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psychohist
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08 Jun 2011, 9:17 pm

Annmaria wrote:
He would alway express that he wanted to die, then it progressed to wanting to kill himself. He also said when he was at school he would have thoughts of a man with a knife that wanted to kill him. He said the man wasnt real it was just in his head. He doesnt say these things any more. But he does say that he has thoughts of hanging himself at school, and he can't get rid of them and then it causes him to have panic attacks.

Suicide threats are generally a cry for attention. This may apply to your son too.



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09 Jun 2011, 9:02 am

Quote Chronos Does he just randomly threaten to kill himself or does this occur when he gets upset about something? It he just fixated with killing himself and someone killing him, or things such as what happens to the body after death, graveyards, etc?

Hi Chronos

He randomly threatens to kill himself everyday, he repeats it on many occassion throught out the day and night. Sometimes he has very dark moods this has happened for a while. we had to take him of medication for his assessment with the local services things got pretty bad and he did try to harm himself. Back on the medication he doesnt get the dark moods.

He can have off days and his mood can be low and this can be worrying also, but not like the dark mood.

I have ask him what he thinks it will be like if he dies, he said its got to better than this, I said i wont be their of any of the family. He just feels it cant be worse than life. He doesnt talk about graveyards or afterlife just that he wants to die.

He is off school now although he will still say he wants to die or kill himself etc, but not as often when he is at school, he would come home at 5pm and this would go on all night, at the weekends he is less stressed.

Thanks

Annmaria



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09 Jun 2011, 3:53 pm

Annmaria wrote:
Quote Chronos Does he just randomly threaten to kill himself or does this occur when he gets upset about something? It he just fixated with killing himself and someone killing him, or things such as what happens to the body after death, graveyards, etc?

Hi Chronos

He randomly threatens to kill himself everyday, he repeats it on many occassion throught out the day and night. Sometimes he has very dark moods this has happened for a while. we had to take him of medication for his assessment with the local services things got pretty bad and he did try to harm himself. Back on the medication he doesnt get the dark moods.

He can have off days and his mood can be low and this can be worrying also, but not like the dark mood.

I have ask him what he thinks it will be like if he dies, he said its got to better than this, I said i wont be their of any of the family. He just feels it cant be worse than life. He doesnt talk about graveyards or afterlife just that he wants to die.

He is off school now although he will still say he wants to die or kill himself etc, but not as often when he is at school, he would come home at 5pm and this would go on all night, at the weekends he is less stressed.

Thanks

Annmaria


If you take him someplace he really enjoys for a few days, for example, on holiday someplace fun, does he say it then too?

If you've never done this it might be worth a try. I am wondering if while he is playing, the feelings associated with his difficulties at school and in life keep arising, and he can't articulate them because they are not caused by one specific situation, but rather a collage of situations that stress him, and even if it was one particular situation, he doesn't have the verbal skills to express them. He may even forget about the situation but the feelings still linger.

So if he stops saying he wants to kill himself when removed from that environment for a long enough period of time, and placed in a an environment which he experiences in a positive manner...perhaps Disney World, then it really isn't something innate to him, it's a product of his environment that he can't express.



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09 Jun 2011, 6:14 pm

Hi Chronos

Thank you for all you replies and spending your time on my son issues I really appreciate it, you have been very helpful :D

We are very fortunate and can afford to go on holidays, day out etc, but this doesn't change things for my son feelings.

We went to Spain as we have family there for xmas last year, he had just stop his medication again awaiting assessment. He was threatening to throw himself of the balcony almost everyday, we were there for 10 days. We had lots of fun days but his mood was still the same at times he seem to be enjoying himself but then the mood would return and the feelings were back again. I had to get a immediate appointment for him on returning home.

He always talks about needing to do fun things we try to accommodate this as much as possible but not overly. At times no matter what we do doesnt seem to make a difference.

I am not sure if this is all attention seeking, he is very attach to me maybe its some form of jealousy he does get upset and tells me that I love etc etc more then him. He can and does express his feeling to his father and has a very good relationship with his sister, of course at times this can be tested. If it just attention seeking behaviour which of course I am not sure, because he can get so low and has attempted to seriously hurt himself and has try to act out what he is expressing. This is why I am so confused!

School is definitely his biggest stressor, he has finished school for the last week and things are so much better. He has a spring in his step sometimes bouncing too high but I can manage that happly over the low/dark moods. I do feel that he is starting to express himself and really let me know whats going on for him, he can articulate his feelings much better and also to the local services so there is progress. But he will make statements like I am sad and the thoughts that he can't get out of his head, and that he just wants to die or he his going to kill himself and the hand gestures etc. He can seem to happy playing his games, on the computer, watching tv, outside kicking a ball and he will come in and say I am going to kill myself this happens often/daily.

But at the moment he is just much more happier in himself. The highs and lows not sure! we have a very long school break thank god he will not return till September. I have a teacher coming for the month of July whom works with children with Autism, she will work with my son for 10 hours a week. I suggest social stories, organisation, his anxieties if you can advice on anything else thanks. This is funded by our government!



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09 Jun 2011, 6:19 pm

Annmaria wrote:
Hi Chronos

Thank you for all you replies and spending your time on my son issues I really appreciate it, you have been very helpful :D

We are very fortunate and can afford to go on holidays, day out etc, but this doesn't change things for my son feelings.

We went to Spain as we have family there for xmas last year, he had just stop his medication again awaiting assessment. He was threatening to throw himself of the balcony almost everyday, we were there for 10 days. We had lots of fun days but his mood was still the same at times he seem to be enjoying himself but then the mood would return and the feelings were back again. I had to get a immediate appointment for him on returning home.

He always talks about needing to do fun things we try to accommodate this as much as possible but not overly. At times no matter what we do doesnt seem to make a difference.

I am not sure if this is all attention seeking, he is very attach to me maybe its some form of jealousy he does get upset and tells me that I love etc etc more then him. He can and does express his feeling to his father and has a very good relationship with his sister, of course at times this can be tested. If it just attention seeking behaviour which of course I am not sure, because he can get so low and has attempted to seriously hurt himself and has try to act out what he is expressing. This is why I am so confused!

School is definitely his biggest stressor, he has finished school for the last week and things are so much better. He has a spring in his step sometimes bouncing too high but I can manage that happly over the low/dark moods. I do feel that he is starting to express himself and really let me know whats going on for him, he can articulate his feelings much better and also to the local services so there is progress. But he will make statements like I am sad and the thoughts that he can't get out of his head, and that he just wants to die or he his going to kill himself and the hand gestures etc. He can seem to happy playing his games, on the computer, watching tv, outside kicking a ball and he will come in and say I am going to kill myself this happens often/daily.

But at the moment he is just much more happier in himself. The highs and lows not sure! we have a very long school break thank god he will not return till September. I have a teacher coming for the month of July whom works with children with Autism, she will work with my son for 10 hours a week. I suggest social stories, organisation, his anxieties if you can advice on anything else thanks. This is funded by our government!


If this sadness is short and intense but happens frequently, I wonder if they could be seizures. Has he ever had an EEG?



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09 Jun 2011, 6:31 pm

No he hasn't can you explain a what EEG is and means?



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09 Jun 2011, 6:39 pm

Annmaria wrote:
No he hasn't can you explain a what EEG is and means?


EEG stands for electroencephalography. It's used to detect seizures and other events that cause abonrmal brain waves. Some seizures cause brief yet potent moments of despair, a sense of doom, or anxiety.



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09 Jun 2011, 6:56 pm

Is this common with AS or does if effect everyone? do I go to my GP and request it or how do I go about in getting him tested. I really dont know anything I can research it and educate myself. What exactly will it tell me and what is needed to help him? And if this is positive what course of action do I take?



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09 Jun 2011, 7:14 pm

Annmaria wrote:
Is this common with AS or does if effect everyone? do I go to my GP and request it or how do I go about in getting him tested. I really dont know anything I can research it and educate myself. What exactly will it tell me and what is needed to help him? And if this is positive what course of action do I take?


Not really with AS, but with low functioning forms of autism, epilepsy is fairly common. It might be a long shot but you might want to run it by with his doctor about whether his dark moods could be seizures. That's what EEG's test for.



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09 Jun 2011, 7:28 pm

This reminds me my son does alot of odd behaviours with his body, at times he will stand directly in front of me, and does something its hard to describe while writing but its like an electric shock going through his body. His whole body will wobble but he is fully conscious he will only stop if I touch him or tell him. This use to happen for a long time but has stopped recently. I just thought it was something he saw on tv because he copies everything.

All I am searching for is to understand, what does this mean, how can it be treated, and if it can be treated succesfully does what does it tell me.



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09 Jun 2011, 7:46 pm

epilepsy runs in my husband family, his 1st cousin I am sure how to describe what goes on for him but he need 24 hour care predominant autistic not sure if this is the right descripition. I also have a 1st cousin predominant autistic, not sure if he suffers from epilepsy but is what I suspect. What does this all mean for my son does he have AS or is it more/less serious not totally sure about the information I am giving but my cousin is in a mental hospital, and my husband cousin is been looked after in the same manner.

I not sure what all this means



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09 Jun 2011, 7:52 pm

I also have down sysdrome in the family again 1st cousin and others that I don't have contact with. My son is functioning I do have all these fears but I just want answers so I can manage things and my son can have a good life. I do feel if we understand his needs he can achieve a very successful life.



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09 Jun 2011, 7:59 pm

I am not sure but maybe my realitives and my husband suffer from epilepsy because of the medication they are taking.



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09 Jun 2011, 10:34 pm

Annmaria wrote:
I am not sure but maybe my realitives and my husband suffer from epilepsy because of the medication they are taking.


As I said,speak with your son's doctor about the possibility. They can do an EEG and if he does have seizure activity it can be controlled with anti-convulsants.



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10 Jun 2011, 12:49 am

Annmaria wrote:
I can accept the label AS but schizophrenia scares me


I'm just going to jump in here. I really don't know what your son has (although much of what said can point towards the schizophrenia spectrum!) Have the doctors explained why they think he is schizophrenic? Have you explained why you do not think so? That way they can discuss it with you, tell you if you have a valid argument against the label, etc.

Let's just say your son is schizophrenic. Ignoring the label out of fear (and I can totally understand your fear!) can be very harmful for him. No offense, but that is the LAST thing you should do. Ignoring the label is not going to make it go away, if that is what he has. If he IS schizophrenic, he needs to be treated for schizophrenia, not autism. So, IMHO, you need to figure out 100% for sure, then whatever it is, schizophrenia or autism or even something else, fear or no fear, you need to accept it and do what you can to help him get through this. From what you wrote about his obsession with suicide, I would be MORE scared of letting diagnosed schizophrenia go untreated than accepting a label that is just that: a label (and does not change who is no matter what other label you might choose to give him).

Again, I am not saying I know your son is schizophrenic. I AM saying that it is definitely not impossible, and you definitely should keep an open mind because the situation does sound serious. Oftentimes one of the biggest mistakes a parent can make is to ignore an issue like this because they do not want to deal with the illness OR because they do not want the child to be stigmatized. I think serious consideration should be given to having a long talk with the diagnostician and analyzing why he may or may not have schizophrenia. If he is on a two year waiting list for ASD, and IF he doesn't even have ASD, that will be two years lost of potential necessary treatment. I would just look into it a bit further if I were you, and not dismiss it so quickly.



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10 Jun 2011, 6:01 am

Finding out my son's needs is my biggest priorty, I have battling with this and looking for answers since 2006, I had always felt something was amiss well before 2006 but my worries were dismissed.

He is going to the local services for weekly reviews, filling in questionaires etc to find out what is the correct diagnosis. I will deal with whatever the label is but I was just expressing my own fears from experience of other family members.

I took my son to a private psychiatrist, who is the best in this country and regonised in europe, not saying he has not got it wrong, he writes many books on Autism, is a lecture in our biggest unversity etc. He has given my son the diagnosis and we have meet him on sereval occassion. As I mention before he lives some distance, also he gives the diagnosis and then refers you on to the local services and this is where we are at. I have had huge battles with this service, My son got the diagnosis of ADHD, ODD from the same psychiatrist and the local services did there own assessment and said he didnt meet the criteria and that it was his home circumstance rather than any mental health issues.

Now my son has AS diagnosis from the above psychiatrist, and they are dismissing this, (although they have referred him to the ASD Services). They are now suggesting that he could be on the schizophrenia spectrum and its the early stages of this assessment. I will go back on tuesday my son filled out a questionaire for OCD and see what the outcome is.

I was looking for information, so when we do get to the end of his assessment I will understand what I need to ask. I never looked up the crieteria on schizophrenia spectrum I didnt realise how close the symtoms are to AS.

Whatever the outcome I will just be happy to be able to start managing my son needs with whaterver diagnosis.

Annmaria