violent behaviour

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Hi does anyone have any advice on dealing with violent behaviour. My little boy is so quick to fly off the handle he is hurting us and his sister. We use visual timetables but nothing seems to work. Last night he asked me to go for a walk. I explained i was making tea so that we couldn't go just now. He threw an electronic game on the floor and started to stamp on it. I took some LEGO off of him for breaking the game, he then attacked his sister, threw food all over the kitchen, threw chairs over etc. This is a daily occurrence in our house now. I am at my wits end.
I never give in to his behaviour, I always remove toys, the wii etc, use timeout nothing seems to change the behaviour.
I don't understand how i can punish him so much but his behaviour does not ever get better. It is not as if when he has these meltdowns that i give in and let him have what he wants I never have.
Please help me, I'm praying every night for strength.

how old is he?

In that instance, if I could anticipate he might respond that way, I would have told them "If you're good, yes we can go on a walk after I'm done drinking my tea. But if you're bad, we won't go on a walk at all."

Of course in some instances he just won't be able to get what he wants. I've seen other parents handle things like this by treating it as a reaction the child can't control and simply calmly restraining the child and and speaking calmly until they settle down. This seems to work fairly well, I think because perhaps it allows the child to get over that surge of sudden negative emotions and think more clearly.

Ask the child WHY..

dexter, first off, My Girlfriends youngest son is Autistic and he can become very violent, Him and I are extremely close but for some simple reasons and these reasons also help me control him and his Anger and frustration...
1, Get close to him and learn how he is with you and other people, in other words..If he has a fear of crowds or a lot of people than side with him, Siding with him will help him realize more that you may possibly understand him and trust me eventually you actually will if your open minded.. Don't yell or take things away it's you will find it's eventually not going to help unless it's something very important to him that he loves to do more than anything...
2 Anger, this is the big one i know, of course some children are worse than others but ours he loses it as well at times, but i found (and so did he) that i can yell just as loud as him, in that sense PUT your foot down ! !! Your child he will do what he is told, keep up the "Never giving in" soon as you do and he sees that weak spot he will not forget it..When he has his "meltdowns" my girlfriend cannot control him very well at all and its very hard on her, and she knows as well as i do him and I are close and he listens to me more than literally anyone, so of course i am called in to deal with him...First i see what his problem is, second i don't yell (only in other circumstances, but turns to fun later on with him but in most cases i go and just talk to him and help him sort it out to sit and talk with him at HIS level, kneel down, sit on the floor whatever it takes get to his level and talk about the issue, get him to pay attention to you and listen but don't force it and never get Angry at him for his meltdowns, If he gets that severe thats the only time you should get louder like i am sure he does..
He makes a mess from his tantrums, calm him make him help clean it up and talk to him at the same time, If you get him to this point of talking to you about his trouble while cleaning up you will find quit the little person inside there and you will start to understand him and that will help you actually predict some "Meltdowns" I know i did and i wouldn't give up on ours even if he isn't biologically my child.
I hope i didn't overdo my advice or post to you, but i do hope some of it helps in some way to you or others..Would gladly discuss more if needed..

Dexter, I've compiled some past posts here, there's a section on violence which unfortunately is not uncommon. I hope you find what you need there, good luck to you!

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt166142.html

I am copying this over from a post I wrote in another thread a few days ago:

Thanks so much for the advice. I am starting to get that i need to understand him more and his triggers. For those of you who have apologies regarding my downfalls please don't!! He has only just been diagnosed one year and I am so happy to have some advice.
From the advice I think I need to stop using traditional parenting techniques. Encourage good behaviour by explain what that is and trying to figure out the triggers.
Tonight when he was upset I just cuddled him, and told him Mummy loves you. He did calm much quicker. He then told me he hates people, they annoy him he said it is like having ants crawl all over my body!!
He is 4 1/2 years old and as you can probably gather very articulate.
Thanks again I am going to try exactly what has been suggested. Get to his level, support and listen look for triggers and stop trying to treat him as if he doesn't have difficulties and is just being naughty.

We have a list of rules, chores and extra chores. If a child KNOWS what punishment is forthcoming for a certain thing like if you had written down that if you throw a toy you get another toy taken away from you then he would understand. Was he specifically aware that this certain toy was going to be taken away was he aware before hand that this was what was going to happen? If not, this is what sent him into a meltdown and this does sound like a meltdown. He should have received appropriate sensory input and then once he was calm you could talk to him about how it is wrong to hurt his sister. When my son is having a meltdown, since he is larger, we send him or my husband carries him to his room or we remove my daughter. I had really bad meltdowns when I was my sons age too but my Mom would talk to me (even though she had no idea I was autistic) and I stopped this and I now would feel horrible if I hurt someone else so dont think if you do not punish him that he will harm other people when he is older. If he is purposely hurting your daughter thats is different and I would take him for therapy for that.

I also remind my kids about the rules when they break them and I sometimes let the punishment fit the crime, so they say. My son broke his DSi in two because he was angry with his game. It still worked for some time but we told him that we would not buy him a new one until he convinced us that he was not going to break another toy. It took him two years to earn a new one but he stopped breaking toys and was learning to control himself.....until, the other day he was loosing a game and the lady (one of my replacement aides...I have aides because I am ill and can not walk well or stand for more than a few minutes) that was playing with him did not know how to deal with him so she put the game away without telling him this is what would happen if he didnt stop yelling. He got very upset and threw one of his loved, large, plastic dinosaurs and its head broke off. He, of course, "lost it" and was crying like the dog died and the aide kept telling him she was sorry and I kept trying to tell her not to apologize to him (we have a language barrier, my usual aide speaks some English this one only speaks French). Later I told him that I wouldnt give him time out (the typical punishment for throwing things as my daughter got hurt from a flying toy not long ago....we did not use punishment before but we started using the time out for more serious things) but that his dinosaur was gone because he threw it.We told him maybe we could glue the head back on but not until he showed us he could stay calm and not throw toys. He is aware that when you throw things they break and that is the consequence (he is 9 btw) but its kind of hard for me as I feel guilty that its not me taking care of him because I am ill and I would know how to treat him and how to talk to him.
You should try to make a list and if he can not read make a PECS list and go over the rules and consequences many times....also until he gets used to the rule you can use the 123 thing and remind him of what will happen if you get to 3.

We also use a reward system with tokens. If you do your chores (put away coat, shoes and back pack, toys and garbage, ask for food instead of taking, and my son takes care of his rabbit) and homework every day you get a token (we also have extra chores for tokens like scooping the cat box, grooming the dogs, ect.) and you can use tokens for buying things at the store. We have a token to euro chart as well. Our kids love order, schedules and they need to know what happens next or what happens if you do this or that...charts are perfect for them as are timers. We use the timers for computer and TV time and for time out, of course. We also let our kids pick the time out room (we told them it could not be their room or the sensory room), they picked the kitchen and the chair they can turn around and look out the window. We also use the minute to age ratio.

Also you need to make sure that you know the difference between you children ignoring you on purpose and ignoring you because they are in their world....I use "UH OH" or "Im talking to Maddy/Luc"....its pretty obvious when my son puts his fingers in his ears that hes ignoring me on purpose . Also to know the difference between a meltdown and a temper tantrum. When my kids have meltdowns we give them a sensory type activity.....shaving cream, weighted blanket, swing, chewy, pacifier, ect. We have moved my daughters bed into my sons room, they like that better. We are making their room into a sensory room. We have secured a ball pit, we have to pick it up this weekend. We have one big tramp that we are putting back in the garage for outside and we are going to get another small one with handles, they like the handles. I have found some inexpensive bubble tube lights with plastic fish that we have found a way to anchor and also a cool yellow and blue lava lamp that my son loves.
We have been told by the handicapped people that we should buy a bigger house as I can not use my wheel chair in this house and it would be better for our kids. Here in France you can get special loans if you are handicapped, me and my children just with our autism are considered handicapped and I also have my auto immune disease and severe nerve damage....and now this fun anemia.

The biggest thing you need to remember is to try to keep everything as consistent as possible even if you are ill like me. We did just change our system because of this very reason. My husband was so stressed about about me being in and out of the hospital that he was not following our system so we made a new one and he understands how important it is now that my kids are having meltdowns everyday and the house is a wreck even though we have aides to clean.

What really helped my higher functioning child was the techniques in the book "The Explosive Child" by Dr. Ross Greene.

I got the school staff to go along with it as well and what a difference in my child.

Also learning about the Function of his behavior would help. If can't go for a walk now let him know when he can go. So instead of saying NO in any way shape or form change the answer so it would be yes, we can go as soon as I finish my tea or tomorrow or one day.

I know how hard this can be-sending you hugs.

RG

DW always mentions a book written by someone on WP with AS. I finally started reading it and really found the analogies in it useful.

Here is the link: http://asdstuff.com/Strange%20Kid.pdf

Anyway, in this book, the author does a great job explaining the stages an AS person goes through for meltdowns and shutdowns.

I found it helpful for my son to begin seeing the signs of distress before he reached the no return stage. When that happened, we stopped the event temporarily and dealt with the meltdown (like when you were hugging him and reassuring him). The older he got, the more I recognized things for my son that indicated a meltdown was on the way: becoming more hyper, becoming silly, sidetracking, asking the same question over and over, sighing loudly, covering his face, covering his ears, bringing his legs up into his seat (like he was trying to become smaller). at 11, he still does not see these signs of agitation himself, but when I point them out, he is able to use the skills we have worked on to help calm himself enough to begin to make good decisions again. This does not mean he gets his way or does not have consequences for his actions. I personally just try to keep them separate. I try to make the consequences logical/natural and frame it as repairing the harm that came from his actions. "if you spill a glass of milk on accident, it still has to be cleaned up" and "if you break something, you have to fix it or replace it" and "if you hurt someones feelings or hurt them physically, you have to apologize." I also used to say things when he was younger like "I see you are having a hard time using your nice words and gentle hands today, so you have to play in whatever room I am in so I can help you. It's mommy's job to help you." <-- this was to keep him and his sister from harming each other and fighting. Anyway, it won't happen overnight, but with lots of effort things do get better.

~Erica

Dear All
Thanks so much for your help. I am making real progress with him. If he starts to go into a meltdown I've been staying calm and distracting him, reassuring him that i love him giving him cuddles etc. Once calm we have been able to discuss his behaviour and he is very sad and says he is so sorry. He helps to clean up the mess he has made and actually cried the other day when he realized what he had done. I have also discovered that by talking to him when he is calm after the event that it is often the result of him not being able to " find the words". For example the other night he threw a load of water over me before he came out of the bath. Instead of my normal reaction I stayed calm and took his sister out of the bath calmly then taking him out of the bath. Once settled he after a long time of trying to think what to say he told me he wanted a bit more time in the bath but couldn't find the words. I'm going to make some symbols for the bath to help him.
i really can't thank you all enough. I've also been working my way through the online book as suggested it's great.
Your experience has given me so many ideas and ways forward.

My daughter gets violent when she's distressed. I have scars and bruises from the past week. But physical discomfort is temporary and while she's angry at me, I always know that I'm bigger and stronger than her so I've never felt scared (most posters in this forum are Moms with AS sons so I wonder how you deal with violence when they reach maturity). In a sense, lack of empathy is helpful because she can be raging at me and I don't get drawn into her extreme emotions. While there's no clear immediate benefit, i hope that I am setting an example that she will remember in the future.