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Velociraptor
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17 Apr 2012, 7:28 pm

liloleme wrote:
I was explaining the sarcasm which I found amusing. I personally think Its sad to tell your children that they can not die....wouldnt it be horrible if the parent or sibling died and the child was waiting for them to come back. I worked in the medical field for years and my husband is a Biologist and a Genetics professor...its not possible....maybe some day, doubtful, but certainly not in our lifetime. Besides there are hardly enough resources to sustain the people on this planet, can you imagine if we were immortal....wed be in trouble then...the seas would be dead as they are dying now, as humans we tend to ignore what we dont see! We would eat and drink all that we could and rape the world of all its natural resources. Wed die from immortality, how ironic would that be?


As I must have said 100 times before... There's plenty of space in space! I'm not teaching them that they cannot die, just that they can live forever and that I'm putting the effort into it for them, so they should continue the family tradition and do the same for their kids. I plan to teach them to think about your dissent and why we must constantly be the ones to find the solutions and provide for people. To let them know what challenges we face so they can become the people who will solve them. There are quite a few engineers in my family on both sides, we've had some of the most impressive accomplishments in history, why not raise my family to cure the ultimate ill and the challenges and pain that surround it? We'll make ending death a family tradition. This is the kind of motivation I would have liked to have as a child. So this is what I'm giving to my kids.



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17 Apr 2012, 7:35 pm

Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Wreck-Gar wrote:
We all must die, sometime...


Sounds like you want my kids to die, should I take that as a threat? :)


Not today, Galvatron.


I didn't mean it as a provocation, sorry. I meant for it to be a question of motives and/or a challenge of your standpoint. Of course I could have read you wrong as you could have meant that something will eventually kill you if you live long enough. I however assume, that life can be preserved and repaired up until the time when the universe blinks out of existence or something which physicists predict will occur in enough years to fill a book with a one and a bunch of zeros. So there is plenty of time. Still however I don't think we can be sure... their's may be nothing more than the new Mayan apocalypse. I say we wait it out for a few trillion years of technological advancement before we make that assumption.


I don't think we currently possess the technology to revive people that are cryogenically frozen. Won't ice crystals rip up your cells?


Nope, check out the perfusion methods that are used by Alcor. I've even considered ways of thawing people to a living state to begin the processes of revival. I just need to learn enough of the math necessary to write it all down. But the cryoprotectant is just a sugar IIRC. So perhaps it's not possible today... but I feel like I could make it possible not long from now. After that it's just a matter of repairing all of the other ills that caused the person to die in the first place. I'm sure you agree that this is possible at least. Is that correct?



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18 Apr 2012, 7:01 am

You've got to be joking, right? Otherways I feel very sorry for your children



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18 Apr 2012, 8:31 am

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Nope, check out the perfusion methods that are used by Alcor. I've even considered ways of thawing people to a living state to begin the processes of revival. I just need to learn enough of the math necessary to write it all down. But the cryoprotectant is just a sugar IIRC. So perhaps it's not possible today... but I feel like I could make it possible not long from now. After that it's just a matter of repairing all of the other ills that caused the person to die in the first place. I'm sure you agree that this is possible at least. Is that correct?


Ok let's say you get this to work. How are you going to prevent dying in ways? Accidents, say? Just stay locked in a room forever?



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18 Apr 2012, 9:55 am

I think it is pretty obvious that you are the only immortalist on this board, so this thread is looking more like PPR than parenting. I did try but, seriously, I just can't buy into the premise.

As for unlimited space in space - - there are no resources that we know how to eat in space, and food was is and always will be the single largest driver in human conflict. Sounds like that would get worse, not better.

People don't over consume resources because life is too short, they do it because of their egos, their need to feel they have their fair share of what there is to be had ... and then there are always many who want not only their share, but more, and they want that because they need it emotionally, to feel good about themselves.

I don't know where you think this wealth to sustain generations will come from when most people can't even save for retirement.

And when your car explodes and your body is scattered into dust, all the best laid plans will be over.


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Velociraptor
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18 Apr 2012, 10:14 am

Heidi80 wrote:
You've got to be joking, right? Otherways I feel very sorry for your children


Joking about what? Why do you feel sorry for my kids?



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18 Apr 2012, 10:17 am

Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Nope, check out the perfusion methods that are used by Alcor. I've even considered ways of thawing people to a living state to begin the processes of revival. I just need to learn enough of the math necessary to write it all down. But the cryoprotectant is just a sugar IIRC. So perhaps it's not possible today... but I feel like I could make it possible not long from now. After that it's just a matter of repairing all of the other ills that caused the person to die in the first place. I'm sure you agree that this is possible at least. Is that correct?


Ok let's say you get this to work. How are you going to prevent dying in ways? Accidents, say? Just stay locked in a room forever?


Better safety standards will do the trick, and of course we have cryonics, so if you get bashed up pretty good, we'll just keep you on ice until we have the technology to fix you again. So you might loose some time here and there, but you will almost always be recovered so long as you aren't cremated or ripped apart molecule by molecule.



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18 Apr 2012, 10:21 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
I think it is pretty obvious that you are the only immortalist on this board, so this thread is looking more like PPR than parenting. I did try but, seriously, I just can't buy into the premise.

As for unlimited space in space - - there are no resources that we know how to eat in space, and food was is and always will be the single largest driver in human conflict. Sounds like that would get worse, not better.

People don't over consume resources because life is too short, they do it because of their egos, their need to feel they have their fair share of what there is to be had ... and then there are always many who want not only their share, but more, and they want that because they need it emotionally, to feel good about themselves.

I don't know where you think this wealth to sustain generations will come from when most people can't even save for retirement.

And when your car explodes and your body is scattered into dust, all the best laid plans will be over.


Bacteria grows 10x in space. So we modify it to produce everything we find in a prime rib steak! Also haven't you heard of the research and tech that is going on in cloning meat? We've actually been growing meat from the cells of the animals rather than growing the entire animal. Sooner or later it will be main stream. Perhaps even in 10 years we could be eating meats grown from animal cells. So add that to bacteria derived or probiotic derived food sources growing in space and we've got everything we need. Food may look differently but it will be more healthy and cheaper going down that path. Just give it time.



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18 Apr 2012, 10:32 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
I think it is pretty obvious that you are the only immortalist on this board, so this thread is looking more like PPR than parenting. I did try but, seriously, I just can't buy into the premise.

As for unlimited space in space - - there are no resources that we know how to eat in space, and food was is and always will be the single largest driver in human conflict. Sounds like that would get worse, not better.

People don't over consume resources because life is too short, they do it because of their egos, their need to feel they have their fair share of what there is to be had ... and then there are always many who want not only their share, but more, and they want that because they need it emotionally, to feel good about themselves.

I don't know where you think this wealth to sustain generations will come from when most people can't even save for retirement.

And when your car explodes and your body is scattered into dust, all the best laid plans will be over.


Forgot about the egos part... So let's say I make it to immortality and I want more than I have... You know what? I've gotten over the mindless need for consumerism. I still want more than I have, but I want things that have more permanence than every new ipad or graphics card that comes out. That isn't what I need. What I need is a home and a family. So why did I lose my ego? I lost it because I experienced having the graphics cards and computers and ipads of the world and I burned out on it... I don't care about those things anymore. The off brands are fine for me, or I get the good one and keep it until it's pretty out of date. I keep my cell phones for years at a time, My first I had for something like 6-7 years and it had manufacturing defects. I didn't care. It made the call. I have a droid now, and I'll probably keep it for a pretty long time or until it breaks. My point is that we don't live these egotistical lives forever. Only when things are new, and the sooner we realize we can be immortals, the sooner our priorities change and we start seeing things differently. It's the only live once and for a short time mentality that leads to what you're talking about.



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18 Apr 2012, 11:11 am

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Better safety standards will do the trick, and of course we have cryonics, so if you get bashed up pretty good, we'll just keep you on ice until we have the technology to fix you again. So you might loose some time here and there, but you will almost always be recovered so long as you aren't cremated or ripped apart molecule by molecule.


What if your brain gets exploded?



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18 Apr 2012, 11:15 am

Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Better safety standards will do the trick, and of course we have cryonics, so if you get bashed up pretty good, we'll just keep you on ice until we have the technology to fix you again. So you might loose some time here and there, but you will almost always be recovered so long as you aren't cremated or ripped apart molecule by molecule.


What if your brain gets exploded?


Well... then the original is gone... however, if there exists a copy of the mind as might occur with the neuro-integration w/ computers, we may still be able to make a reliable copy. But it still won't be you. So let's avoid anything that might explode our brains okay?



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18 Apr 2012, 12:23 pm

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Forgot about the egos part... So let's say I make it to immortality and I want more than I have... You know what? I've gotten over the mindless need for consumerism. I still want more than I have, but I want things that have more permanence than every new ipad or graphics card that comes out. That isn't what I need. What I need is a home and a family. So why did I lose my ego? I lost it because I experienced having the graphics cards and computers and ipads of the world and I burned out on it... I don't care about those things anymore. The off brands are fine for me, or I get the good one and keep it until it's pretty out of date. I keep my cell phones for years at a time, My first I had for something like 6-7 years and it had manufacturing defects. I didn't care. It made the call. I have a droid now, and I'll probably keep it for a pretty long time or until it breaks. My point is that we don't live these egotistical lives forever. Only when things are new, and the sooner we realize we can be immortals, the sooner our priorities change and we start seeing things differently. It's the only live once and for a short time mentality that leads to what you're talking about.


You are assuming you will not change at all over an infinite period of time. Nothing is static.

In 10 billion years I don't think we will be worring about our cell phone model.

Imagine all the experiences you could have in 100 trillion years.



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18 Apr 2012, 12:23 pm

Can I get a BIG AMEN for DW_a_Mom?



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18 Apr 2012, 12:25 pm

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Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Better safety standards will do the trick, and of course we have cryonics, so if you get bashed up pretty good, we'll just keep you on ice until we have the technology to fix you again. So you might loose some time here and there, but you will almost always be recovered so long as you aren't cremated or ripped apart molecule by molecule.


What if your brain gets exploded?


Well... then the original is gone... however, if there exists a copy of the mind as might occur with the neuro-integration w/ computers, we may still be able to make a reliable copy. But it still won't be you. So let's avoid anything that might explode our brains okay?


Hope you have plans for escaping the heat death of the universe.



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18 Apr 2012, 5:18 pm

Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Forgot about the egos part... So let's say I make it to immortality and I want more than I have... You know what? I've gotten over the mindless need for consumerism. I still want more than I have, but I want things that have more permanence than every new ipad or graphics card that comes out. That isn't what I need. What I need is a home and a family. So why did I lose my ego? I lost it because I experienced having the graphics cards and computers and ipads of the world and I burned out on it... I don't care about those things anymore. The off brands are fine for me, or I get the good one and keep it until it's pretty out of date. I keep my cell phones for years at a time, My first I had for something like 6-7 years and it had manufacturing defects. I didn't care. It made the call. I have a droid now, and I'll probably keep it for a pretty long time or until it breaks. My point is that we don't live these egotistical lives forever. Only when things are new, and the sooner we realize we can be immortals, the sooner our priorities change and we start seeing things differently. It's the only live once and for a short time mentality that leads to what you're talking about.


You are assuming you will not change at all over an infinite period of time. Nothing is static.

In 10 billion years I don't think we will be worring about our cell phone model.

Imagine all the experiences you could have in 100 trillion years.


One develops a filter over time for fads and such things. In 30 years, I most certainly will have learned that life is better when you are thinking about something other than the next best ipad. We change for the better over time. We learn that there is more to life than this. I fully imagine being physically young and wise for the rest of my infinite life.

I certainly won't give you an AMEN... What she says is not true.



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18 Apr 2012, 5:19 pm

Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Wreck-Gar wrote:
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Better safety standards will do the trick, and of course we have cryonics, so if you get bashed up pretty good, we'll just keep you on ice until we have the technology to fix you again. So you might loose some time here and there, but you will almost always be recovered so long as you aren't cremated or ripped apart molecule by molecule.


What if your brain gets exploded?


Well... then the original is gone... however, if there exists a copy of the mind as might occur with the neuro-integration w/ computers, we may still be able to make a reliable copy. But it still won't be you. So let's avoid anything that might explode our brains okay?


Hope you have plans for escaping the heat death of the universe.


We'll have plenty of time to make them.