Raised by Aspergers parent

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Agreed. Part of the problem for some of these "horror" stories is that I know, for one, that my parents were born in the 30's. In their 70's now, they have not grown up knowing that they are different, or that their children are different. They didn't even know that something was wrong! In my case (speaking only for myself), having an AS brother made it worse for us, as my parents were like "see all kids are NOT like you! Look at your brother!" So, it became personal in my case. Knowing what you're dealing with is half the battle! I'm sure AS parents of NT kids face the same type of challenges (broadly) that NT parents of AS kids face. Maybe if my parents had realized that we were just wired differently, that would have changed everything - on both sides. I know that when I found out about my dad (mere months ago), I now had an explanation for a lot of things that hurt me, and knowing he wasn't capable was a lot easier than having it be my fault for never being XXX enough.

Aud, just reading your post, I can see how much the different things your mother did (although sounds like she had issues above and beyond being NT/AS, as did mine...) effected you and your strong emotions toward them. It sounds like she didn't realize that you were fundamentally different from her, or if she did, she didn't care. Same for me. I said before that the irony wasn't lost on me that I'm sure growing up NT in an AS house is probably how every AS person feels in an NT house. But being able to realize not only fundamental differences but also individual differences puts you in a good position. A far cry from what someone like I, or even you, went through.

DW_a_mom is dead on - no bad parent ever wonders if they are a bad parent! Things can get crazy anywhere. I think you're definitely on the right track, and it sounds like you've done a good job with your younger siblings. As long as you keep flexible and an open mind, I'm sure you will be a wonderful parent.

I think the good thing about these threads and other places that talk about being raised by an aspie is it lets us aspies be aware of what effects it has on the child and how we parent or plan to. Like with giving out praises. An aspie may not do it because they don't see the point in it but then they go online and read about a child being raised by an aspie. How they were emotionally abused and how their parent was always critical of them and they could never do things that were good enough to please them. Then the aspie may realize why it's so important to give out praises. So the kid knows they can do something right and won't think they can never be good enough or are never good enough, they can never please their parents. That way they won't grow up to be emotionally damaged and have low self esteem. Plus there are parenting books out there that tell you what to do and what it does doe the child such as giving out praises and also talking to your infant, giving them love, telling them you love them. I just figure if an aspie wants to be a good parent, they will do anything like the books tell them to do because they want whats best for their child and they want them to grow up to be happy than bitter like the other kids who had aspie parents. I think that is logical enough.

The downside to these threads are an aspie can be scared out of having kids thinking they won't be good parents or worry about what if their kid grows up to hate them or gets emotionally damaged or thinks they don't care about them enough. Plus it carries on that ugly stigma about AS and them being bad parents.

Aud: I wanted to jump in and say that with my posts, I didn't intend to imply that my parents were bad parents, or that Aspies don't make good parents. I apologize if I did imply that.

I don't think of parenting as "all bad" or "all good". EVERY parent, AS or NT, has strengths and weaknesses, and much depends on how well the parents and the children happen to click. I tell my mom that she did a great job (when she says otherwise) because she did her best with what she had, and that she should have no regrets. I mean that.

The intent of my posts were just to get out some of the frustrations I have about my parents, and how knowing about AS gives me more perspective on what was frustrating me. I came to wrongplanet because I was trying to work out my frustrations, so I may have only given a part of the full picture.

My parents are wonderful parents in many ways. Their adherence to routine and discipline makes them very responsible. I was never the kid whose mom forgot to pick her up. Also, they provided for my brother and I very well and we had a comfortable life. They are always willing to give me as much time as I need. Even if what they say doesn't always help me, they are trying. I don't remember having "special interests" as a child, but over the past few years I have found a hobby that I like. My mom has tried to learn everything she can about that topic, even though it's not something that interests her. I've told her I don't expect her to learn that topic, but it's her way of showing how much she cares, and it's really nice to have someone to share my hobby with. (The issues I have with my parents are meltdowns directed at me, lack of emotion, and criticism without praise, but those issues don't tell the whole story.)

My parents do think they are perfect. If there's a problem- it's someone else's fault. They are not, as others have said, reading this forum trying to gain insight of what it's like to be an AS parent. The fact that all of you are participating in this discussion shows that you already are amazing parents. If my mom had said something like "I may not always be aware of what you need but I'm here for you. You just have to tell me what you need, and I will find a way to help you" it would have made a difference.

I've added (with moderator approval) a short head note to the start of thread to help the AS readers know what they are getting into when they read this thread. Let me know if you think there should be any modifications.

DW, I think the header's a good idea.

Hello all -- checking back in after a year and a half.

I wish I could say that things had improved in my relationship with my dad, but unfortunately the efforts at contact -- his and mine -- seem only to make things worse. The main stumbling block, I think, is the jawdropping absence of empathy, even what would seem to me the most basic sort of empathy. It's as if he has an idea of a daughter, and granddaughter, but can't hear or see or imagine the real ones, and finds correction extremely tiring and tiresome -- and gets upset when we don't match his imagined people, as if it's our job to match. Unfortunately the correspondence between imagined and real isn't too good.

He'll take some corrections -- for instance, he was corresponding with my daughter and suddenly got very enthusiastic, emailing her all the time and sending weird gifts. Which took her aback, because this is all very recent and he'd ignored her for most of her life, so out of the blue here's this weird guy she doesn't know who's all over her. I asked him to back off a bit and he did, though it was plain he didn't understand what the problem was. Similarly, he's quite well-off, but we're pretty poor -- I'm a single mom with no family around, and no help from other family members -- and suddenly he started telling her all about his fantastic trips to foreign countries, major sights, etc. All things she hasn't any hope of doing, and it causes problems; being a kid without money can be painful sometimes. Luckily I read the email first, reminded him that we are poor, reminded him that this sort of thing will hurt her feelings, and asked him to rewrite without reference to all the exciting and expensive things he's doing (without offering anything to her) -- maybe instead asking her about her summer, and what she was going to do. You could tell he wasn't excited about it, but he did it.

I realized the other day, though, that none of this is new. I came across a couple of old letters from him -- one from when I was 12, one from when I was 16 -- and they're long, clearly trying to reach out and connect, but the obliviousness is profound. In one he's talking to me as though I'm 30. I had no idea, at the time, what he was talking about, and am very glad now that I didn't, because among other things he was chattering away about leaving his job and how happy it would make him. I was in college at the time, and had he actually managed to leave his job, I'd have had -- quite abruptly -- no more money for school, and I'd have been worried to death. There was little or no interest in me, what I was doing, no questions that encouraged conversation.

I think he'd have been rather irritated to hear, at the time, that I had no idea what any of this was about, and didn't understand it. He still doesn't seem to understand what children are; he tries hard with my daughter, but there seems to be, in his mind, very young children, and then near-adults, and that's about it.

Anyway -- unfortunately, every contact with him is painful. My life really has been very difficult the last several years, and the fact is it's made much harder by single-parenting without the support or notice, frankly, of either parent, and the absence of a set of grandparents in my daughter's life. I've found it encouraging that my father suddenly wanted a relationship, but he seems not to understand how they work -- he'll pop up and want some sort of connection, but not understand that there are obligations that go with. You have to be nice, friendly; you have to be interested in the other person. And, if you're family, and the other person's in trouble, you're expected to help or at the very least be supportive in some way. You need to notice. He just doesn't. And the effect is -- he takes, but he doesn't give. And each time, it's a reminder of past neglect.

It's a real shame, because I can see that he's trying. And yet the experience is very painful for me, and frankly I don't have room, time, energy for it. I need to focus on taking care of my daughter, paying the mortgage, keeping myself together and healthy. Asking a beleaguered single mom to walk you through Family Relationships 101 when you do little to help her, and have been awol most of the child's life -- it's just not the thing to do. But my saying so doesn't get through. He has no conception of what my life is like, even though I've told him many times, in plain and vivid language. Again, the empathy, it just isn't there.

I've told him that I'm willing to talk to him again, but only with a therapist there, at least for a little while, so we can get some things sorted, maybe, with a mediator present. He lives far away, but I'm willing to skype in. He doesn't want this and tries to ignore it, pretend I haven't set this as a condition. And I'm getting tired of saying, No, not until we talk with the counselor there.

He is 72 years old, won't last forever. I don't think he's got many more years of energy for trying this. Unfortunately his timing is bad, and combined with his inability to understand either what he's asking of me or that a single mom hasn't time for this...I suspect it will end in a permanent break. I don't really know what else to do. He does have a therapist and I'd talk to that person if I knew who it was, but he won't give.

It's too bad. At this point, I just don't even like him. I don't think he's nice. I expect he'll find some tidy rationalization for why things didn't work out, but looking in the mirror won't be part of that process.

I am sorry to hear it hasn't gone well. I don't know what to suggest ... for now, I'll just offer empathy. Hopefully I can come back later and dig a little deeper.

You know, all we can ever do is our best, and we can't make others be more than they are. Sometimes that means the bridge won't make it across the river, unfortunately.

Thanks, DW.

Aud, I'm sorry this thread has been rough on you. Please know that just because other AS parents...well, gave us problems, it doesn't mean you're fated to be the same kind of parent. And I appreciate League_Girl's balance.

One thing that might be helpful to keep in mind is that it's not really as simple as saying to a child, "Well, I'm like this, and you're like that, so I'll just go ahead being like this, and you can go on being like that, and we'll get along that way." The problem is that there's more than you two in the world. The child lives in a social context, will do all his or her life. And in that context, certain things are expected, and there are real consequences if they don't happen. For instance: when the child's young, a parent, usually the mom, is expected to bond with other moms, support them, be supported by them, arrange playdates, and become friends so as to support the children's friendships and opportunities. Why? Because the children are too young to do it themselves, and because motherhood is serious business that requires allies and support. If this is work you can't or won't do, then talk with your partner about what he can do to fill that role. Otherwise, the likelihood is that your child won't be invited to the playdates and parties that wind up being formative and give them the kid-gangs they need to get along, and -- depending on where you live -- could be an outsider by kindergarten.

As the child gets older, other parents will still want to check you out, and will expect you to check them out, to ensure the families are good/safe matches for playdates and activities. Not doing this...well, you might get away with it, or your child might wind up with kids whose families are dysfunctional in ways that can be harmful, where there are serious problems and/or the parents are neglectful. And that's not likely to be good for your child. So you'll have to stay tuned in, socially. Teen girls whose parents don't stay tuned in also stand a greater risk of winding up with boys who use or prey on them, just because they're naive and nobody's looking out.

The need for you to stay connected in ways that the larger world expects continues when your child's an adult. Even if you don't care about holidays, for instance, most of the world does, and your child will be an object of pity if he has to answer the question, "Are you going home for the holidays?" with "No, I'll just stay here." And that will hurt him. Others won't understand why his family's so cold and uncaring, and some will even wonder if it's his fault, if there's something wrong with him.

If s/he has children, likewise, you'll need to show up as a grandparent. It's very hard for children to understand why their grandparents show no interest in them, don't visit, don't seem to know anything about them -- they think it's their own fault and feel defective. That's normal, and arguing with them about it isn't helpful. My father has very nearly run out of chances with my daughter; he's gotten interested in her and dropped her twice, has seen her twice in her life, and when he has sent gifts they've been not just inappropriate -- they show he doesn't know her, and he doesn't do anything that shows he's interested in knowing her. To her, it's very obvious what you do if you love someone and want to see them: you go and see them. And if you're a retiree with enough money to travel, and you don't visit, then it means one thing: you're not that interested. I don't know any helpful way of explaining this to him, but the next time he hurts her, he's done. She won't be letting him back into her life, though she'd remain polite. The sad thing is I don't know that he'd notice he'd been shut out.

Anyway -- essentially, you're committing yourself here to more engagement with the world, perhaps, than you'd ordinarily be comfortable with. If that's the case, resolve to push yourself a bit for your child, and to find others who can do the social and socialization work that isn't in you. If you try (in a smart way), your child will know it, and that will go a very long way in helping. Most children know love when they see it, and they tend to be pretty flexible in spotting it. What they won't handle well is chronic hurt; that's what you have to look out for, and if you're lucky enough to have a child who can tell you the problem, at all costs avoid defensiveness and trying to show the child that there is no problem. Just listen and take whatever you don't understand to your partner and/or a therapist.

Good luck with your pregnancy, and congratulations -

I'm not sure I even know where to start. I have suspected for some time that my mother is Aspergers. So I started doing some research and finding this forum and this thread pretty much confirms my suspicions.

I don't remember my mother ever hugging and kissing us as little girls and I don't think she's ever actually said she loves us. As a kid I thought that she was just "matter of fact."

She never saw the value in current culture for us. There was no popular books, toys or popular fashions as teens. There were no fun outings with the other kids to movies or skating or other activities. She simply never saw any benefit to fitting in or really even us having friends. A fair number of the kids in kindergarten already knew each other because their parents socialized with each other. I felt alone and left out much of the time because my mother had no friends that had kids my age. I don't remember her having any friends when I was a kid. There were people she knew from church we socialized with a few times until they did something to offend her. And anybody outside of family that she attempted to socialize with offended her in some way or another and went away fairly soon after getting to know her a bit.

Then when I was 12 things went to h*** in a handbasket. She married a sociopath. One of the things she's claimed since then is that he "changed just like magic on their honeymoon." I suspect the reality is she wasn't observant enough to see what he really was to start with.

She was never observant of the world around her. I could get away with practically anything by the time I was 13 since she was so socially inept and totally unobservant.

She has never had friends other than her own family and I really think if they weren't related both of my aunts wouldn't have anything to do with her. She always made snide remarks about my grandmother's involvement in the "Friendly Neighborly Club" and never had any real social involvement other than her sisters and the people at the church we attended. After we were a little older she went to work because our father had left and stopped sending money home. That's where she met her second husband.

Because her husband, (I'll never call him a step parent) was abusive towards me I found a boyfriend and got married when I was 16. She allowed him to abuse me. There just isn't any other way to put that. She would take my sister and leave the house and leave him to beat me. I know she knew what was going on or she wouldn't have left the house. That was bad enough but in the last few years she basically said it was all him and acted like she had no responsibility for what happened.

The lack of emotional warmth, physical contact and social ineptness are really just the beginning. There have been so many incidents it would be impossible to recount them all here. One of her favorite "jokes" when we were kids was "if you feel rejected, it's because you are."

Oh yeah, and there's the whole total inability to laugh at herself or take joking around or teasing. One of the worst incidents of social ineptness involved my father in law. They were all at our house one year for Christmas and he's a really joke around, give you a hard time kind of person. She got all offended about it at the time and was on the snotty side. The worst was a few years later when we were having Thanksgiving at her house. She started in about my father in law in front of my husband and just went on and on about how horrible he was. She totally had no clue that it might be hurtful for her to say the things she did about my father in law to my husband and everybody at the table were just horrified at her behavior.

I could go on for pages and pages but I am sure that many of you understand without me having to do that. While the individual experiences may differ some, the underlying themes are all pretty similar.

Hello all. This is my first post here. I've been reading so long my eyes are blurry. The posts are so sad and I can relate to many. Seems like a lot of the folks on here are older, as I am. I think a lot of the damage isn't realized until you get a few years on you.

My dad is, apparently, AS. I'll try to make this short...My mother left him when I was 5. (Mom is OCD with anxiety disorders of who know how many kinds...) Dad went into a drunken phase. I recall him driving me while not being able to talk...crying at the table while not being able to hold his head up...As a result, he totally forgot about me. I was left with my neurotic mother and her series of boyfriends. (She finally married one who tried to molest me, but that's another story)

Finally, dad married a woman with 5 children. I always felt like he liked them more than me, since he had so little to do with me. Visits were painful. We sat at the table and mostly starred at each other. He spoke so little, and I was a shy kid anyways. I thought he was God, and God didn't like me. He was so smart, rational and level-headed. Always very kind and patient with me when I was around, in contrast to my mother who was usually hysterical.

Now, I am staying with him, partly because his wife died and I don't think he would do well alone (some dementia), but also because I always wanted to spend time with him. I am just now discovering that he has this issue with aspergers although I also think he could have some narcissism, too. At first I had panic attacks...all it took was a cross word from him and I would break. I'm getting more used to it now but it is still very hard. He NEVER SMILES...never jokes, can't understand humor, is painfully slow and meticulous with EVERYTHING HE DOES. Nothing I do is right but I have to be doing something all the time. If you don't work, your are worthless...But now I am ranting...

Its too late to go into much more detail (and he gets up early everyday and expects me to do the same) but I have a few questions. Are these traits in common with Aspergers:

-extreme stinginess
-talking about boring things (details about something, i.e. people's names, family histories)
-wearing the same clothes over and over (and not bathing often...maybe that's some dementia)
-lack of appreciation for things beautiful
-jealousy (even for daughter)
-dependence on mate (due to inability to function)?

This has been an extremely enlightening experience. I always grieved over not growing up with him, but now think that maybe I was lucky.

Someone posted about their NT mom who resorted to drugs. I can see how living with a person such as this could drive someone nuts. I've been having to trade places with another family member so that I can decompress. Being with someone who shows no emotions, except negative ones, is not enjoyable. All those years of non-approval and feelings of not being good enough are crashing back upon me. At least I realize that it wasn't me now.

Thanks for listening and good luck to everyone.

If it's any consolation, NT parents can be really really mean and evil too. My father is NT and he ruined my childhood. I have refused to speak to him for a decade.

I'm sure there are plenty of nice parents with aspergers. I will raise my son as best I can so that hopefully he will become a great dad despite his quirkiness

Minervajane,

Extreme stinginess is a characteristic of OCPD most often (although of course it can be other things) - you may want to check that out to see if anything else overlaps. Note that it is ocPd and not OCD, they are quite different. My dad is AS, and we suspected my mom may have had some traits too - turns out she was OCPD among other things. It does share many traits of AS, thus why my parents functioned so well together. (And for the record, my mother made the devil look like a saint. Meanest person I've ever met in my life.)

I'm grateful for the replies. I do understand that there are many factors at play and many things to overlap, probably co-morbidities as well...not to mention a lifetime during which he probably learned other coping mechanisms which add to the current symptoms.

Thanks, DWamom for answering my questions. I always wondered why he seemed so dependent on my stepmom. This would explain it. As for not appreciating beauty, everything for him has to have a purpose. Nothing else matters.

JujuJlt, a lot of your story resonates with mine.

And I agree that "NT" parents can be rough too! Although I don't think anybody is really normal...I adore my dad for his eccentricities, at least most of them. I'm just trying to understand him and heal 40+ years of misinterpretations of this behaviors. And I sure wish he didn't seem so heavy all the time. . . but we had a good day today.

I think that just knowing about the nature of this "beast" should make a world of difference for any young people who are trying to deal with it. It must have been so hard growing up in my father's time, not knowing what was going on.

Now I'm wondering if I have a bit of this myself. I certainly do the stimming (almost constant hair twrilling, only on the left side). Always been socially awkward and was very quiet and afraid to speak as a child.

Would aspergers predispose someone to being easily taken advantage of by others? I'm afraid the stepfamily might have done some of that. I never felt like I should interfere...my dad is honest beyond all doubt. I'm not sure he can see dishonesty in others.

One of the concerns when someone cannot read social cues is them getting taken advantage of, yes. No easy answer on preventing that, because you don't want them to start seeing manipulation where there is none, either.

With our kids we do a lot of situational autopsies, hoping to help them build a reference data base. But it can be difficult for someone with ASD to apply what they know about situations A, B and C to situation D.

I think most people with an ASD family member realize they have at least a few traits. Not surprising since dozens of genes are suspected of being involved. Whether that would be enough to "be" ASD is another matter. Hard to know when you don't start considering it until adulthood.

Best wishes to you and your father. Very nice feeling the love in your posts even as you question some things he has done.