suggestions - Aspie children sticking to homework until done

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I am the exact same way >_< I do understand how you're reluctant to use threats, but I'm afraid I don't know any other way. My parents for example will hold the prospect of revoking my computer usage away if there is something that really needs doing. It's not pleasant but it works.

Having said that, I have found a way to complete things like essays myself, I kind of merge it with my computer time. Few minutes on a game, add a bit to my homework, and so on. By the end of an evening i've usually completed whatever it is I was doing.

My problem was a short attention span, I managed to counter that by working "little and often" to get things done over the course of an afternoon/evening interwoven with time for leisure.

Sorry I can't be more help, but I hope my personal experiences can be some use to you here.

This is so interesting, just getting everyone's input.

I completely agree that homework is ridiculous. It is just busywork, and it's really annoying busywork.

I also agree that video games are not good, especially for kids with Aspergers who need socializing opportunities. My son does go outside a lot (weather permitting), but when it's winter and snowing outside, video games are the only release for him. He mostly plays DDR, so at least he gets lots of exercise. And he is enrolled in Cub Scouts, two social skills groups during the week, and numerous church activities, so he gets lots of socialization through these activities as well as when he goes to movies or to friend's houses. I would say he has less social opportunities than NT kids, but when I think about it, he probably has the same -- since so many NT kids are completely wrapped up in sports activities that take most of their time (and are promoted by their parents).

I just bought a Time Timer, and we are using that sometimes. I like to use it for other situations where my son's mind wanders, such as brushing his teeth, combing his hair, etc. It's amazing how long these activities can take. And I really want him to use the Time Timer, I don't want it to be a clock ticking and another thing that causes him stress. If it helps him understand the concept of time, then it's a great tool.

I think one of the BEST bits of advice is the idea to do the "Few minutes on a game, add a bit to my homework" routine. He may not be mature enough to do that currently, as I can easily see him getting too into the game, and never coming back to the homework. But in the future, when he's gained some maturity, that may be the way to go.

We did try having him wear his Ipod while doing some spelling homework -- and he did do it in a timely manner. Maybe the Ipod helps to mask other distracting sounds. My son initially didn't think it would be helpful -- he was afraid he would spend too much time singing with the songs on the Ipod, and not doing his homework -- but we tried it last night, and it seemed to work. I'm not sure how effective it would be with Math homework, though, where one really needs to concentrate.

I will try and see if I can get a limitation on homework at his IEP meeting in preparation for middle school. I never really wanted to do that before, but I can really see where he will have no life at all if the homework demands increase. He's a great kid -- I don't want him to have to stress out as a result of school demands.

Kris

one thing I am going to do next time we have our IEP is to have it put in there that I can "veto" homework if I deem it necessary. For instance if he has had a really bad day, or if we have OT that day and there just physically isn't enough time! As long as I don't abuse it I don't see where this should be a problem!

I'm going to go out on a limb here --

it occurred to me, after I wrote my last post on this thread, that we as parents complain about homework and how useless it is for our kids. That it's just busywork.

But then I thought about it, and remembered that the difference between my child with asperger's and an NT child is that my child has, in the past, needed to do something about 100 times before he "got it." For example, when he was four, I must have taught him 100 times how to buckle his seat belt before he actually got it. Learning to tie shoes was the same. Getting into a morning routine is the same. I have two other children, and they maybe took 10 learning experiences before figuring something out.

So, does this mean that homework may be a GOOD thing? That the constant repetition of concepts might be a good thing for our kids? It would be good, if it didn't take so much time . . .

Kris

My ten year old has the same problem with wandering attention. I did find that he concentrates alot better if he exercises a little before he sits down to work. He has a trampoline in his playroom and is always willing to go jump.

My 12 yr old has the very same trouble staying in one spot long enough to finish a page or two of math problems. What I know he can intellectually finish in 20 minutes takes him 2 hrs of on again/ off again battling distractions. Having 3 younger siblings (a 4 yr old sister and 2 Aspie brothers) make things a bit more difficult for him. My husband is also very inconsistent with keeping tabs on the homework situation.
We have also instigated 30 minutes of down time after school for him to play Nintendo (his passion) but that's his only time to play and it's limited to 30 minutes. More than that and he's a hyperactive mess for the rest of the evening.
I do allow him to complete his homework at his desk in his room while listening to Nintendo music that my husband downloaded onto his computer. He actually focuses a lot better when he has that option. Most often though he will do his homework in my office or at the kitchen table so he can ask for help. These are the places he is most distracted and more apt to suddenly run from the room to play with his brothers or hide behind the sofa.
When he has more homework I always break it up. Finish one page and he can jump on the trampoline or watch tv for 15 minutes.
He has teachers that do completely different things regarding homework though and that makes it a bit difficult. His math teacher has told him he doesn't have to finish anything, just do as much as he can. He's smart enough that he's used that to his advantage more than once and even convinced me that he was told to only to half a page, etc. His English/social studies teacher though takes every incorrect or skipped question as a direct offense and refusal to do his work. She is consistently giving him F's on work that was finished correctly by mistallying his scores. When confronted she claims to have fixed her mistake already, but she never really has. He also has a teacher's assistant that helps 6 other kids and has 2 Aspie sons of her own, but seems completely clueless in regards to what he needs help with and what he doesn't.
Wow, just realized how much of a rant I went off on! Sorry! Guess this is a bit of a sore subject!

Let's try again: let him take breaks, let him have down time after school, and if it's too much for one day request that he be allowed extra time on certain assignments (written reports, etc.)
Good luck!
~Michelle

the last years 'days with homework' were always difficult,
there was a time that schoolbooks were thrown into the kitchen,
but it is a little better now (not to speak of the fact i'd sometimes be attacked)

we do timing, breaks, little sword battles for 5 minutes and then 5 minutes homework till it's done, etc. we have healthy weekends with cycling and swimming. and we do care not to pay too much attention to every detail all the time in order not to give him a 'king'-status either.

but mainly we do his homework (our son is ten), we do insist on the fact that he has to show it that he knows how it works and he has to write it down himself (big effort), and when he has to learn something by heart he has to do this himself of course (with his father or me telling all about the facts he needs to know)
other than that he is performing quite good at school,
but the energy we already spend on homework is really out of proportion (fortunately our daughter does all by herself...)

the worst moments are when he doesn't understand something or when he has to correct something he failed earlier.
(he has improved his sence of 'failure' though, when he was about 7 years old he thought he performed badly with an 8 or a 9, cause he had made 1 or 2 'mistakes')
he is very depressed when he has failed, and it costs us a lot of talent to convince him that it's not the end of the world.

zannemarie, did you talk about homework on another forum? could you perhaps paste the link here ?

Chelbi, your comment "What I know he can intellectually finish in 20 minutes takes him 2 hrs of on again/ off again battling distractions" perfectly describes what we are going through. We have him do his homework in the kitchen because he needs us there in case he needs help. He is doing much better intellectually this year, but he still has these "daydream" periods where he just completely loses focus. I would LOVE the idea of his going up to his room to complete his homework, and we do that with reading homework, because there's so much less distraction. But with math or communication arts, where he needs help from us, he also needs to be near us in the kitchen, which brings all the distractions. I suppose we could use walky talkies from room to room, whenever he needs to ask questions?

lemon, you brought up this concept of healthy weekends. I think that's becoming more and more important -- getting outside (or even inside) and doing lots of exercise. There was a big piece on the TV the other morning about the importance of exercise helping intellectual development in people, mostly with executive functioning (which is exactly what we're talking about here). So I began to wonder about the idea of a lot of physical exercise to help with executive functioning with autism/aspergers syndrome. I also know what you're talking about when you say that you mainly do his homework. We try to not do it, but if we're up against a time constraint, or it's getting really late at night after four or more hours of homework, we just do it and get it over with. Lucky for us, so far our son doesn't seemed to be too bothered by the idea of failing. He's very easy-going about this sort of thing. (of course, there are other things . . .)

Zanne-marie had really WONDERFUL ideas in her posts in the General Autism Discussion section with the thread having the same title as this one -- "suggestions -- Aspie children sticking to homework until done". It's currently on the first page (as of 3/21/07 in the afternoon) because I added a comment to the thread.
Kris

My kid's OT says he can focus better with an interactive metronome going in the background. I'll have to try it out and let you know if it helps with homework here.

Read this article today, on this very forum --

http://www.columbiamissourian.com/news/ ... p?ID=24655

It has a lot to say about the "space puppy" conundrum --

Another good perspective.

Kris

This is my first post on these boards. Hi. I am the father of a 17 year old boy with AS.

The homework problems will likely never go away, at least they have not for my son. He is very intelligent and a very responsible young man but he takes HOURS to do the smallest assignments.

We have had some luck FORCING an IEP that allowed us as parents a say in when his homework was done and acceptable. It took some negotiating but admin at the schools forced teachers to deal with it, to some extent. That made things better, but he still gets wheighed down and depressed over long term papers and assignments. We try to help and even sometimes we "ghost-write". Recently, we found he had ONCE AGAIN just stopped doing homework and was lying to us about being caught up and on target with assignments. It led to a breakdown for him that broke my heart. I had been asking if he was caught up and had stuff done, but had gotten neglectful about checking, I guess I was hearing what I wanted to. It led to a tearful discussion of his fears of post high school life. It became apparent that his depression associated with the stress from As had gotten worse. His Dr and I conferred and we upped his Celexa (SUI) to 60mg /day. That seemed to help, along with several heart to hearts we have had since then, and now I stop him, try to get him to look me in the eye, and we talk about his assigments and I get him to show me. His counselor at the school received a wake up call to be more attentive to the homework issues too.

So , I guess the advice is to call a PPT and get an IEP that gives you a say in how much homework he needs to do. And example of one thing we did was having him do enough math problems so that he can show he understands the concept - maybe a half dozen, as opposed to "problems 1 - 40 on pages 55-60". Then you need to communicate to the teacher that he did as many as you felt he needed to do and you were confident he understood the concept.

If you feel your son does not “need” to do the homework, then by all means, see if you can get it tossed out the window! There is a difference between “homework” and “busywork”. This is often done for children with ADHD or other disorders. I feel like I wrote your posts (that is happening a lot today…) Only, my son does NEED to do the work if he is going to have ½ a shot at catching up to his peers. He is SO BEHIND due to being unschooled for 4 years and really not doing anything. Academics just seem to elude him. Hard work and hours of homework is paying off however, his grades improved more then a full letter grade on average, on his last report card.


I agree 100% You can’t leave him wallowing in it for 4 hours. Like you, I need to stand over my son with a big stick or direct supervision to make sure he continually progresses to the next step. However, I know it is easier said then done. Just last week, I was the one having the meltdown over “homework incompletion” falling into old patterns I really need to move fully away from.

Can you find a way to allow him to finish it quicker? Perhaps seeing if you can get a recorder and have him give oral responses? It is SO SO much quicker to give an oral response then write it down. Or, perhaps even voice recognition software that can type for him? Again, this should increase his speed. My husbands aunt is getting us an organizing software meant for kids, to help them work through assignments and plan their days, that is pictorial and high interest. Maybe something like this would help?

Last night after asking him about his math work and being told he was done, I did a "snap inspection". On one assignment, 1 problem half done. On another, 2 and 1/2. When I asked my son, he said that he needed to get help from his teacher to "finish". So we had ANOTHER long talk about honesty, and I have him meeting with his math teacher today and possibly staying late today for help. At least he was ammenable to that.

**sigh** It never ends

It really does seem like it never ends. I think we all feel this way.

How can you love a child SO MUCH, and be so exhausted when trying to help?

I honestly don't think it ever ends. And after reading the article that I linked a few posts preceding this, obviously it is something 20 year old aspies fight continuously.

Is there any way we parents could configure some kind of program to work on this particular problem? Obviously, these guys CAN achieve great things, especially in their areas of interests. They do not WANT to spend time not accomplishing their goals -- it's just that some distractions are more interesting than the work at hand.

My husband and I have been talking about this over and over again. It's obvious that there is no program out there, currently, that deals with this specific challenge. But figuring out the answer, whatever it may be, is obviously the difference between somebody who has to live with their parents because they cannot finish an assignment on time, and somebody who can achieve their goals and go on to find a job they can enjoy and succeed in.

Just a thought . . .

Kris

How did that work out? That would work for me. Metronomes have a really good frequency for me and the constantly click of it is soothing.

Schleppenheimer, is he still having problems?

Sorry all, I happened to be up late and came in to look at the threads.

I did have a horrible time with math when I was young and actually couldn't multiply past 7X7 until I was in my 20's. I still have to break it down to do it (a real time killer on SATs and GREs let me tell you). Math finally made sense to me when I began working. I worked at some really low level job in a bank, but I saw all the transactions for every branch every night. There was something about seeing those transactions, interest and calculations that made it click for me and I never had problems understanding math again. I went from just about flunking math to getting A's in college. That was actually how I finished my B.A. (I had to have remedial math in college and couldn't even pass that for the longest time). For me I just needed to see how it was used in the real world. I couldn't make the connection of abstract math to the real world just in my head. Do the schools do this for the kids? I mean real, practical use of math? It really helps.

The other thing is finding a hook into his interest. An example of that would be using computer game characters to act out the problems. It might get the visual of them in his head actually acting out the problems so that he'll be engaged. Also, if you can tie it in with the interest to show a real life scenario that way (obviously not computer games in that situation), he might grasp it easier and engage. That usually works for me.

As for those term papers, break them down. Have you ever heard of info mapping? It's a communication style that many tech writers, trainers, policy writers, etc. use. Basically it chunks information into smaller pieces so that you learn how to work on just that piece at a time instead of thinking of the whole writing piece at once. Your child wouldn't have to decide how to break it down because they teach you how to break it down and you use those logical elements over and over. I wrote all my papers this way throughout college and I am an English major. Worked like a charm and I understood it. I also write for a living a now so it served dual purposes. It really demystified writing essays and term papers for me.

Again, if the term paper topic is something you can creatively figure out how to tie into his special interest, you will get him engaged quickly and keep him that way.

And remember, when they drift off to that place in their head where you are left with the "blank stare," that is space puppy. That's what my husband calls it. He just tells me, "Back to earth, space puppy, you're freaking me out." He also has cute things he says to me that are my clues to snap back when I start getting carried away. He'll say, "Das ist verboten." (My German spelling is horrendous so please exuse it. He's fluent, I am not.) He won't say it in a mean or even irritated way. He just says it in a gentle teasing way. It's just a signal we've designed to tell me when I've gotten stuck on a subject or I'm overreacting to stimuli or whatever. German makes me laugh for some reason and laughter always makes me snap out of it. You might try finding something like that with your child. It will probably work better and have less drama attached than some other things you could do. It also helps you keep your sanity.

Last, the I'm finished statement? I think he probably meant he was finished as far as he could go without help. I am really bad for saying things like that and completely understanding them when the other person gets an entirely different message. It just seems so clear in my mind what I meant that I truly believe everyone should get it. When my husband tells me what he thought I meant, it is always like this ah ha! moment where I suddenly realize it could be taken an entirely different way. Many times he could have seen that as dishonestly, but it truly was that I meant something other than what he thought. It is possible this happened with your child. We are really bad about understanding how other people are going to interpret our statements. I saw a really good study today that may be the start of figuring out why this is. Here it is if you want to read it. I can tell you from this side that it made a lot of sense to me. http://www.sciencedaily.com/upi/index.p ... rch-11.xml This was one of the few studies where I felt like yes! That could be what's going on because it explains so many things I simply do not get no matter how hard I try.

Anyway, I hope some of that helps. I don't often come in here since I don't have children. I can only tell you what happened and happens to me and hope it helps. Good luck!

Tell all the space pups hi!

I have tried using the calander function in MS Outlook on his laptop, I guess that helps a little. I am going to attempt to force the school to get him a job coach for this summer, so he can begin exploring the working world with some support and structure.

But he's so smart in non-organizational ways, I fear hurting his feelings or insulting him by telling him he needs help with stuiff like that. Truly a double edged sword.