Really need some advice

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I'm not being harsh. I'm being honest. Her experiences may differ from mine, but if they do not, reality is a good idea to be prepared for. We NEEDED breaks from our own kids too, but we never really got any.

The truth isn't always pretty or easy to accept, but it is what it is. It's a good idea to be prepared for the fact that things COULD get even more difficult. Ever heard the song lyrics. "I beg your pardon. I never promised you a rose garden?"

Would it be better to paint a rosy picture?

The only reason I said get him out of there is that the situation at that day care is clearly not safe. No way on earth would I leave my child in that kind of danger no matter how much I need a break. Sorry.

Thanks for your response, we are in a very rural area outside of a city with a high crime rate. So, there are more options if we drove the 20+ minutes into the city, but I do not feel safe with that idea either. There are some suburban area's in between, that I've been keeping my eye on.

I've been checking Craigslist regularly, and I'm not even finding postings in our area at all. I did check Care.com, and we would have to pay at least 5X the rate that our current provider is charging to afford any of the special needs providers on there, which I am considering doing. It's just so much money, for so little help :/

I think that is a great idea. Very low key

I think one big, big BIG difference between her situation and the many I faced with my child is that her child is HAPPY in this home and there have NOT been any incidents to date, just things the mom has noticed and is worried about.

My son would have been kicked out by the provider by now, telling me she couldn't handle him, that he was not suited to group care, or that he clearly was not happy. I very much know the reality of not being able to find anything that works (although we did eventually find a part-time nanny for my work hours). That may be what lies ahead; hard to say. One obstacle at a time.

I've learned over the years to look to my child: a child that is thriving is in the right place, even when it doesn't meet our own picky standards. The safety concerns are important, but there is room to try to work with the provider first. If that all that proves fruitless, THEN she has to think about the balance and if the child should be pulled. But situations that are happy ones for all concerned are darn difficult to find, and I wouldn't let go of one over things that could be issues, but are not currently actual issues.

One of the hardest things for me to do as a parent has been to learn to let go, but let go is exactly what I've had to do over and over and over again. If I hadn't done that, I would have kept my son from truly living. I spend a lot of time scared to death for him; that seems to be just the way it is. I'm protective, that is my job, but his is to live life to the fullest. I close my eyes, take a deep breath, and let go. Then pray I've made the right decision for the moment.

I will note that if I recall the conversations a few months back correctly, I was putting a break for this poster in the "needed" column. If the safety concerns reach a tipping point, she'll make that decision, and change how the needs are balanced; that is what we all do, isn't it? Respond to the most urgent need in the moment, because meeting them all is pretty impossible.

I think the point I was really operating on was the need for self reliance more than the safety issue.

Regardless of whether there is or is not immediate danger (that has to be considered on a case by case basis by those directly involved and with first hand knowledge, of course, and I may have been assuming more than I should have based on my own experiences), over the course of time (long term), being the parent of an autistic child anywhere on the spectrum will require developing a lot more self reliance than "normal."

I know my own experiences were probably extreme. I have three kids on the spectrum, and am on the spectrum myself, so my situation is probably more extreme than most. However, being on the spectrum myself presents challenges all by itself. Add to that three kids on the spectrum, and it's far more challenging. Considering that I've been able to deal with it despite all odds, and managed to maintain some semblance of sanity, that can, and does, cause a little "if I can do it, anyone ought to be able to" slant to my approaches to help others out with their problems.

Also, I admit I can be blunt. I do feel that the truth is better than stroking sometimes. That may be just my own AS coming through.

I never do mean to be harsh or blunt. I'm just getting to the point as quickly as I can, otherwise I end up writing virtual novels nobody has time to read.

Yes, we all need breaks, but the reality can be that we can't get them as often as we want to or need to, if we get them at all. Autism is a very tough thing to deal with if you have it. It's even tougher if you have it and your kids do to. I really don't have a clue what it's like for those who have kids with it, and do not have it themselves. I would imagine it's pretty scary sometimes having no first hand understanding of what your kid is going through.

I did have some understanding of it having been through it myself, so in a way, I suppose that is an advantage. But it's only a partial advantage, because trying to deal with autistic kids when you have autism yourself presents it's own challenges, some of which are extremely frustrating.

Whether we as parents "get it" or not though, there is a strong necessity to develop a sense of self reliance because whether or not we are also on spectrum, WE know our kids better than anyone else, even if we DON'T really get them as well as we'd like. There's a lot about my own kids I don't get, because we are all so different from each other.

What I was really trying to address wasn't the safety issues. It was the OP's reference to being overprotective. My intention was to support her efforts to protect her son. That her concerns are valid.

My apologies if that wasn't as clear as I would have liked it to be, but that was what stood out to me in her post. I don't think you are being overprotective. I think your concerns are very valid.

I can cite you many things that have happened over the years that, if we had not been so protective (whilst being accused of being over protective by a lot of very well meaning people), all three of our kids would be dead by now. And that is no exaggeration.

I am a little late here.

I think it doesn't sound safe, either. I think it is at a level of, work to get him out as soon as possible, more than pulling him immediately.

Also it doesn't sound like a place where kids do more than wander around and get played with a little.

I have a strong feeling that kids need a tiny bit more structure than that as they get to be slightly older, maybe in 6 months or less. There is a balance, and my son does horrible with a too-rigid structure, but he does even worse with no structure.

So I think you need to see about your other options and the respite care coming through, things like that. It doesn't sound like a great environment. Here I could find a home daycare with more structure, but still flexible. It does cost more, b/c the provider is doing more work. They are not taking care of other things at the same time. Also prices may come down when he turns 18 months.

It's true, he is very happy and thriving in this environment. There is a boy there that is his exact age, who does not overwhelm my son as other toddlers have, so he's more willing to engage with him. The provider asks questions about autism, and seems generally interested in educating herself. Literally everything is wonderful and I could not ask for more, except for the safety concerns.



Also true, I very much need childcare at this point in time. If I pull him from this daycare, I have to find another one, which is proving to be very difficult.

FWIW, I do not think that Mr. Xxx is being harsh. I really don't.

From my years of experience in online parenting forums, I will say that sometimes people fail to give honest feedback in an attempt to remain "supportive." I had a personal experience in which I did this. I kept my mouth shut about a potentially dangerous situation because I did not want to offend anyone, rock any boats, or appear "unsupportive." In the end, it turns out that I should have spoke up instead of just joining the line of people offering "support." I feel very lucky that the situation did not involve loss of life or limb, but it was a situation in which negative consequences occurred.

Lady Katie will have to do what she feels is best. But I think all people are able to make better decisions when they consider the pros and the cons of any action they take. As parents, we have to be able to look at the potentially ugly consequences of our decisions because none of us are failproof. We all make mistakes. The consequences of some mistakes are small, but the consequences of others are large. All we can do is weigh the pros and cons and make the decision that is best for our family and our situation. But failing to consider the cons is never advisable, IMHO.

Usually if I cannot be supportive, I try not to contribute. That is clearly the "rule" on most parenting forums. I think it is an asinine rule and it makes me avoid many forums like the plague. But I will never stand by in silence again when I see a potentially unsafe environment. I don't think it is harsh, nor do I think it is unsupportive. It is honest, and it is caring.

FWIW, both of my kids were very happy in an unsafe environment before I took them out. Kids are not reliable judges of such things and someone can be a kind and nurturing person and still not have a clue about how to keep a kid safe. I would also say that when my daughter was a toddler, lack of supervision would have made her happy as a clam. To be left alone to her own devices would have been right up her alley because there would have been no demands placed on her, no expectations, no constraints, no rules. She would have sat in a corner all day peeling paper off of crayons and I would have picked her up with the biggest grin on her face. I would have never known she was being neglected, provided the care provider was smart enough to clean her up before my arrival. However, I do not think that kind of environment is in the best interest of a young autist.

Ladie Katie, I hope you can find something to work for you, but my honest advice is do not stop looking until you find something. This environment has trouble written all over it. It only takes one mistake to irrevocably change your life, and your son's. What you are describing is an environment that lacks supervision (on top of the lack of childproofing). My kids have NEVER touched the knobs on the stove and it is because I made it my business to see that that never happened. They also NEVER played in the toilet. Did they try both? Yes. But I watched them like a hawk and ensured these things didn't happen. To be honest, they did not have access to the bathroom or the kitchen unsupervised. Period. Too much potential for harm. This provider either seems to be lacking diligence, or to be overwhelmed keeping watch over her charges. And now she is adding another when she cannot properly attend to the first. For 7 kids 5 and under (I think that's what you said), the probability of bad things happening appears to be pretty high to me. If I were in your shoes, that may not be what I would want to hear, but I would need to take it into consideration when determining what needed to happen, regardless of whether or not I wanted to.

I do offer you sincere empathy. That age for my son was very difficult. He had me in tears at least once a day. I would not want to repeat it, and I remember how hard it was. I don't want you to feel like I am minimizing anything. As I said before, I almost feel bad speaking up because I know you really need this. But I would feel worse to sit by in silence and somewhere down the road have something bad happen and then have to sit there and think "Gosh, I wish I would have said something." Been there, done that. Heartbreaking.

Just wanted to make sure you are not restricting the search on care.com to the special needs providers. How much are the babysitters/nannies who are not special needs? Have you tried posting a position on craigslist or care.com and seeing if you get any responses?

Your husband could also ask his coworkers with children where they find babysitters and daycare. Sometimes employers offer a benefit where there is a phone number you can call to get assistance. I can't think of what they call it, but usually they can give recommendations for counselors, daycares, etc.

If you're in a small town, there's got to be something people use locally to sell small items and post small jobs -- a local newspaper or a bulletin board at a grocery store or church. That would be another place to post a "help wanted" ad.

Another thought. Home Health Aides rarely make much over minimum wage. You may be able to find one who would rather take care of a kid than an elderly person. They often look in PennySavers and similar venues for jobs. It might be a place for you to look.

I also found luck looking for SAHM's with little ones. I found two who were willing to come to my home for fairly cheap because I didn't mind if they brought their kid with them. Solved their problem, and mine.

I'm pretty laid back and could probably be the last parent in the world that someone would call overprotective, but that does not sound like a safe place!

She's not keeping an eye out for things that could actually kill a kid. I've never been one to keep my eye on a child every waking minute of the day, but I also wouldn't leave little kids with small stuff they could put in their mouths just laying around either. If her house was kept childproof (and by childproof, I mean safe for the smallest one that's walking around) then that's one thing. But it's not it sounds like.

Also, why are her knobs even on the stove when she's got little kids running all over the place? We kept ours off the stove for years until we could trust ours. He shouldn't have even been able to turn it on.

Accidents do happen and mistakes are made from time to time. However, it sounds like this chick is just an accident waiting to happen!

It sounds squirrely there & which is no big surprise since she not licenced. The main concerns seem to be lack of correct safety procedures and safeguards at the house and lack of supervision. Because she is not licenced, you really have no recourse to get these things corrected. I think discusion alone will probably be a waste of time. If she was safety concious she would have already have figured these obvious problems out herself.

If it was me I'd give up the daycare, save the money, and work on improving my management techniques with the child (ie. not going crazy). You can still look into a babysitter to give you periodic breaks.

Thanks so much for all of the responses, everyone. I've weighed the pro's and con's and took a few days over Thanksgiving break to let it all sink in, and I've decided that I am going to take him out of this daycare.

I think that I will go ahead and purchase her some stove knob protectors anyway, and hopefully have a small conversation about how you can "never be too safe" so that she'll hopefully reconsider how she's running things. I'm also going to tell my neighbors that we had some safety concerns.

My problem now is....

1) How do I bring this up in a tactful manner? I will likely be seeing the provider again at a weekly bible study and I don't want things to be awkward.

2) Am I supposed to give her some kind of notice? Or am I supposed to pay her for the next week or two? I have no idea what the polite thing to do is, my son was only in her care for about 7 weeks.

I'm not really sure what I'm going to do at this point. I am going to keep trying care.com and craigslist. Perhaps I will try having a stay at home mom come to our house (as someone mentioned) and see if that might be a better avenue to take. At the very least, our new service coordinator was able to connect us with a special needs playgroup in the area, so that will probably take care of the socializing issues that I was having before he qualified for early intervention.

Thanks again for all of the help, everyone.

This would be ideal, and I am doing cognitive behavioral therapy in hopes of that happening. My son does seem to be maturing a bit, so maybe there's hope. Would you happen to have any "management techniques" that you'd like to share?

On the removing your child, just tell her the last day when you pick your child up, or if he's not going back give her a call. With no licence I doubt there is any contract procedures to follow. Just pay for the time she actually watched your child. You don't necessarily have to give a reason, as you wouldn't have to in cancelling any service. If you feel the need to give one or she asks you can just say it was for financial reasons.

Your son, honestly, has a long way to go to true reasoning ability, which typically comes around age 6-7, and may be non-typical perhaps in your case. So the behavior management will be more basic, setting rules, reward the positive, do not reinforce the negative and sticking with them no matter what. It is simple to say, but of course hard to do sometimes. But if you do it will go much better in the long run. Fight the fights now when you have all the advantages and control.

As far as specific stratagies, it would be helpful to know what specifically was difficult. You mentioned playground environments, but what else (ie. noise, crying, constant intereaction, etc.).

One safety trick I liked was to crawl around on your floor on your belly and see what hazards you can find from that perspective. Look up under tables for sharp screws protruding, things easy to pull down, loose objects to swallow, any outlets he can get to, etc.

One thing I'm reading here - seems like you are looking for a provider that can deal with a special-needs child and that is limiting your possibilities. Many, many babysitters and nannies and daycares can handle a special-needs child as long as you tell them what to do and they're willing to do it.

I think tact is not what you need to be worried about, here: you're not doing the woman any favors if you candy-coat what she's doing wrong. Myself, I would just say "we've found a placement that works better for us" without explaining, but I'd (anonymously) mail her a brochure of some kind on babyproofing and home day cares (here's one: http://ianrpubs.unl.edu/epublic/live/g1 ... /g1643.pdf and it lists more on the last page, including a page from the CDC. Obviously, your concerns are echoed by both local and federal authorities.)

In future, you can have that PDF in hand when you interview a new place, and let them know you are looking for a placement that not only supports your child emotionally and socially, but meets those standards of basic safety.