hi ive not posted for ages, but really need some advice

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Last edited by ouinon on 20 Mar 2008, 3:04 am, edited 3 times in total.

Why does this sound like it is school the problem?

What do you mean? Sounds like a kid with servere ADHD/AS.

Check out the following two links:

http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/undergro ... logue5.htm

which has a mother's account of her officially diagnosed, and much medicated, ADHD/ADD child "recovering" completely within weeks of beginning homeschooling.

http://www.thememoryhole.org/edu/school-mission.htm

A psychologist visiting a school says about one ADHD child, "Perhaps he is just bored." And the teacher agrees that this is very likely, but says, "..but they need to learn to handle boredom, or else they will not be able to hold down jobs". Intolerance of boredom/school is now an illness, just it's not quite yet for the record. But it is powerful selection.

The irony is that Gatto is invited all over by big businesses because they now want workers with more initiative, while still being good consumers. Difficult to engineer that one!!

Last edited by ouinon on 21 Mar 2008, 3:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

And Gatto refers to this boredom as something each child needs to learn how to deal with as it is the resourceful child that grows into an adult who doesn't require amusement but can find things to do, hobbies, intellectual pursuits.

Thank you for the site, links etc. Gatto is fascinating to me and I'm going to read some more of his writing as his views are very similar to my own.

I know a few drop-outs who are self-made-entrepeneurs, lawyers, professors, writers--all drop outs. Maybe it's hereditary? No kidding. Maybe it goes against our grain,this thing called compulsory education. I had a negative experience myself, thrown in with the masses, I was like a lost sheep and shut down. I couldn't wait to get home. I read at home, studied, learned--no help from school. The most interesting teachers knew their content, had something interesting to say, and I listened--that was about it. I hated the building, the smells, the noise--it seemed strange and foreighn to me.

It is as Gatto suggests an attempt to make everyone the same, good citizens, and in the process kids lose thei rsense of wonder and curiousity. They are stifled. Thrown together with so many other kids keeps them young. They actually losse their sense of identity rather than gain it.

I think Aspies have an even more difficult time with it because they prefer adults! My son would rather hang out with the teachers. He's always been this way. He's not sure where he fits in--the teacher accepts this and is charmed--thank goodness. It could be problematic, depending on the teacher!

Thanks again! I can't wait to get to the bookstore.

equinn

I have a problem with every issue being turned into a homeschooling issue.
This thread is NOT about homeshooling.
It is about medicating/not medicating ADHD.

Did you read these two links, especially the first one?

I thought this thread was about advice for a boy diagnosed ADHD. I believe that homeschooling is often an astonishingly effective "cure" for ADHD/ADD, amongst other things. And that it is important to let people know that ADHD is often a school-produced "illness". "Attention-deficit/hyperactivity" labels are frequently just fancy medical terms for children who cannot bear school. For whom school is an intolerable environment. As it often is for all but the strongest and/or least sensitive.

Am I supposed to refrain from posting about homeschooling because most people don't understand/know how harmful state education/school is?

I had already noticed that apparently one reason that I should not mention homeschooling all over the place is because "not every parent can do it". But that I should also refrain because some people disagree with me, disbelieve me, or know nothing about its importance in psychological health, seems just a little unreasonable.

Last edited by ouinon on 21 Mar 2008, 8:25 am, edited 2 times in total.

You are out of line again, and I am beginning to think you are a troll.
Saying that schools produce ADHD is like saying refrigerator mothers produce autistic kids.
As the mother of a child with servere ADHD, I am startled and aghast. ADHD is an organic disorder.
Using a "one-size-fits-all" approach i.e. schools produce all problems, and homeschooling is the answer to all problems, is quite bizar, and I do not wish to debate it further.

I do not see in what way I am out of line. Certainly don't see how I qualify as troll.

Did you read the links? I have read other articles/papers on how ADHD may frequently be the "symptoms"/manifestation of a sensitive/independent/creative child's reaction to the inhuman nature of much state schooling, the illogical instructions, idiotic rituals and pointless tasks, time wasting, noise, and pressure. Seriously. And how in some/many cases it vanishes if child is removed from school.

State education is a huge force of social engineering; it exerts immense pressure on children to conform/comply.

PS: I did not say "all"; I very carefully/precisely said "often", "may", "some", "perhaps", because it is not black and white. I do not know if it applies in the above case, but I would rather let her know about this possibility, than her never know and medicate her son like the one in the first link I gave above.

For more info along the same lines , read Wikipedia at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversy_about_ADHD

And from elsewhere;

Diane Triplett. Education. University of Arizona.

And many of the experts quoted and referred to in the wiki article aren't even sure/can't agree if something that could be called true ADHD actually exists.

Mumto2, we have similar problems with our son at school. he is fine at home, but school is one big nightmare. he has had outbursts and hit teachers, thrown chairs around the room, headbutting, etc. his school were suggesting he is adhd also, but we do not agree. they say he has outbursts out of the blue and they cannot predict why. that is because the one to one person that should be supporting him is not properly trained in asds. there are always triggers for his behaviour. his one to one does not understand him, and i actually think that she triggers him a lot of the time! our son suffers anxiety from the moment he walks in the school gates. what are the teachers like at your son's school? are they trained in asds? maybe the school is at fault rather than your son.

what is your son like at home?

i am generally not a fan of medication, and will go on for as long as possible without. i think with the right support at school things will improve for our son. we find that at the beginning and end of terms our son becomes anxious. mondays and fridays are also bad school days because his routine is changed due to the weekend!

Hello there.

I was never much a believer in all of the "food additives" stuff until my son really started acting out at school. I looked around the house and just started grabbing anything "odd".

The first thing to go was cereals with sugars on them. He had always loved those "kid" cereals. I replaced them with the "plain" versions (which still have *some* sugar in them, but no where near the same levels). Then I grabbed all of the drinks that weren't plain juice. No "juice cocktails" or punches. They all seemed to have high fructose corn syrup and lots of dyes in them.

After I had done that, it wasn't much of a jump to just read all of the labels and take out all of the HFC. I've never allowed artificial sweeteners in our house, so that wasn't a problem.

All of this helped, but I had overlooked something rather large: I now call it "quiet bullying". No one in the class was pushing him around or anything, but they were making it impossible for him to DO anything. He would be sitting there, trying to concentrate, and things would go whinging over his head (balled up papers, bits of pencils, etc.). Or his crayons would go missing (he has to have a full box of unbroken crayons). Or (this one really bothered me), the "communal pencil jar" NEVER had a pencil for him, so he would be given a stubby one with no eraser.

This doesn't even count having to track down his books every day (the children would "move" them), having to "find" the work that was already turned in... you get the picture.

He was a very angry child, and I don't blame him. I tried "volunteering" in the classroom, but it didn't help, as all the activity stopped. I saw it when I would come early and peer through the window. I don't know if this is possible for you (it wasn't at his old school where he didn't have problems), but it might be worth trying.

(and yes, stims can be a lifesaver)

best,


2

Hi thanks for your replies, I would just like to ask are your kids in mainstream, my son is and I know he is able but unable to sit still etc etc, the one to ones are mums just like me and untrained in adhd or aspergers children which is something I am concerned about but what do I do? I can pay for a home teacher for him as we have a mortgage, another child etc etc, so do I send him to special school? He is very clever and I KNOW that. I spend my life worrying about his future and what will happen to him and Im at the end of my tether to be honest, I just want something to help him. I dont give him sweets - he does have bread though as if he doesnt he wont eat as he is so fussy with food, I dont give him chocolate or cakes (only as a very occasional treat) so I dont know what else to try really.

Cant pay sorry

The one thing ive noticed is that the kids tell him to do stuff because they know he will and this makes me mad, in mind this is bullying - I have my sons 12 month statementing review in a couple of weeks at his school and will be bringing this up - I think this probably goes on a lot and im my mind this is nothing but bullying.

I know that I'm not supposed to get polemical, and I really am not being.

I really feel for your trouble, and have no intention at all of being heavy. I just have a question, because i am not sure that i have understood your circumstances:

You say you could not afford a "home-teacher". Do you mean that there is there no parent who could be at home to homeschool your son? ( in other words you would have to pay someone). Because then i am absolutely not going to be able to offer any advice myself because we have solved things with home-un-schooling, and I have no experience of seeking outside the home support services. i wish you the best of luck and courage.

If on the other hand you or another parent could stay home most days to look after your son then I seriously think home(un)schooling might be really helpful/worth a try. Have a look at "A day in the life of a Homeschooler" thread . Or pm me. It is a very peaceful and reassuring approach.

But I don't quite understand if you meant there is noone or not, so will leave it there.

Best wishes.

o