"Could Your Child Homeschool If S/he Wanted To?"

Post Reply New Topic

Kim - Just as unfair as it for me to say what I did, I feel it's unfair for the original poster to say that those who do complain about the school system keep our kids in school because we want a big bank account or we don't want them happy.
I don't have a choice to stay home. I can't walk to work, I can't ride a bus to work. I rent a home that is falling apart because that IS all we can afford.
I live in the area I live in because of the public school system here. It's not the greatest, but it's not the worst either. I will exercise my legal rights if I feel the school is not doing it's job in educating my daughter.
Don't generalize my statement by saying ALL home schoolers give up. That is NOT what I said.
It is a shame that there are schools out there that do what you say they do - who is going to change it or at least help to change it? Tell me, what did that mother do after the cops were sent to her? Did she decide to fight it - or home school?

This is my opinion, you don't have to like it.

This debate is as bad as the SAHM vs. the working mom...

Almost. I had never thought that anyone could not see that different choices suit different people, that everyone has different strengths and weaknesses, and so on. But in SAHM discussions it always seems people believe that everyone else is like them, and thus different choices must be made for poor reasons. That simply isn't true, most of the time.

I really hope no one comes on with this common response to things I have often admitted: "then you should not have had children." Oh, that one boils my blood. As if any of us, ANY of us, knew what our strengths and weaknesses were going to be as parents before choosing to have children. I certainly didn't. I had been told all my life that I was born to be a mom. Post-partum depression? Special needs child? Realizing that I went crazy without other adults to talk with? Well, I never expected any of it, but DID have to deal with it, and make the best decisions possible given the realities of who each individual in my family was.

I cannot honestly say what I would do if my son was miserable in school, and there were no good options for schools to transfer him to. I would probably bite the bullit and homeschool. But it would be very, very hard for me. I really cannot imagine it, from an emotional perspective. I am SO unorganized. I keep the messiest house, I just HATE housework. It overwhelmes me. Something about the world of work, being in an office with other professionals, helps me overcome those things. I don't know why, I just know it IS.

I do teach on occassion, as a volunteer, around 20 little ones, and I find it absolutely exhausting. Fun, or I wouldn't do it, but I have to prepare 3 hours for the one hour in the classroom, and withdraw and rest afterwards for 2 hours. I wasn't born to teach, plain and simple.

I think I would be more likely to hire an AS trained governess than to stay home ... I am SO glad this is not an issue right now.

Just to remark that out of the 12 parents who have posted on this thread; 8 are listed as "Family member with Aspergers", and only 4 as on the Autistic spectrum themselves.

I do think that it is because I remember, as an aspie, how awful school was, that I think it is desperately important to take children's unhappiness in/about school as seriously as you possibly can.

Not that I am a perfect mother. I am not at all. Just on this issue I know from personal aspie experience that school can be disastrous, with very long term effects.

Nan, I hear you. You sound as if you knew and really wanted to but couldn't. I was almost in that situation. But I got cold feet and stuck with the excruciatingly NT papa. I don't know what I would be doing now, or where I'd be, if I had not.

Last edited by ouinon on 19 Mar 2008, 2:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I hate it too. I am disorganised. I keep a not so much messy as dirty/dusty/fluffy house. The washing up gets done about twice a week.
Homeschooling isn't/needn't be teaching. It's up to you what you make it. For me it's just being there for when he needs help with something.

The school environment disempowers children so that looking after 20 children there is much harder work than any where else.

Because I live in France which has a strict'ish "instruction obligatory" law, we have to sit down for an hour or so each afternoon to plough through a few stupefyingly tedious , pointless, and painfully irrelevant to anything , exercises to post off to show we do some school work. Other than that i do nothing , very much.

EDIT: Do you think anyone does? But it turns out to be surprisingly, in fact quite shockingly, easy to do better than school.

And my son has a very "positive experience", ( except for the five hours a week we sit down to school work), in fact you soon find out that you would have to work very very hard to make it as awful as school.

Last edited by ouinon on 19 Mar 2008, 3:21 pm, edited 5 times in total.

I'm not saying people want big bank accounts, but that there seems to be very little comprehension of how damaging schooling is/can be for many sensitive children. I think that it is urgent to broadcast this, so that at least some people, those who do have a choice, rethink their priorities, really "hear" that school can be/is often like gluten/wheat to a coeliac; continued use/exposure destroys millions of the fine little cilia in the intestine which are essential for absorption purposes, and results in serious deficiencies, aswell as lost defences against noxious particles.

Last edited by ouinon on 19 Mar 2008, 3:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Kim, so nice you can afford a cell phone and a car, and a phone in your home, you live somewhere that has cheap rentals, and you got to "decide" when to have your kids.... Not everyone has those options. Nor do they have the luxury of having someone else work to pay their bills. I hope you know how fortunate you are to have gotten lucky - because luck does play quite a large part in where you are. I hope it remains that way for you, especially given how the economy is looking lately. Pray your wage-earner doesn't get fired, seriously ill or hit by a car, or decide to walk out on you. Because that sort of thing does happen. Quite often. And then, quite frankly, unless you can go home to mommy, you may well be just plain screwed.

Just for those who brought up "living off the government" as a method to stay home and homeschool - sorry, but that's one of my "pet peeve" buttons and you get to hear my speech about it now. Welfare: you can only be on what the equivalent of welfare is these days for a cumulative total of five years (unless you've got a disabled kid, and that means way more than a kid with Aspergers, ADD, ADHD, or a lot of the stuff you read about on this board - the kid has to be really severely disabled for you to get to stay on longer). Before someone says it - you don't get "extra" $$$ aid for having more kids, as so many people seem to like to think. You can't make a career off of being on welfare. That's all hype and stereotype. http://www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/ofa/ifr/IFR-CH9.htm I don't know how it is where you live, but here there's 30,000 people on the list for section 8 housing, the supply of which was insufficient 20 years ago and is now dwindling rapidly. Being on "government aid" is no picnic. It's not meant to be, it's meant to keep you alive. Not thriving, just alive. Once upon a time, when it was first created, the program was designed to keep mothers home with their kids, where the kids would be safe and looked after in their own homes by their own people, and keep families out of the horrific poverty that still exists in many venues in this country. As priorities shifted, that's no longer the goal - that's not what society demands or cares about. Oh, well. That's the breaks.

I remember back in the day when we got aid, after I got laid off from a good paying job because the economy turned south, lost my house, lost my kid's father, and before I could get into college (the financial aid package raising our standard of living tremendously, by the way). We got $509 a month to support myself and the kid. That was for all expenses - for rent on the open market, electric, heating gas, bus fare, soap, toilet paper, coins for the laundromat, diapers, whatever medical care Medicaid wouldn't pay for that she needed - and there were definitely things that the doctor would say were needed (medicines, particularly) that we had to find another way to pay for. Foodstamps gave us $70 a month. It cost $9 to cash the check at the bank. If I tried to work part time, I had to pay the going rate for daycare ($3 an hour) to make minimum wage ($2.80 an hour), I lost benefits dollar for dollar and medicaid eligibility for the kid - who had to have ongoing medical care, but who wasn't "disabled" in the social security terminology. I am the most frugal person on the planet, when necessary, but found I had twenty five cents extra a month at the end of the month...in a truly outstanding month. I guess I could have sat on my backside for three years and homeschooled the kid by drawing in the dirt and checking out library books... Actually, we did that, at every possible chance when I was not in school. Someone was kind enough to give us a little chalkboard and chalk, and so my daughter learned her ABCs by drawing them on a chalkboard, in the steam in the bathroom at bath time, by reading road and building signs, in the grocery, at the library, and by writing them in the dirt out on the driveway. So, yeah, you can homeschool a bit, there are ways to do it without any teaching aids at all. But once the kids turn three you have to send them away to "Head Start" and be in a training program, so there IS no sitting at home all day on the government's dime with them and homeschooling them. A nice illusion, but an illusion. It doesn't exist. Not in the USA, anyway. And I believe now the requirement is that you be working once your kid is 3 months old, not three years. It sucks to be poor. Glad I'm not there anymore, but I know it would only take one accident, one funky twist of fate, and I'll be there again.

Kim, you state that the schools don't prepare kids for life, they're just full of classism, sexism, and racism. Just out of curiosity, what world do YOU live in, where there is no classism, sexism, and racism???? Wow, that must be nice - but it's sure not the planet ~I~ live on. The most valuable lessons kids do learn in public schools have absolutely nothing to do with the course materials. Unfortunately. They learn how to navigate socially, how to get along, how to make alliances, how to get around alliances, how to get by or ahead in the world. You can work with them outside of the schools, prepare them as best you can, but they're not going to have the same experience as they would dealing with the howling mob. For better or for worse, that's kind of what I see it boiling down to. Unfortunately. Homeschooled or not, they have to learn to navigate socially. That's the ONLY thing my kid got out of going to public school - she learned how to be street-smart. Which, when I look around me, may be more valuable than the Latin or the History I tried to teach her. I still wish she hadn't had to learn what she learned the way she did. If I could have found a way, I'd never have let them do that to her.

comparing war scars doesn't further the conversation.

Lynn, I'm sorry if I misunderstood your comments but you did say that parents should fight and not give up. I understand that phrase to mean that those of us who see fighting as wasting time and find homeschooling the better option is somehow "giving up".

I don't know what that mother did who had the cops called on her.
In Phoenix, a group of parents complained all the way to the courts and were still told that the school was "in compliance", despite their kids being physically restrained and the parents not being allowed in the IEP meetings. That's an expensive waste of time if you ask me.

Public school is not free, btw. I am obligated to supplement school supplies because the schools send their money elsewhere. The schools also heavily advertise fundraising to the kids. My autistic son takes everything literally and freaks out completely when I try to explain to him that we can't financially afford to participate in every fundraiser. They tell him that it's his duty and that he has to participate.

I realize how lucky I am to have the things that I do. But we work really hard to have and maintain those things. I don't even like this lifestyle. I wish I had the time and money to back to school and learn a better trade. And my husband wishes I worked so he could stay home. That's just the way it is. We made these choices because our own parents didn't. He was abused and neglected and had to leave home at age 14. My parents both worked and then complained about it and complained about money even though we were comfortable. They had no flexibility with my own problems in school and I was blamed for whatever problems came up. They were too busy and self-absorbed to accept that I had genuine problems and needed help.
I just won't do that to my own son.

Currently the poll shows that 5 people already home school, and of the parents who do not, 2 could, and 2 could not. I am not surprised that so few of the parents whose children are frequently/constantly having trouble and suffering at school have so far voted. I would be surprised if they did.

But I am once again, as previously, as always, depressed by the Parents Forum, and think it may have a lot to do with its posters being largely NT with NT priorities. Which means "socialising" for their AS children. And the pervasive and crushing belief that however bad school gets it couldn't possibly be worse than/anything like as bad as home schooling.

PS: What is the % of parents of AS children who are themselves AS? as I am?

Our son attends public school in a mainstream classroom. He is an only child. We aren't able to home school because of financial reasons, but we are very avid about supplementing what he learns in school, and we often take hikes and teach him about animals, insects, weather, astronomy, life cycles, current events, all kinds of things. He's a very keen reader of non-fiction and loves "picture dictionaries" with lots of photos and graphs and statistics.

I personally am not that concerned with "socializing" our son, beyond helping him recognize when he's being taken advantage of or coerced into doing something he shouldn't. We gave up on throwing large birthday parties for him - we invited his entire class, and one kid showed up. We were devastated for him, but luckily he's so socially oblivious, he didn't notice the entire class had snubbed him. He was just so happy to be at Peter Piper Pizza playing video football, he didn't care if anyone else showed up.

On his last birthday, my husband just took him and his best friend out to play paintball for an afternoon. They had a great time and it was so much less preparation and expense on our part!

i enjoy working. my kids are doing fine in school. i see no reason to change the way things are. my husband or i are able to stay home with them if they are sick. i have the same vacations as my kids...............i think we all have to make the choice that works best for our family. some people choose to homeschool. some people to send their kids to public schools. some people send their kids to private schools. we all want what's best for our children. making sure that our children are healthy and happy should be our concern~not where they go to school

Ouinon, I think you're baiting us. I'm an Aspie, my husband is an Aspie and we disagree about homeschooling. It's not an NT vs Aspie/Autie debate here. I think you need to stop forcing it into one.

ouinon, I guess I'm an NT parent who is concerned with "socializing."

If I had one of those kids who didn't care as well, I wouldn't push it at all.

Part of the reason why so many NT parents on this forum care about socializing is partly due to reading so many posts by college-aged OR adult WrongPlanet members who have AS, who say that they're lonely, or unhappy, or feel like there should be something more to their life. Not ALL people with AS are perfectly happy to be isolated.

I totally agree that socializing isn't absolutely necessary for everyone. As I get older, I am MUCH less inclined to want to go to party's, or get-togethers, etc. I am narrowing my list of people that I want to spend time with. I don't think my son has to be with the "in crowd" at school, or constantly have play-dates. But every once in a while, he asks if someone can come over. Every once in a while, he says he's lonely. If socializing a little bit will make him happier, than I am more than willing to facilitate that.

Kris

I'm not baiting you; you've already replied, and thank you ( to everybody who has).

I am waiting to hear from the people who post and post about how awful a time their child has in school. Because almost everyone who has so far replied thinks/states that "on the whole" their child is doing ok at school. ( more or less)

Why, as soon as I post a thread arguing passionately,( because I'm feeling so sad and angry about all the school-related pain that's written about on here) , for home schooling, are there no longer (m)any parents having serious problems with their children at school? ......

I don't agree that this is an NT v. Aspie parent issue. What it is, more likely, is a belief that the school experience can be improved, v. a belief that it cannot be improved. Yes, some children are miserable in school. That happens with NT's just as it does with Aspies. Are you under the false impression that NT's never suffer through a poor school experience? That would be woefully incorrect. Not all Aspies suffer horribly in school. Many do, yes, but not all.

My question would be what is causing the negative experience? Most often it is related to the culture of a particular school, and NOT to institution itself. And if the problem is related to the culture of the school, it is entirely possible to either have influence on changing it, or to switch to a different school and enjoy a very opposite experience. Some Aspie children cannot thrive in ANY school, because of the crowds and the stimulation and the expectations, but I really do not agree that this is true for MOST Aspie children. Most Aspie children need more to find a school that is understanding and accomodating, than to avoid the experience all together. I live in a county that has many choices for families with special needs children. Small classes specialized in Autism, with sensory adjustments made to the entire environment. A private school devoted to special needs children, that adapts depending on the child, changing classrooms, curriculum, etc. Classrooms limited to 6 children, with a teacher with each child. My son's school, which has bent over backwards to help him, and provided services I never dreamed he even needed, but with which he has prospered. If something isn't working, we try a different environment. All the choices are there.

You are assuming that if a child is miserable in school, that it is the institution of school causing all the issues, and that the only answer is homeschooling. I do not, EVER, advocate leaving a child in an environment that is negative for him. In these threads you reference, you should have noted that I consistently say, FIND ANOTHER OPTION. The difference between you and I, however, is that I feel it is likely a school can be found that WILL make the child happy and allow him to thrive. As a parent, I would not settle for anything else. If there was no such school available, I would home school. But in my experience, such a school often IS available, so why not allow a parent to look for it? I have seen it many times: find the right school, and the issues the child has faced melt away. It doesn't HAVE to be homeschool for that remedy to come about. You incorrectly assume that it does.

It has nothing to do with wanting my son socialized. It has everything to do with wanting him to receive an education I do not feel I can provide. My son enjoys school. It is entirely possible. You just need the RIGHT school.

There-in lies the basic difference in assumptions that you and I start from.

Perhaps they need time to digest the idea. A LOT of time. As in more than a day or two.

You are asking people to flip around their entire vision for their family. If they have not considered it before, they won't even be able to answer why they have or they have not. I did actually consider it, which is why I can answer at this point in time. And I have already told you that the box I would mark is not on your list. You downplayed my position, but it doesn't change the fact that the box MUST be on your list for it to be valid. That is my reason, and would be my reason if my child was unhappy at school and I was trying to investigate solutions. Homeschooling would be a last ditch choice for me.

Having been years ago in the position of having my son at the wrong preschool school, and feeling desperate for a solution, I know how difficult it is to properly see the alternatives in front of you at the point in time you most need to. There is so much momentum in the direction you are going, so much, and so much invested, it is almost impossible to see your way out of it. If you had mentioned homeschooling to me at that point in time, I would have felt that you were doing the equivalent of asking me to jump off a bridge and hope I survived it. I had obligations ending far out into the future that I felt very locked into, and that could not be met with my child home during those hours. I felt that my son would be emotionally damaged if yanked him out of a familiar situation, regardless of the fact that it was also a negative one, because so much had been invested in helping him adjust to it. I don't even remember all the emotions anymore - just that there were so many of them, so many conflicting considerations, and so much momentum.

It isn't about money. It isn't about stubbornly feeling the child must be socialized. It isn't about having had a great school experience as a child v. not having had one. You need to see that it is a LOT more complicated than that.

I can say that before coming to WP, I never contemplated homeschooling. Once I was hit with the idea and sometimes shamed about sending my son to school, it took another 2 months for me to agree that in our case, homeschooling was the best solution for our immediate problem.
It was like jumping off a bridge. Now, I know I can do it again and I'm not afraid to ask for more from the school and threaten them with keeping my son home if they don't budge. Yet, even after that experience, my husband isn't convinced it's the optimal solution. C'est la vie.