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setai
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10 Nov 2014, 4:07 pm

Do you live close to a university or a big lab. Perhaps a tour and an opportunity to meet some scientist might make school more meaningful. Once he sees all those people have PHDs then he might be more willing to go. At worst it could be a fun pick me up.

My little guy, just turned 5 who usually is the happiest kid I have ever met went through a really sad period for two, almost three weeks because one of his friends in school was having some serious behavior problems. There were also some changes in his schedule. I know a couple of weeks is nothing compared to what you are talking about, but it was a major change for him.

We had this ABA create social stories and that helped. He had his teacher make some changes. We went over pictures where he was happy. We also tried to do more fun things while acknowledging it was ok to be sad. We figured the less time he had to dwell on it the better, fake it until you make it theory. It helped and made us feel less helpless. He is still a tiny bit moody, but way better.

I am so sorry, 9 is too young to be depressed. It must be so hard on both of you.



Aspie1
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10 Nov 2014, 8:05 pm

whatamess wrote:
Take him out of school and homeschool if you can or sign him up for an online program. I don't like most psychologists or schools?I don't think most truly do a good job trying to understand our kids, but rather just attempt to change them into someone they are not?

Agreed! Most children's psychologists tend to be overly focused on feelings and generally unhelpful exercises like deep breathing, rather than giving concrete advice. (The latter is a domain of life coaches, who are, while not mutually exclusive, separate from legally licensed psychologists.) While almost all life coaches are for adults, and often function as career coaches, there may be a handful that can work with children. Be wary of the title "counselor". They usually "work for the school", which mean they protect the school's interests, rather than your child's. (For an adult comparison, think of how HR usually protects managers and not low-level employees.) Or they may be Rogerian psychologists, which means they specialize in talking about feelings. Which is a VERY difficult topic for most aspies, and even when they tell the truth, the answer they most commonly get is "No, that's how you really felt. Try again." Over, and over. Until a child tell a blatant lie, and gets praised for their... wait for it... honesty.



BuyerBeware
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11 Nov 2014, 10:41 am

I'd disagree on things like deep breathing being totally unhelpful. Yes, they are useless as an end solution, but they do at least trigger a calming biochemical reaction that can get you into a better place for working out a solution that will work rather than reacting from fight/flight/freeze or anxiety/catastrophizing. They're a problem-solving step, not an end solution (hard thing for an Aspie that wants a solution, a way to get from black to white, and preferably yesterday), but they are a useful step.

Same deal with talking about feelings. It is not an end solution-- any sane person needs concrete steps on how to solve the problem, not just an Aspie (though it does seem to go double for us). But being able to identify the feelings one is feeling is helpful in making rational, logical, smart choices about what you want the solution to be and how to solve the problem.

Not to mention that talking about feelings is how you learn to work around alexithymia. And navigating one's autistic self around an NT world is easier if you can work around alexithymia. NOBODY has a magically great theory of ANY mind that does not work like their own. If you want understanding even from compassionate people, it helps a lot to be able to put feelings into words.


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"Alas, our dried voices when we whisper together are quiet and meaningless, as wind in dry grass, or rats' feet over broken glass in our dry cellar." --TS Eliot, "The Hollow Men"


sidney
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16 Nov 2014, 3:27 pm

Thanks for that link, Tollorin. This is really to the point and very helpful.

Quote:
In such depression, gifted children typically try to find some sense of meaning, some anchor point which they can grasp to pull themselves out of the mire of "unfairness." Often, though, the more they try to pull themselves out, the more they become acutely aware that their life is finite and brief, that they are alone and are only one very small organism in a quite large world, and that there is a frightening freedom regarding how one chooses to live one's life. It is at this point that they question life's meaning and ask, "Is this all there is to life? Is there not ultimate meaning? Does life only have meaning if I give it meaning? I am a small, insignificant organism who is alone in an absurd, arbitrary and capricious world where my life can have little impact, and then I die. Is this all there is?"

Such concerns are not too surprising in thoughtful adults who are going through mid-life crises. However, it is a matter of great concern when these existential questions are foremost in the mind of a twelve or fifteen year old. Such existential depressions deserve careful attention, since they can be precursors to suicide.

How can we help our bright youngsters cope with these questions? We cannot do much about the finiteness of our existence. However, we can help youngsters learn to feel that they are understood and not so alone and that there are ways to manage their freedom and their sense of isolation.

The isolation is helped to a degree by simply communicating to the youngster that someone else understands the issues that he/she is grappling with. Even though your experience is not exactly the same as mine, I feel far less alone if I know that you have had experiences that are reasonably similar. This is why relationships are so extremely important in the long-term adjustment of gifted children (Webb, Meckstroth and Tolan, 1982).

A particular way of breaking through the sense of isolation is through touch. In the same way that infants need to be held and touched, so do persons who are experiencing existential aloneness. Touch seems to be a fundamental and instinctual aspect of existence, as evidenced by mother-infant bonding or "failure to thrive" syndrome. Often, I have "prescribed" daily hugs for a youngster suffering existential depression and have advised parents of reluctant teenagers to say, "I know that you may not want a hug, but I need a hug." A hug, a touch on the arm, playful jostling, or even a "high five" can be very important to such a youngster, because it establishes at least some physical connection.

The issues and choices involved in managing one's freedom are more intellectual, as opposed to the reassuring aspects of touch as a sensory solution to an emotional crisis. Gifted children who feel overwhelmed by the myriad choices of an unstructured world can find a great deal of comfort in studying and exploring alternate ways in which other people have structured their lives. Through reading about people who have chosen specific paths to greatness and fulfillment, these youngsters can begin to use bibliotherapy as a method of understanding that choices are merely forks in the road of life, each of which can lead them to their own sense of fulfillment and accomplishment (Halsted, 1994). We all need to build our own personal philosophy of beliefs and values which will form meaningful frameworks for our lives.



sidney
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17 Nov 2014, 5:32 am

Quote:
Through reading about people who have chosen specific paths to greatness and fulfillment, these youngsters can begin to use bibliotherapy as a method of understanding that choices are merely forks in the road of life, each of which can lead them to their own sense of fulfillment and accomplishment


Any ideas on good biographies or roll models for gifted Aspies? Noting that he's only eight.



momsparky
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17 Nov 2014, 10:52 am

sidney wrote:
oh, also important: he's 8. So young to be depressed. :(


8-10 is one of those ages where NT kids make a gigantic leap in social skills and many kids on the spectrum appear to fall behind. For my own son, it was an incredibly confusing and upsetting time, and he developed all kinds of symptoms including depression and even tics. He couldn't verbalize what was going on exactly and he felt extremely lost. It was heartbreaking as a parent.

The good news is that as we got appropriate supports for him, things improved greatly. Having his speech assessed for pragmatics and getting therapy for that helped a lot - until that happened, we had no idea how difficult communication was for him, since it appeared that he knew how to communicate...or was even ahead of other kids (problem is, communication is something where you can't be ahead, right? To be successful, you have to communicate at the level of the people you are communicating with.)

It also helped my son to have his differences framed correctly. Does your son know about AS and what it means? Teaching my son to honor his differences and be able to advocate for himself using either disclosure or "I'm the kind of kid who needs ____________" has been very helpful - kids are actually much more respectful of differences when they are explained.

We had great success having DS read All Cats Have Asperger Syndrome. Cathy Hoopmann's books are helpful - we also liked the Blue Bottle Mystery books. We also read "Dude, I'm an Aspie" (a poster here) and when he was a bit older, two of the biographical books by John Elder Robison (also a poster here!) and eventually watched both Temple Grandin's TED speech and the Temple Grandin movie. There's a great sticky at the top of this board with recommended reading, some of which include this sort of thing.