Something I overheard in a store
04 Feb 2011, 2:20 pm
I get it - I grew up in a household something like this. In my case, none of my stuff went in the trash - my mother just picked up anything that was "out of place" by her definition (and her definition was EXTREMELY strict) and dumped it on my bed. Over and over and over again until the room was EXACTLY up to her standards.
I realize now that this is because my mother has AS with OCD tendencies. I'm no less angry about it, though: her mental health is her own responsibility; I'm trying to make sure my own issues don't spill over on to my son to the best of my ability.
This doesn't mean I don't find value in having my son participate in what it takes to run a household: I just try to make sure that his room is clean enough for HIM to use (and for sanitation purposes) and that he shares in the work we put into the house.
04 Feb 2011, 7:27 pm
Is everyone on this thread talking about the same things and coming at this from the same perspective?
For instance, how many of the parents here who argue in favor of discipline define discipline as choosing random things your kids do and harming them when they do them? How many of the people arguing against it do?
And how many of us who can't understand the value of discipline actually experienced that? Versus how many of the parents on this thread who argue in favor of it?
How many of the parents on this thread have memories of being little kids and not thinking ahead and wanting to do stupid things that would have hurt or killed them had they succeeded?
How many who think you should let kids do what they want have memories of being dragged into situations that are tantamount to torture by NT parents who did not understand and refused to believe their kids weren't just complaining because that's what kids do?
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I'm using a non-verbal right now. I wish you could see it. --dyingofpoetry
NOT A DOCTOR
04 Feb 2011, 8:03 pm
While I understand your point logically, I still disagree. My parents put in tremendous amount of effort into keeping their home clean. Anything in my room that wasn't hidden was swept into trash right in front of me. The happy, enthusiastic voice my parents' talked to me in every time they did "general cleaning" (their term for cleaning the entire home) was utterly disturbing! I could see right through the saccharine tone, as they told me what needed to be vacuumed, dusted, and mopped. This raises the questions. Did they know that I knew? And were they really that happy to clean, or was it just bad acting on their part? Basically, they talked about cleaning like it was an amusement park ride, rather than a household chore. One time, they had the audacity to say to my face: "it's great that your school is on break; you can help us clean", all in the same saccharine tone.
Now fast-forward to 2007, when I moved out into my apartment and never looked back. And guess what? There's junk mail all over the living room floor, pizza boxes on chairs, bookshelves overflowing with useless trinkets I got god-knows-where, clothes dumped on the couch, sink full of dirty dishes, bed never getting made, and a desk looking like it was hit by a hurricane. But there are quirky posters on the walls, infrastructure working properly, nice clothes in the closet, cigarettes by the balcony (I never smoke indoors), spicy snacks and vodka in the freezer, plenty of food in the fridge home-cooked by me plus Coke to drink, and a slightly damaged dictionary on the coffee table. Occasionally, I'd get fed up with the mess and do some "general cleaning" of my own, but that was mainly before safety inspections or relatives visiting, and even then, it'd be back to "normal" within ten days.
Moral of the story? You won't always teach work ethic through chores. I think I'd have learned much better if I worked as a floor sweeper in a corner store, like kids did 200 years ago. Come to think of it, when I was 10, my much-older sister said she'd find me a job washing cars in the neighborhood. I got very excited about it, only to find out it was all a joke! I never completely forgave that joke, even though I now understand that there are child labor laws that prohibit something like that.
sounds more like you are in the inbetween being a 'child' in your parents home stage and the being a parent stage. do you have kids and other people living with you because that really changes the way people run their homes. perhaps you have learned it but arent practicing it yet because you aren't at a stage in your life where these things start to matter yet.
04 Feb 2011, 8:05 pm
How many who think you should let kids do what they want have memories of being dragged into situations that are tantamount to torture by NT parents who did not understand and refused to believe their kids weren't just complaining because that's what kids do?
Oh... I've been there!
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Still looking for that blue jean baby queen, prettiest girl I've ever seen.
07 Feb 2011, 1:41 pm
Plainly put - NO. Some folks here are not parents but are projecting their experiences from their childhoods on to those of us who are currently trying to reasonably parent our asd kids. It is clear that some folks here has very bad experiences as kids and it is helpful for us parents to hear those experiences so that we can avoid making the same mistakes. What I personally find upsetting is being lumped into the same category as the people Aspie1 just decribed. No offense intended but I AM NOTHING like that. I don't have the time to put a "tremendous effort" into cleaning my home, and even if I had the time, I don't have the inclination for everything to be spotless, but when 4 people share a living space, it is not possible to allow there to be "junk mail all over the living room floor, pizza boxes on chairs, bookshelves overflowing with useless trinkets I got god-knows-where, clothes dumped on the couch, sink full of dirty dishes, bed never getting made, and a desk looking like it was hit by a hurricane".
I would really like to remind the Aspie folks who don't have kids but who come and post here, Please don't generalize and categorize us. We are all individuals and we have feelings. If we didn't care about our kids we wouldn't be here.
07 Feb 2011, 3:22 pm
to be honest, my bed is never made, and i dont expect the kids to make theirs either. my desk always looks like a tornado hit it as that seems to be where my family stores its junk mail and schoolwork brought home. i have 5 laundry baskets, a hamper, and a large 4 compartment hamper system, so the clothes thankfully never make it to the couch, altho they do often sit around in baskets for a couple days getting all wrinkled. our sink is always full of dishes, which i spoke to my SO and older 2 kids about last night as dishes are their job (i do all the laundry) and none of them did dishes for 3 days; i literally served dinner and drinks last night in gladware bowls and empty jelly jars.
what i do expect is that their dirty clothes go into the hamper, dirty dishes into the sink, soda cans into the recycling, garbage into the garbage can, and toys into toy bins in their room. my living room floor is not where any of those things belong, but its where all those things end up if i dont make them keep the house picked up.
it is not too much to ask, in fact its all quite reasonable. i shouldnt have to step over other peoples dirty underwear on the bathroom floor to brush my teeth. i refuse to step on legos when im walking through my own living room. and i get really annoyed when i cant even get into my house after work because they all come home and leave their shoes and jackets lying on the floor behind the front door. btw, all of those things have happened in the past month.
i DO remember what its like growing up. i remember the rat trails through the stacks of boxes, never ever having a friend over, the dirty clothes filling up the only tub in the house, no running water and/or electricity for months at a time, having one cleaned off spot on the couch to sit, my moms queen size bed covered with junk except for the body sized empty spot she slept in, overflowing litter boxes and cat feces on the floor, swarms of flies raising their little baby maggots in the dirty dishes that covered every surface in the kitchen. and i swore my children would not be raised like that, nor would i let them grow up like pigs and raise my grandchildren like that.
being AS doesnt make you the sole authority on rotten childhoods, and being NT doesnt protect you from it either. there are worse things in the world than clean freak parents.
i remember childhood all too well, thank you very much.
hot button topic ftw.
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Neurotypically confused.
partner to: D - 40 yrs med dx classic autism
mother to 3 sons:
K - 6 yrs med/school dx classic autism
C - 8 yrs NT
N - 15 yrs school dx AS
07 Feb 2011, 3:30 pm
i DO remember what its like growing up. i remember the rat trails through the stacks of boxes, never ever having a friend over, the dirty clothes filling up the only tub in the house, no running water and/or electricity for months at a time, having one cleaned off spot on the couch to sit, my moms queen size bed covered with junk except for the body sized empty spot she slept in, overflowing litter boxes and cat feces on the floor, swarms of flies raising their little baby maggots in the dirty dishes that covered every surface in the kitchen. and i swore my children would not be raised like that, nor would i let them grow up like pigs and raise my grandchildren like that.
I think we must be related. :-\
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Still looking for that blue jean baby queen, prettiest girl I've ever seen.
