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violet_yoshi
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21 Dec 2008, 2:15 am

2ukenkerl wrote:
I don't care if you are the queen of england, and the other person is your grandchild out of wedlock.


:lmao:



DwightF
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21 Dec 2008, 2:26 am

ImMelody wrote:
From what I can tell, with the limited knowledge I have of you and your son, it might be worth looking into a way to get him out of the classroom when he gets overwhelmed, but not when he's melting down.

This is something we did last year with my son in his Kindergarten. They are sometimes called a Safe Place. He was in a class that had 20 kids. It was sort of typical, but Montessori. And it was set up for up to 30 kids, the afternoon class was just smaller. So there was a fair amount of room. But he was only used to a maximum of 6 kids, plus he has a tough time tolerating most people singing (off-key singing really sets him off). What they did is set up a "safe" place for him. At one end of the classroom there was a hallway to outside. They put a table and chair in the hallway, stocked with pencils and paper. Drawing and printing are very calming for our son, and the line-of-sight was such that there was very little of the room that he could see. So whatever was the offending sensory he could escape from it. Regroup, regulate himself back down, and then come back out.

IMPORTANT: He didn't have to ask to go to this place. The point at which he needs to escape is the exact time that he'd have the most difficulty with communicating. When he felt his autism getting "too big" he just left. He had to be taught to do this, that this was the way to deal with feeling overwhelmed. So it can take a while to work. He also needs to be brought back when he gets back in control, to take another run at it. At first there can be days where he'll spend more time in the Safe Place than in classroom proper. But slowly he should feel safer in the classroom.

EDIT: By the end of the year our son was able to make it through the graduation ceremony, which involved him singing with his whole class. At the start of the year he hadn't been able to tolerate even a couple of bars of singing by a classmate. Although at one point he did skip out on a song to come sit with us in he audience and get some deep pressure, he never had to leave.

So get them to set up a Safe Place for him. Stock it or build it with whatever "stims" work for your son. Some kids like cave-like, so play tents often work well (they can dampen sound and break line-of-sight). Favourite toys. Things to order, if that's his thing. Whatever you've got him doing that you have deemed, and he's agreed are "acceptable" stims for him.


P.S. My son's in a new school again this year, and it was a similar thing. The stress of a new place. The stress of different teachers. New students (and from what you've described you SHOULD NOT rule out bullying, even if it didn't happen when you were there it can poison the room for your son in his mind and he'd be stressed out ). New routines. Just the stress of the changes can set off problem behaviors that then snowball if the teachers don't know how to defuse it. Very nasty downward spiral.

Though this year it's a somewhat smaller class and he's gotten past needing that kind of physically separate Safe Place. But he still needs the Positive Practice (that another poster mentioned) and he's matured enough that he's doing well learning to self-regulate. He's been taught and allowed to do physical exercises right in the classroom where he is to "stim", like standing and bending over and pushing his hands on the floor. Or asking the aid to chase him around the room playing "tag".


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DwightF
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21 Dec 2008, 4:05 am

One more very important thing about the Safe Place. All the teachers, staff, and admin that work in this school (including any substitute teachers that come in) must understand in no uncertain terms that they are NEVER, EVER to send him to there as punishment or in anger, or force confine him there. He must feel safe there, that this is his place to go to, and return from. I've seen firsthand the fallout from crap like this, an ASC boy that at age 6 was locked in a closet by his Grade 1 teacher in response to meltdowns. Not that many times before his parents found out (and pulled him out of the school and then took the matter up the provincial Education Minister's office). Still just the obvious damage, the very idea of "school" freaking him out, took years to undo. :( Who knows if the scarring will ever completely heal for him. Absolutely gut wrenching.


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2ukenkerl
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21 Dec 2008, 8:13 am

violet_yoshi wrote:
2ukenkerl wrote:
I don't care if you are the queen of england, and the other person is your grandchild out of wedlock.


:lmao:


Glad you enjoyed it, but It DID have more meaning in context where I was saying that even the queen of england had no right to punish her own relatives without even asking. She was the highest social status I could think of in this context, and her grandchild(One related, yet possible) out of wedlock(Having less recognized status), was the lowest possible related that was .



DW_a_mom
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21 Dec 2008, 3:49 pm

DwightF wrote:
2ukenkerl wrote:
Maybe it is because I AM different, but I often wonder if parents just become senile or something, and forget what it was like when they were kids.

Some that experience it then mirror it. It is the behavior they learn to model, it is the "right" way. :/ It was horrible and miserable but they don't transcend the abuse to break the cycle, they just take their turn dishing it out.

P.S. I really hope, for the sake of his purported GF and her child, that krammer1 is just an internet troll being contrary. While he's close enough to the real deal to send my skin crawling (my oldest son once, at age 2 before he was talking, came back from the house of the ex's then BF with finger shaped bruises from his waist to the back of his knees) there is something a little too cliche, a little too over-the-top. Yeah there are people out there like krammer1, so he could be real. I'm just not convinced of it.


I think he's "partly" for real. As in, while he really does adhere to a very strict parenting style, he also enjoys overstating his opinions to bite back at us, and try to provide what he may see as "balance" to the board.


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wolfsmom
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21 Dec 2008, 4:33 pm

Well, I read all the recent posts. I am really sorry for the others who had terrible parents and were obviously abused.

I am proud to say, I love my daughter who is currently going through similar issues in her first year of 9th grade. I don't work so I can be there for her anytime she needs me. All, I know is love for her. I am aware, her communication skills are limited and work hard to get her to tell me her feelings when she feels ready as best she can do.

As for advice for the mom with the 6 year old, I have gone through a really hard time when my daughter transitioned to a new school in 2nd grade. It was very painful to see her distressed, so I literally lived at school with her. We also modified her school work, and I put her in horse therapy which helped her so much. She still rides horses to this day, and is very good at it.

Speech and Language skills are important and make sure the school is working hard to strengthen his language. Also, sensory integration therapy was really helpful and calming at that age. Never give up on your baby, no matter how hard it gets.

Hope it helps. Merry Christmas To All!

I wish that those who were abused for their disability understand, not all moms and dads are bad.



krista
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21 Dec 2008, 7:01 pm

i really appreciate everyones input but please let me state again, he is NOT being bullied, he does not get in trouble/punished for getting upset and this is not a new school for him, his behaviour of late has been new/old.
i agree that he is overwhelmed but within his school there is not space or the extra help to set up a safe place.
he has only just been diagnosed so all the help that he is entitled to has not been put intoo place yet. i'm trying to be pro-active and get information from people who have been there so that when this help is being offered and we are in discussion about it i will be better informed.
also, i'm sorry if the word regression offended anyone, not my intention. my son is showing signs of behaviour that he has not shown in years, regression was just an automatic term



ImMelody
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21 Dec 2008, 9:47 pm

krista wrote:
i really appreciate everyones input but please let me state again, he is NOT being bullied, he does not get in trouble/punished for getting upset and this is not a new school for him, his behaviour of late has been new/old.
i agree that he is overwhelmed but within his school there is not space or the extra help to set up a safe place.
he has only just been diagnosed so all the help that he is entitled to has not been put intoo place yet. i'm trying to be pro-active and get information from people who have been there so that when this help is being offered and we are in discussion about it i will be better informed.
also, i'm sorry if the word regression offended anyone, not my intention. my son is showing signs of behaviour that he has not shown in years, regression was just an automatic term


Regression usually means that he is losing skills he once had. Like a regression in speech, he would have lost speech, either in the amount of words he knows or the ability to speak altogether. Typically, behavior varies for every child, ASD or NT, so this is not considered regression. I hope that makes sense so you can understand why regression was taken the way it was.

That being said, I think it's really important that you're trying to be proactive, but looking at self-contained placement should not be the first option. If he were doing bad academically or in trouble often, then I would examine that as a last resort.

I can also appreciate that there is no space for a little "quiet time." I suggested there be some sort of sign for him to put on his desk to let the teacher and paras know that he is overwhelmed. If the supports aren't in place to help him recognize that he's overwhelmed, then you really need to push yourself forward and make them aware that those supports NEED to be in place. They can be the nicest people in the world, but without proper support, he will not succeed.

I'd also look into some fidgets or other distractors in the mean time. I'm working on this myself as an adult, but it would do well for him as well. These are tasks and objects he can do no matter where he's at that he can focus on, but not get agitated. Therapro has some awesome products: http://www.theraproducts.com/index.php? ... ath=307860

Hope that helps!


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natesmom
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22 Dec 2008, 1:14 am

People here have wonderful advice. I do think a lot of the behaviors are due to being overwhelmed due to sensory issues. In addition, there also could be lack of structure or lack of warning with transitions. Does he have a picture schedule or some type of schedule that he can follow? This seems to work really well for a child that has difficulty with transitions. How does he communicate with staff and peers? 2ukenker has a point when he said ask. He may just have a different way of telling you. It may be through nonverbal means. The way he may tell you or someone at school could be right before, during or after a behavior.

Is the school team doing a functional behavior assessment? An FBA helps to look beyond the actual behavior. It helps to sort out what is the "function" of the behavior. It is a type of assessment. For example, if your child is having auditory sensory issues, it could help to pinpoint what specific noises affect him the most, during what times, etc. Without this knowledge, it will be hard to help him.

I work in the school setting and really can't stand the cafeteria. I often need to get food in the cafeteria because I didn't bring my own from home. It is the most horrible experience. It is incredibly loud and the type of florescent lights drive me crazy. I can't stand it. After I go in to get food, I really need five minutes to regroup without anyone around due to sensory overstimulation. If I don't get that, I become short with people and I can't think. I never ever ate in the cafeteria during my four years in high school. It was that overwhelming. That is just an example of how many things in our environment can set us off. There could be a variety of things in his environment your child is having difficulty with. There also could be instructional issues or some other variables that could be making life difficult for him at the school. It is so hard to tell. There are so many possibilities. I strongly believe they should do an FBA to sort all of this information out.


I have nothing else to add. There are so many good ideas on here!!



ster
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23 Dec 2008, 8:50 pm

there is always room to set up a safe place.........they just need to be creative....my daughter goes to another classroom. my son used to go to the school social worker's office........your child needs a place to calm down. this should not be denied. just a few minutes could be all he needs.....



violet_yoshi
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24 Dec 2008, 12:08 am

ster wrote:
there is always room to set up a safe place.........they just need to be creative....my daughter goes to another classroom. my son used to go to the school social worker's office........your child needs a place to calm down. this should not be denied. just a few minutes could be all he needs.....


Exactly, after all at least in my high school, they gave the NTs extra time to be social before the end of class so they could unwind.



krista
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24 Dec 2008, 2:50 am

thank you for all your advice, it really has helped me.
we are just learning about my son's triggers and i really think that the special ed classes would help for at least a year so that he can learn about his triggers and about how to communicate that he is feeling overwhelmed.
i guess this has come as a shock to me, i must have been able to create a safe and calm environment for him without really being aware and the school environment is so different that we are all sort of playing catch up with trying to help him.
he is being observed by the school phychologist to document his behaviour and his strengths and weaknesses and when school starts back up we will look at the different school and get started writing up an iep.
again, thank you, i appreciate that you have all taken the time to give me advice



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24 Dec 2008, 9:56 am

My son seemingly regressed around the same age. The problem was mostly at school though and the stress of school spilled over into his home life. My son is also HFA and he didn't talk very much at all about his life or feelings at that age. You couldn't even get out of him what he did at school, not even what he had for lunch that day.

In first grade, the teasing from other kids starts. It gets worse in 2nd grade. If your son has impaired communication skills, they can run circles around him. Kids like getting other kids in trouble too and the one with the least verbal skills can't defend himself to the teather.

I started homeschooling.