Adoption - as an aspie

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It's been nearly a year now since my wife and I went through this. It may be a long post and a bit rambling, for which I apologise in advance.

Firstly, A bit about me. I'm married, my wife and I have been together for a little over ten years now. I have two degree's and I work for myself, making a fairly reasonable living. Much of my work is home based. My wife runs a local charity and is in the process of finishing her PHD and again makes a good living. We own our own home, we own two cats, two dogs and I would guess we come across as a pretty average couple. We are both in our mid-thirties and I would say we are both good people. I am the one with Aspergers, and I would describe myself as very high functioning.

A few years ago, we found out that it would be very difficult and potentially dangerous for my wife to conceive. It was quite heart breaking at the time, but it was something we supported each other through, and decided it simply wasn't worth the risk. However we both felt that we wanted a family, so after much thought, soul searching and discussion, we decided to adopt.

Now the adoption process in the UK is run by the local government / council, a department called social services. We applied, went on a very informative course about adoption, underwent criminal background checks and then we both went for a medical, and signed a form giving a third doctor (one we would never meet - a Paediatrician as it turns out, full access to our medical records).

Oddly, things went a bit quiet then. They hadn't yet formerly accepted our application - as you would expect, it is a long and complex process. We tried contacting our assigned Social Worker a few times over the next five or six months. This was a lady assigned to our case, we had only met her twice, probably no more than half an hour all told. Whenever we phoned, she was either not around, or said she would get back to us. Now I want to make it very clear here that I was fully open with Social Services from the very beginning of this process - making it clear that I had Aspergers, but also that we have friends and family around us, and that we had a good support network.

Around seven months of silence, the Social Worker rang, asked to make an appointment to come and see us, and asked if she could bring her manager with her. She kind of implied over the phone that this was an assessment.

So a week later, on the day of the appointment, after a ridiculous amount housework and nerves, the Social Worker and her Manager arrived. It turns out this wasn't an assessment. They told me and my wife that we would not be put forward for the Adoption process.

Apparently, after reviewing my medical records, their Doctor, the Paediatrician, whom I'd never actually met, raised concerns based on the fact that I had had a mild episode of depression in my late teens, and that I had Aspergers Syndrome, which in his view, meant that I would in all likelihood be unable to form a loving bond with a child.

I must admit, I was too stunned to speak for a few minutes, but my wife asked them precisely what they were implying, pointing out that not only have we been in a relationship and married for all this time, I'd spent half of my childhood babysitting for aunts and uncles, not to mention my own siblings and also we look after our nieces most weekends. It was no use. I spent an hour talking to them, but there position could only be described as intractable.

I was quite numb for a few days, and then the next week a letter arrived listing the same reasons. I contacted the department, put in a formal complaint under the Equality Act 2010, which has been largely ignored so far and I also contacted the National Autistic Society for support, who were of very little help.

In all of the years since my diagnosis, I can honestly say this is the first time I have ever felt discriminated against. The real kicker is that yes, we can apply to other agencies to be considered for eligibility to adopt, but legally we must disclose that we have been turned down and they must contact the very department that turned us down. It is highly unlikely we will be able to adopt now.

I guess that's all I wanted to share. Thanks for reading.

So sorry to hear of your predicament. I know exactly what it's like to be discriminated against and find that the very agencies that supposedly exist to defend your rights can't be bothered to do their jobs. I hope you find some way to solve your problem. I'm of the opinion that the only thing that's ever going to help is to take our cases to the media an expose the discrimination. Unfortunately, it seems the media is bent on tying AS to mass murderers rather doing anything to promote tolerance and understanding.

I wonder if it would help if WP's Aspergian parents got their kids to write testimonials stating that their childhoods were as normal and positive as anyone else's. That doctor's attitude is absolute ignorance. My NT daughter and I have always had a great relationship and she's a happily married parent herself now.

Wow. How awful. No wonder people adopt from foreign countries sometimes.

That's why you don't tell people you have autism. They judge you based on a label and make assumptions. Don't forget there are those horror stories by people who were raised by an aspie plastered all over the internet and you never hear any positive stories about being raised by an aspie so it's going to make social workers and other people think aspies are unfit parents. It's also in books too.

That is terrible. I don't know squat about what is allowed in the UK, but is there a way to do private adoptions that allows you to avoid them and the other agencies that would ask for those same files.

The only other thing I could suggest is if you try the autism agency org. Sometimes, if you get a different person, you can get different results.

Hire a lawyer and see if you can arrange for a private adoption. Or if you have financial means, hire a surrogate to bear you and your wife's biological child.

and in one post I truly understand why so many people are telling me I should never get officially diagnosed...

omg... this is heart breaking

That really sucks. It also sucks when honesty turns out not to be the best policy at all. I recall someone here talking about nearly having their kids taken away by social services because it became known that they're ASD. Some neighbor "ratted them out", so they moved and never mention ASD to anyone, now.

I see a lot of people on boards (not sure if this includes you, OP, or not) who don't know that lack of empathy (or, more technically, lack of theory of mind) is the official academic theory of autism. That is, if a person has formal education about ASD they are taught that that is the literal *definition* of it. It's not that people have a misconception; it's what they're taught defines the condition.

Baron-Cohen et al can make their fine distinctions about different kinds of empathy, but most people aren't going to bother to learn about that. If they hear "lack of empathy" they're going to think the worst.

Oh, also, even Tony Attwood is not an ally on this subject.

That is terrible

Amanda

Babies are hot commodities.

Everyone wants the perfect one.

It's a sellers market, why take a chance with you? I'm not being mean, but with all things being equally, a father with a history of depression and a developmental disorder doesn't scream winner. I don't view you like that, but obviously the agency did.

Have no room to talk. I have Bipolar I, which would s**t can me from International adoptions and agency ones.

If this happened in the States, I wouldn't be surprised. I thought the UK was more understanding about Autism.

Sorry for your loss...it must have absolutely crushed the two of you.

I would not think it expllicitly as discrimination, but the ratio of people willing to adopt, and the children that can be adopted, is quite bad, so there are about 8 couples for each "offered" child in western europe.

The youth officers simply have the possibility to choose the best possible parents in their oppinion, and if they have a couple, where non of both ever endured depression or mental anormaly, while on the other side they have a couple of parents without any flaw, they will take the last one. My "birthaunt" could as well not receive any children, and tried to adopt. She never had any bad history, but because of her already being beyond 35 and her husband beyond 40, other parents were prefered, that were a bit younger.

I´d agree that you may engage in adoption of a child of an foreing country. As far as I know in east europe, sadly for the children, there is a worse ratio of willing parents/kids.

Adopting from other countries, bad idea. Have you read lot of stories about parents adopting from overseas and their kid always turned out to be a Chucky? Most of these kids have RAD and it's because they are abused or neglected and I knew since middle school in China babies in orphanages there are not given love or attention and it causes them problems in the future. I heard from a friend who would love to adopt from overseas that the kids either end up in a institution or end up in prison. I don't remember what country this is in. It's awful and parents who have adopted from over seas have little help for their RAD child because there is little help for RAD and therapy usually makes them act worse and doesn't cure them from RAD. Families get so desperate for their safety and their childrens' safety they either send them back to their home country or give them away to anyone and they don't care who the person is.

I would never do international adoption. Too risky and dangerous. Good thing I did research and read personal stories about adoption or I would have never known this and lot of parents do not know this when they adopt from another country and then it's too late and they're stuck. A couple in Ohio is facing charges for child abandonment because they took their nine year old boy whom they adopted at 3 months to social services and left him there to send back to his home country. They did it for their safety and their kids and the kid has been in and out of hospitals and he was refusing therapy. Remember the time when a mom sent her boy back to Russia and the media painted her as a bad parent and monster? They did not mention the details about the boy and how he had threatened his parents and how they had to lock everything away that can be used as weapons because he wanted to kill them and he had tried burning their house down and they have spent over $20,000 trying to get him help. He had RAD. The mom was married and not single but she was painted as a single mother because it failed to mention her husband. My local news told more details about it and it showed the parents interview and their lives were in danger when they had him. Can you imagine living in your own home and not knowing if you were going to live or die and your kid has tried attacking you before with items that can kill you? How would you even be able to sleep? How many parents live this way? Not a lot certainly. I have also heard of parents having to lock their kids in their rooms to protect them from their adopted sibling who is violent and harms them so he or she can't harm them. I always think they have it backwards. Why should the normal kids be locked in their rooms and not the violent child? it should be the violent child who should be locked in their room so they can;t harm anyone than their normal siblings. That's like locking innocent people away to protect them all from criminals and rapists and killers and child abusers and they all get to live out in the real world and have all the freedom they have while we all have to live behind bars and secured fences for our safety. That would be a lot of prisons since we have over 300,000 people living in the states.

I don't think anyone should be adopting from overseas because lot of people cannot handle a RAD child and there is very little support here for these children and real therapy for it that actually works is actually very expensive lot of families cannot afford it. Some have lucked out and found someone who can help their child but it meant they would have to give up their adoption rights and hand them over to the person who can help them. But it's the only way their kid can get help. Beth Thomas is an example. At least she had a learning attitude and worked at it too with her new mother who knew how to handle kids like her and she grew up to be a nurse and recovered from RAD. So it is possible these kids can recover from it but they need the right therapy and it's so expensive and parents would have to know how to work with it and handle it and lot of parents do not know how to do that.

So international adoption is dangerous, don't do it. It's too risky. You don't want to end up with a Chucky. Kids there are so poorly treated and cared for that is why they end up this way. Of course kids from the USA can also have RAD too but I don't think it's as common. Beth Thomas was from the USA. But normally lot of adopted kids have problems because they come from families where they were abused or neglected or their bio moms did drugs while pregnant. If you adopt from the states, you have a higher chance of having a special needs child or a kid with behavior problems. That is probably why so many people have their own kids or hire a suffragette mother or do egg implants. Plus adoption is expensive and there is all that red tape and restrictions and moms who are putting their babies up for an adoption tend to be picky about who they want someone to be a parent to their child. You would really have to impress those bio moms by building a portfolio bout your life and all and they have to like your home and be satisfied with your income.

The cheapest adoption is through foster care but in Oregon it's free if the kid was your foster child and you decided to push for adoption. But lot of foster kids have problems too. Most foster parents treat their home like a business and their foster child as a guest s foster kids always get moved around a lot and that causes them to rebel and not respect authority because they know they will be moving again anyway and get moved to another foster home so they see no point in following the rules or being respectful.

I don't know the the laws are in the UK about adoption so everything I said here is based on the United States where I live.

I would have thought, that the fact that some of them live under bad conditions, would be a cause more for adopting them. I think you hardly will find that much children, that were totally loved by their moms, but then given away for adopting.

Actually around here, many kids of foreign adoption come from romania. It is true that many of them endured bad conditions, as well that their mothers cared not as much as possible during their pregnancy. But saying, every kid would be highly aggressive is simple propaganda. There has been scientific research on that children, and they do have a higher statistical risc of having problems with concentrations, as well as a statistical lower IQ (in an small amount). But the same statistic has as well proven, that this highly relates with the age, since when a kid came to caring parents. So kids that had been for about 2-3 years, showed for some ratios behaviors like a worsened ability to trust or communicate with others. While for kids that had been adopted until the age of 6 month, there hardly were any differencies to normal raised kids.

I dont wanna denie, that if you have really bad luck, you might meet Freddy Kruger himself (just as that can happen with your normal kid as well in a certain ratio), but you can have as well become a kid that would fit into the family of "Our little farm".

I dont know how international adoption is done in the USA, so if the kid is sended with UPS to you, but for adoption inside of europe, as adoption willing parent you are expected to move for a certain amount of time to the area of the childs orphanage and to engage with it for weeks, so that educators and therapists are able to see if the child and the parents do well with each other, and if you should be allowed to adopt the child.

Maybe all those bad stories I have heard about foreign adoptions were by parents who had bad luck. I am still too terrified to do it though because it seems so common and I can't afford it anyway because it's too expensive. Even if I could afford it, I still wouldn't do it for the reason I already said. Also RAD is a real thing and they are not able to bond. Giving them love and attention is not going to work because they will just push you away figuratively speaking and not make them not violent and a sociopath and not make them learn empathy so they don't harm people or try and kill anyone or the pets. That is why it's so important to hold a baby and love them and not ignore them, especially when they cry. That is how they learn to bond. It all starts at birth. Maybe that is why parents get concerned and upset when their baby doesn't like to be held. They are afraid their kid won't learn to bond and he will turn out to be a psycho.

I know everyone wants a baby to adopt because they don't want a child that has already been screwed up. But adopting a baby isn't guaranteed the kid won't be screwed up either because you never know what was done to them or if their bio moms did drugs or not and what they did to their child. You an screw a kid up before their first year and then they are facing problems in their future such as RAD (reactive attachment disorder).

You need to seek the assistance of a lawyer as I suspect this person may be objecting to your suitability to adopt based on spurious evidence.

If you scour the legalities of adoption there's actually quite a lot of ambiguity in relation to mental health of prospective parents. It's the same with people wanting to work as nannies, pediatric mental health workers or in child care. In the context of your application the objection can only be based on a doctor's perception and not on how you present in your interview. The diagnosis can't be used as a reason because each applicant needs to be considered on a case by case basis.

If what you posted is correct then this meets the criteria for a human rights violation.

Hate to tell you, for adoption in China, the adopting couple both must not have a history of mental illness or any cognitive/physical impairment.

They'll punt your forms to the curb for that alone.

Adoption isn't a right. The PTB can set any criteria they want. Some places in the States want you to have so much money in reserve. You have to bring in bank statements. Others put the couple through a meat grinder of BS. Your husband works too many hours. You collect large snakes. You have a "banned" breed dog. You are over 35. You aren't a Christian, Jew or Catholic. Into Wicca? Bub-bye!

Agencies are the biggest farce around. String you along, get a good chunk of cash, and tell you too bad. No baby for you.

Foster care is no bonus. They flat out gloss over things like RAD and FAS/FASD just to get the kids out of the system.