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DW_a_mom
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11 Jul 2014, 3:52 pm

Cubedemon6073, you and my son would have so much to talk about :)


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ASDMommyASDKid
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11 Jul 2014, 4:08 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
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Any place that hires based on a personality one does not have is not a good fit.


Exactly, it won't be. One problem, a good chunk of the employers seem to require one to have a certain personality type. I will not claim all but I believe we have a good sample set on that linkdin page. Based upon this sample set I believe we have a strong generalization.

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It is not likely that will be legislated against.


I agree. In addition, I don't think it ought to be legislated against. I want them to hire me of their own free will and their desire to have me as an employee. Ebay has a policy against selling coupons. Guess what? People sell them anyway and that is because they found a loophole to the rule. All they have to do is to claim they're selling the service of cutting out the coupons and not the coupons themselves. Legislating will not work. People have to want to do what is right

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I am not remotely saying I expect my son to change who is. Not even close. Even if he figures out a way to blend in better, he will not thrive somewhere where they expect him to have a different personality.


No, he will not thrive. Neither will a lot of us on the spectrum. It will not work.

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He does need to learn how to interact with people. I am talking about basic skills, like asking for information you need to complete a project; knowing when to assert oneself, and when to keep complaints to oneself; how to deal with co-workers trying to pawn their work off on you. These are not personality changes. These are functional skills.


I agree with this and I need help in some of these areas myself. I was not talking about functional skills though. Functional skills I am 100% for those on the spectrum to learn. That is not the issue I'm talking about. I'm talking about being forced to change one's whole persona. Another skill he needs to learn is to how to ask where the restroom is.

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The personality issue is a separate one, in my mind.


Agreed and this is where we need to draw the line. If a given society requires one to change his whole personality, identity and metaphorically sell his soul to the devil and put on a falsehood then this is where I have to say no. This is where I believe we must self-advocate and learn how to do that effectively.

We would not stand a chance in Richard Branson's employ, IMHO.


I would get depressed trying to fake it to stay employed at such a place. My husband and I are hoping maybe my son will be able to start some kind of business of his own, and be able to hire people to do the people skill kind of stuff. I am not sure what type of business given his skill set. Sigh.



cubedemon6073
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11 Jul 2014, 4:18 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:
Cubedemon6073, you and my son would have so much to talk about :)


:) I am sure we would over a cold beer. Oh! Wait a min! He's underage :D Scratch that!

Forget the Beer. I guess we could do water, lemonade, tea or juice. I'm trying to shy away from soft drinks. My body reacts badly to them and I didn't know it. I have increased my water intake and it does help me a lot in functioning.

Anyway, is he a philosophical and logical type aspie?



Last edited by cubedemon6073 on 11 Jul 2014, 4:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

cubedemon6073
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11 Jul 2014, 4:22 pm

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I would get depressed trying to fake it to stay employed at such a place. My husband and I are hoping maybe my son will be able to start some kind of business of his own, and be able to hire people to do the people skill kind of stuff. I am not sure what type of business given his skill set. Sigh.


He would have to know how to sell and I don't even know how to do that. IMHO, he would need to be in a relaxed and slow paced environment in which he doesn't have to work under pressure. One thing he would need to improve upon is his executive functioning skills. I have bad issues with executive functioning. In fact, I just wish other people would manage my time for me.

Mine is so bad that I have problems making lists and writing things down. I have tried the advice of this and I just don't take to it. It is a contradiction for me I will admit. I love routine and routine is vital for me but I have difficulty bounding myself to other people's schedules.

I did try to start a computer repair business but if others asked me how long it would take to fix their computer I would not know how to answer this question because there are so many different ways the computer could be broke and even to diagnosis it could take a while. Computer repair and hacking is not like how the movies portray.

The answer to how long it would take to repair their computer depends upon what is wrong with the computer. My father keeps telling me to give an estimate. I don't know how and I know of no formula to do this. I had to give up on it.



ASDMommyASDKid
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11 Jul 2014, 4:36 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
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I would get depressed trying to fake it to stay employed at such a place. My husband and I are hoping maybe my son will be able to start some kind of business of his own, and be able to hire people to do the people skill kind of stuff. I am not sure what type of business given his skill set. Sigh.


He would have to know how to sell and I don't even know how to do that. IMHO, he would need to be in a relaxed and slow paced environment in which he doesn't have to work under pressure. One thing he would need to improve upon is his executive functioning skills. I have bad issues with executive functioning. In fact, I just wish other people would manage my time for me.

Mine is so bad that I have problems making lists and writing things down. I have tried the advice of this and I just don't take to it. It is a contradiction for me I will admit. I love routine and routine is vital for me but I have difficulty bounding myself to other people's schedules.

I did try to start a computer repair business but if others asked me how long it would take to fix their computer I would not know how to answer this question because there are so many different ways the computer could be broke and even to diagnosis it could take a while. Computer repair and hacking is not like how the movies portray.

The answer to how long it would take to repair their computer depends upon what is wrong with the computer. My father keeps telling me to give an estimate. I don't know how and I know of no formula to do this. I had to give up on it.


I do not know how viable this would be but if you could give an over-estimate of the diagnosis time and you could do a flat fee for diagnosis, and then a better estimate of time and charges for fixing.

People generally prefer being surprised when things are done sooner and less charges are being incurred than being surprised with the opposite.

Edited for literacy.



cubedemon6073
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11 Jul 2014, 4:48 pm

DW_A_MOM, I would like to state that there are some aspies on here I become frustrated with. All they think about is what work is here and now and not possibilities of where it might lead. They don't look at the culture in a holistic way. They don't look at the ethics, the morality and why it is this way and could things be better.

They look at empirical evidence as though it is objective and absolute when it is not. Evidence can be open to one's interpretation and biases and it is very difficult to get other aspies let alone NTs to get this. I have issues with the scientific method because of this. Even scientists are prone to their own biases and subjective feelings. In addition, scientific institutions are prone to the same vices lie greed and pride. To understand reality and existence one must examine different facets and science and logic is but one. One has to understand emotions, psychology, beliefs, etc. One has to synthesize this together and some aspies on here see science and scientific method as absolute which to me can become a dogmatic religion onto itself called scientism.

Does your son think like this?



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11 Jul 2014, 4:50 pm

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I do not know how viable this would be but if you could give an over-estimate of the diagnosis time and you could do a flat fee for diagnosis, and then a better estimate of time and charges for fixing.


How would I do an over-estimate if I don't know how to obtain an on target estimate? How do I estimate this at all?

Quote:
People generally prefer being surprised when things are done sooner and less charges are being incurred than being surprised with the opposite.


I know but how do I do an estimate for things like this? I don't know how to come up with an answer off the cuff like other people do.



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11 Jul 2014, 5:12 pm

Tell everyone it will take one week. Some people will be pleasantly surprised, some not. :lol:



ASDMommyASDKid
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11 Jul 2014, 5:15 pm

I am terrible with this too. My son always wants to know how long things will take and I do not know.

Ideally you would map out most types of issues customers would have ie. "My screen is frozen.." Then figure out, based on the complaint, all the different possible causes. You could tell the customer that the most likely cause is x, if that is so it will take y time but if it is z cause it would take w time. Then add in an extra 10% of time in case. You would not list every possible cause just the most likely one and the one that would take the longest to fix and/or be the most expensive.

Time estimates are easier for things you have already done, obviously.



cubedemon6073
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11 Jul 2014, 5:40 pm

Quote:
I am terrible with this too. My son always wants to know how long things will take and I do not know.

Ideally you would map out most types of issues customers would have ie. "My screen is frozen.." Then figure out, based on the complaint, all the different possible causes. You could tell the customer that the most likely cause is x, if that is so it will take y time but if it is z cause it would take w time. Then add in an extra 10% of time in case. You would not list every possible cause just the most likely one and the one that would take the longest to fix and/or be the most expensive.

Time estimates are easier for things you have already done, obviously.


Even for the things I've already done I still have major problems giving a time estimate? How does one obtain this estimate for things already done? Is there a formula used? Am I supposed to consciously notate a start and end time? As far as I know most people don't notate a start and end time. If they do not, then what are their methods?



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11 Jul 2014, 5:50 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
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I am terrible with this too. My son always wants to know how long things will take and I do not know.

Ideally you would map out most types of issues customers would have ie. "My screen is frozen.." Then figure out, based on the complaint, all the different possible causes. You could tell the customer that the most likely cause is x, if that is so it will take y time but if it is z cause it would take w time. Then add in an extra 10% of time in case. You would not list every possible cause just the most likely one and the one that would take the longest to fix and/or be the most expensive.

Time estimates are easier for things you have already done, obviously.


Even for the things I've already done I still have major problems giving a time estimate? How does one obtain this estimate for things already done? Is there a formula used? Am I supposed to consciously notate a start and end time? As far as I know most people don't notate a start and end time. If they do not, then what are their methods?


Ye,s keep a log of how long it takes you. People who bill by the hour have to do this to know what to charge. If you charge a flat fee, how can you make sure that you will be compensated fairly for your time, if you do not have an idea of how long it will take you? So, either way, you should keep track. If you charge $50 for something and it ended up taking you 10 hours that would only be $5/hour. It is good business sense to be able to estimate.

In bigger companies, project managers keep track of that, but they still have to base it on what the other people say a job ought to take.



DW_a_mom
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11 Jul 2014, 5:57 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
DW_a_mom wrote:
Cubedemon6073, you and my son would have so much to talk about :)


:) I am sure we would over a cold beer. Oh! Wait a min! He's underage :D Scratch that!

Forget the Beer. I guess we could do water, lemonade, tea or juice. I'm trying to shy away from soft drinks. My body reacts badly to them and I didn't know it. I have increased my water intake and it does help me a lot in functioning.

Anyway, is he a philosophical and logical type aspie?


Lol yeah, no beer. He does love tea :)

I can't drink soft drinks, either, and I've recently cut out most added sugar.

He is very much a philosophical and logical type aspie, and loves batting around ideas. He'd be a teen radical if there were any radical bones in his body; but he definitely enjoys what I think of as out-there ideas, and discussing them at length. I mostly can't get into it, and have a habit of telling him not to share some of those ideas too broadly for worry of misinterpretation, but debate is basically what he and his friends do. I read your posts and definitely think he'd enjoy dissecting so many of the concepts you do.


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DW_a_mom
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11 Jul 2014, 6:04 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
DW_A_MOM, I would like to state that there are some aspies on here I become frustrated with. All they think about is what work is here and now and not possibilities of where it might lead. They don't look at the culture in a holistic way. They don't look at the ethics, the morality and why it is this way and could things be better.

They look at empirical evidence as though it is objective and absolute when it is not. Evidence can be open to one's interpretation and biases and it is very difficult to get other aspies let alone NTs to get this. I have issues with the scientific method because of this. Even scientists are prone to their own biases and subjective feelings. In addition, scientific institutions are prone to the same vices lie greed and pride. To understand reality and existence one must examine different facets and science and logic is but one. One has to understand emotions, psychology, beliefs, etc. One has to synthesize this together and some aspies on here see science and scientific method as absolute which to me can become a dogmatic religion onto itself called scientism.

Does your son think like this?


He's young so sometimes his thinking is locked into a pretty narrow passage but, for the most part, he loves digging deep into things and trying to get beyond the obvious. And he loves lively debate, so even when he is locked down, the discussion and challenge intrigues him. He's a pretty smart kid, even though he has started to doubt his own intelligence (face it, there are ALWAYS people much smarter at anything and, of course, he keeps meeting them; but he still has a super lively mind). He's also pretty broad in interests compared to many Aspies, having interest in science, literature, creative writing, story telling, drama, computers, programming/coding, religion, history, and so on.


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DW_a_mom
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11 Jul 2014, 6:11 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
Quote:
I do not know how viable this would be but if you could give an over-estimate of the diagnosis time and you could do a flat fee for diagnosis, and then a better estimate of time and charges for fixing.


How would I do an over-estimate if I don't know how to obtain an on target estimate? How do I estimate this at all?

Quote:
People generally prefer being surprised when things are done sooner and less charges are being incurred than being surprised with the opposite.


I know but how do I do an estimate for things like this? I don't know how to come up with an answer off the cuff like other people do.


The problem with computer repair is that it really CAN vary from one hour to twenty, and you to explain that succinctly upfront. A reasonable compromise is to agree to do one hour of work and then check in with the client to let them know how it is looking, and try to give them a more solid estimate then. I've found that to be pretty common in the industry, with the few repairs I've had done. There is the flat "I'll take a look and hope it can be fixed quickly fee," and then there is the "we will have to let you know" fee. Obviously, there is a pragmatic ceiling on the later given that there is usually little point in re-buying the computer, so if repair is going to go past a certain point, no one will agree to pay for it. A lot of people abandon the computer it if can't be fixed within the "I'll take a look and hope it can fixed quickly fee."

That sort of thing isn't very easy for most people, figuring out the billing and fee side of a small business, but it is definitely key to running one. Neither my husband or I like it, which is one of the reasons I've slowly moved from having my own part-time business to working part-time for someone else. You definitely do have to get comfortable with it to run a business, however.


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DW_a_mom
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11 Jul 2014, 6:16 pm

cubedemon6073 wrote:
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I am terrible with this too. My son always wants to know how long things will take and I do not know.

Ideally you would map out most types of issues customers would have ie. "My screen is frozen.." Then figure out, based on the complaint, all the different possible causes. You could tell the customer that the most likely cause is x, if that is so it will take y time but if it is z cause it would take w time. Then add in an extra 10% of time in case. You would not list every possible cause just the most likely one and the one that would take the longest to fix and/or be the most expensive.

Time estimates are easier for things you have already done, obviously.


Even for the things I've already done I still have major problems giving a time estimate? How does one obtain this estimate for things already done? Is there a formula used? Am I supposed to consciously notate a start and end time? As far as I know most people don't notate a start and end time. If they do not, then what are their methods?


I've spent my life in a billable profession, so part of my job is to write down the time I start every project, and the time I finish. It can get complicated with phone calls from other clients and similar distractions, in which case you just do your best. I absolutely hate it, sitting down at the end of every day and making sure my time adds up, but it is part of the job and there is no way around it. For my personal clients, I've decided that five years of billing gives a strong enough history to just flat fee their work, and stop tracking my time. I have known some people who just guess, and others who will use a flat rate per item type system, instead of tracking time. There are no perfect answers, it just is what it is.


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DW_a_mom
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11 Jul 2014, 6:18 pm

ASDMommyASDKid wrote:
cubedemon6073 wrote:
Quote:
I am terrible with this too. My son always wants to know how long things will take and I do not know.

Ideally you would map out most types of issues customers would have ie. "My screen is frozen.." Then figure out, based on the complaint, all the different possible causes. You could tell the customer that the most likely cause is x, if that is so it will take y time but if it is z cause it would take w time. Then add in an extra 10% of time in case. You would not list every possible cause just the most likely one and the one that would take the longest to fix and/or be the most expensive.

Time estimates are easier for things you have already done, obviously.


Even for the things I've already done I still have major problems giving a time estimate? How does one obtain this estimate for things already done? Is there a formula used? Am I supposed to consciously notate a start and end time? As far as I know most people don't notate a start and end time. If they do not, then what are their methods?


Ye,s keep a log of how long it takes you. People who bill by the hour have to do this to know what to charge. If you charge a flat fee, how can you make sure that you will be compensated fairly for your time, if you do not have an idea of how long it will take you? So, either way, you should keep track. If you charge $50 for something and it ended up taking you 10 hours that would only be $5/hour. It is good business sense to be able to estimate.

In bigger companies, project managers keep track of that, but they still have to base it on what the other people say a job ought to take.


Often large companies require time tracking even when they don't bill out to clients, because there are many accounting and tax reasons to do so. My husband thought he was finally out of time tracking only to find out his employer needed him to track by project for R&D credits. Basically, yeah, people DO this lol.

(and we are so off topic - HUGE apologies to the OP! should we request a split?)


.


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