find something else in the meantime.



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15 Mar 2017, 9:00 pm

You may also consider taking that night email position if it still available. Email should be a lot easier for an Aspie with good writing skills. Especially since you have voice modulation issues.



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15 Mar 2017, 9:25 pm

ThisAdamGuy wrote:
I've whined about my job and how I'm no good at it a lot on here. I mean, an aspie taking customer service calls is a recipe for disaster. But now it's come down to the wire: I've gotten two coachings in two weeks. If I screw up one more time, I'm fired. I can't afford to lose my job. As crappy as it is, it's one of the only jobs that I'm even somewhat qualified for, and can pay my rent too. Plus it's doubtful I'll be able to get another job if I have to put that I got fired from Walmart in the middle of the Walmart capitol. How do I get better, though? Talking to people is hard. All the problems my managers say I have sound like the right things to do to me.

Like, for example, I took a call for a store a while ago. There was something wrong with the customer's order that I couldn't fix myself, so I had to send it off to someone else. I was trying to explain this to the associate, but she wouldn't stop interrupting me. Like, she wanted me to explain how the process was going to work, but wouldn't let me explain how to the process worked. Finally, I told her that she was being rude, so go get me her manager. She refused, said she wasn't being rude, and demanded to talk to my manager. I kept telling her to get me her manager, she continued to refuse, and eventually I hung up on her and called the store, asked for her manager, and reported the rudeness and finished explaining what was wrong with the customer's order and how I was going to fix it. A couple days later, though, my manager calls me for a private meeting with her and the guy who's over our entire department, replays the call for us both to hear, and then they both proceed to chew me out for a half hour straight. The associate wasn't being rude, they said, I was. Despite the fact that I literally couldn't finish a sentence with this associate, the fact that she didn't understand was my fault because I wasn't speaking clearly and plainly enough. I hung up on her, which in an offense you can be fired for in and of itself-- the fact that I was getting nowhere with her didn't matter. And we don't get to complain to their managers, they only get to do that to us. I'm a bad, bad boy and I should go put my nose in the corner and think about what I've done.

I don't get it. What exactly did I do wrong? More importantly, how do I get better at my job so that I don't wind up getting fired?


I deal with irate, impatient clients in the following manner.

1. I keep in mind that I am there to serve them, within the constraints of the regulations my employer imposes.
2. I keep in mind that my goal is to ultimately make the client happy, within boundaries of the regulations my employer imposes.
3. If the client is frustrated with something and taking it out on me, I make a comment which expresses that I empathize with their situation and also implies that I'm not responsible for it, but my goal is to fix it for them.

For example, a while back I was supposed to trouble shoot some upgraded equipment for a client, that I had not been trained with, though had a vague idea of how to operate. The client and I both thought the upgraded equipment was a step backwards, and not as good as the old equipment, and when the client expressed frustration, I replied "Yeah, I don't know why they bought these stupid things, I don't like them either, but let me see if I can figure this out for you."

4. I'm always civil, and I mean always. As long as I am civil, I can't be faulted for not being civil, no matter how upset the client gets. Just because a client is rude does not mean you should be rude back.



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16 Mar 2017, 7:40 am

Chronos wrote:
I keep in mind that my goal is to ultimately make the client happy, within boundaries of the regulations my employer imposes.


Here's the problem with that, though: the "boundaries and regulations my employer imposes" (ie, Walmart policy) are a lot of the time what makes the customer mad. For example: Customer wants a refund, but store won't give them one so they call the home office hoping we can force the store to do it. I explain that the store's supervisor is the one who sets the refund policy in his store, so if he says no I, nor anyone else, don't have the authority to override that. Bottom line: customer does get their refund. That makes the customer mad. That means the customer is not satisfied. That means that, by doing my job, I have failed to do my job. It's a catch 22. Do I want to piss off my manager, who can fire me, or the customer, who my manager can then fire me for pissing off?


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BTDT
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16 Mar 2017, 9:29 am

ThisAdamGuy wrote:
Here's the problem with that, though: the "boundaries and regulations my employer imposes" (ie, Walmart policy) are a lot of the time what makes the customer mad. For example: Customer wants a refund, but store won't give them one so they call the home office hoping we can force the store to do it. I explain that the store's supervisor is the one who sets the refund policy in his store, so if he says no I, nor anyone else, don't have the authority to override that. Bottom line: customer does get their refund. That makes the customer mad. That means the customer is not satisfied. That means that, by doing my job, I have failed to do my job. It's a catch 22. Do I want to piss off my manager, who can fire me, or the customer, who my manager can then fire me for pissing off?


This is typical Aspie Black/White thinking. But, based on what you have written, there are employees who actually manage to do the job you are suppose to do without pissing off either the customers or their managers.



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16 Mar 2017, 9:57 pm

ThisAdamGuy wrote:
Chronos wrote:
I keep in mind that my goal is to ultimately make the client happy, within boundaries of the regulations my employer imposes.


Here's the problem with that, though: the "boundaries and regulations my employer imposes" (ie, Walmart policy) are a lot of the time what makes the customer mad. For example: Customer wants a refund, but store won't give them one so they call the home office hoping we can force the store to do it. I explain that the store's supervisor is the one who sets the refund policy in his store, so if he says no I, nor anyone else, don't have the authority to override that. Bottom line: customer does get their refund. That makes the customer mad. That means the customer is not satisfied. That means that, by doing my job, I have failed to do my job. It's a catch 22. Do I want to piss off my manager, who can fire me, or the customer, who my manager can then fire me for pissing off?


Ah, but you misunderstand. I said my goal is to make the client happy within the boundaries of the regulations my employer imposes. This means I do everything I am authorized to do to keep the client happy, but nothing I am not authorized to do. Sometimes this is not good enough for the client, and the client will be mad anyway, but that's ok because as long as I remain civil to the client, I can't be faulted for doing anything wrong.

Your misstep was not that you could not give the person exactly what they wanted, but that you became rude and acted in an uncivil manner. If I understand, the person you wear dealing with was another associate, correct? Had you remained civil and the associate was rude, then you could have informed your boss of the associate's inappropriate behavior, and the associate may have then been the one in trouble.


Imagine an automated phone system. It is programmed to do...
A, B, C, and D and always be civil. No matter how much a customer cusses out the automated phone system, it is always civil. Say a customer calls and wants E. Well automated phone system is not programmed for E, and that upsets the customer, but yet the automated phone system persists in it's civility.

In a similar manner, you may be authorized to do A, B, C, and D, but not E, and in any case, you must always be civil.



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17 Mar 2017, 12:22 am

ThisAdamGuy wrote:
Chronos wrote:
I keep in mind that my goal is to ultimately make the client happy, within boundaries of the regulations my employer imposes.


Here's the problem with that, though: the "boundaries and regulations my employer imposes" (ie, Walmart policy) are a lot of the time what makes the customer mad. For example: Customer wants a refund, but store won't give them one so they call the home office hoping we can force the store to do it. I explain that the store's supervisor is the one who sets the refund policy in his store, so if he says no I, nor anyone else, don't have the authority to override that. Bottom line: customer does get their refund. That makes the customer mad. That means the customer is not satisfied. That means that, by doing my job, I have failed to do my job. It's a catch 22. Do I want to piss off my manager, who can fire me, or the customer, who my manager can then fire me for pissing off?


I have the same problem. Months ago, a customer called up and he was charged with the repair of phone lines on the inside of where he lived. The file was wrong where it gave his wrong birthdate, I thought he was born in the early 1960's. Well, he was disputing it and I investigated and consulted my boss and said that he is on the hook for the lines. He got angry and said the company was jerking around a poor 90 year old man in a nursing home which I did not know going into the call. He said he was a World War II vet too in Europe. I felt bad, first the home should be responsible for the lines and I felt really bad for jerking around a poor 90 year old, a member of America's Greatest Generation who fought in WWII. I thought of my own grandfather who was at Omaha Beach, St. Lo, Battle of the Bulge and liberating Buchenwald. I let the man off the hook by waiving the charge. Nobody found out but I felt glad, there are times my morals and ethics are challenged at where I work. They keep us on a short leash and many times whne you want help, the floor walkers and supervisors blow you off or give poor advice. Many times, I have to basically take the rules into my own hands. One of my favorite people in history is Admiral Grace Hopper, first female Admiral in the Navy and developer of early computers and COBOL language. She was interviewed in 1986 and she said, "it is better to ask for forgiveness than for permission." I tend to live by that. Yeah, I've had my unprofessional scrapes with customers and I was called for it, I'm only human, but I do try to so my best but it is hard.



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17 Mar 2017, 2:04 am

MrLucky wrote:
ThisAdamGuy wrote:
Chronos wrote:
I keep in mind that my goal is to ultimately make the client happy, within boundaries of the regulations my employer imposes.


Here's the problem with that, though: the "boundaries and regulations my employer imposes" (ie, Walmart policy) are a lot of the time what makes the customer mad. For example: Customer wants a refund, but store won't give them one so they call the home office hoping we can force the store to do it. I explain that the store's supervisor is the one who sets the refund policy in his store, so if he says no I, nor anyone else, don't have the authority to override that. Bottom line: customer does get their refund. That makes the customer mad. That means the customer is not satisfied. That means that, by doing my job, I have failed to do my job. It's a catch 22. Do I want to piss off my manager, who can fire me, or the customer, who my manager can then fire me for pissing off?


I have the same problem. Months ago, a customer called up and he was charged with the repair of phone lines on the inside of where he lived. The file was wrong where it gave his wrong birthdate, I thought he was born in the early 1960's. Well, he was disputing it and I investigated and consulted my boss and said that he is on the hook for the lines. He got angry and said the company was jerking around a poor 90 year old man in a nursing home which I did not know going into the call. He said he was a World War II vet too in Europe. I felt bad, first the home should be responsible for the lines and I felt really bad for jerking around a poor 90 year old, a member of America's Greatest Generation who fought in WWII. I thought of my own grandfather who was at Omaha Beach, St. Lo, Battle of the Bulge and liberating Buchenwald. I let the man off the hook by waiving the charge. Nobody found out but I felt glad, there are times my morals and ethics are challenged at where I work. They keep us on a short leash and many times whne you want help, the floor walkers and supervisors blow you off or give poor advice. Many times, I have to basically take the rules into my own hands. One of my favorite people in history is Admiral Grace Hopper, first female Admiral in the Navy and developer of early computers and COBOL language. She was interviewed in 1986 and she said, "it is better to ask for forgiveness than for permission." I tend to live by that. Yeah, I've had my unprofessional scrapes with customers and I was called for it, I'm only human, but I do try to so my best but it is hard.


There are situations in which I might do something that I technically don't have explicit permission to do, if I thought my supervisor wouldn't have a problem with it, or if I decided that not doing so would be extremely immoral or unethical. Or instances I might not do something I was supposed to do for the same reason. For example, if I worked for the power company and was told to disconnect the power to a house where someone was on a respirator, or similar life sustaining device that needed electricity, I would refuse to do it even if I risked getting fired. However, it's often difficult for people on the spectrum to gauge whether or not it's safe to go against company policy.

To complicate matters, a while back, one of my co-workers was commended by our department for doing something that was against company policy, which made the client happy enough to write a letter to our manager commending him, which made the managers happy, which earned him a reward.

But it also could have gone the other way. The managers could have been upset that he did something he wasn't authorized to do, and fire him.

A rather funny incident happened a while back at work, where something that was supposed to be on wasn't on, and I needed it turned on, but I wasn't authorized to touch it. I called the department that had jurisdiction over that equipment, and they sent a guy who also wasn't authorized to touch it...apparently the people who were authorized to touch it weren't in that day, and we both stood there afraid to touch it until my supervisor finally spoke with his supervisor and got his supervisor to agree to let him turn it on (and in doing so, the supervisor takes responsibility if something goes wrong). It was absolutely ridiculous but we both knew how upper management worked and didn't want to take the chance.



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21 Mar 2017, 10:41 am

Well, I wasn't there, and I only have your account to go on, but I haven't the slightest idea. While reading your account, I figured you screwed up when you hung up, but then your account of the meeting made it sound like you had somehow mis-interpreted the entire interaction.

As for your job security: do you have a mentor you can ask about the common Catch 22 scenarios you mention? Can you ask for a mentor?
I second moving to the night e-mail position if still available as well.

Sidenote: I hate the way that meeting was constructed- two people who knew their script representing the company's interests, nobody representing yours except you (who was taken by surprise), and ultimately two people socially intimidating an Aspie for things that are textbook examples of Aspie problems in a neurotypically oriented setting.

I don't suppose Walmart has a Union? Based on everything I've heard and read about them, I really don't suppose they do, but I figured I should ask.