Sometimes I HATE my AS step-son

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This is a really helpful way of explaining the mechanism behind what I was talking about earlier. Thank you; I'm going to make sure my husband understands this, too.

Speaking of playing word games, I don't think it matters what the person said, it only matters what you knew they meant so what they say didn't matter or else you are just being a smart ass. Some NT kids do this too so I didn't see any difference between an aspie and NT doing it if they both knew what a person meant. I remember doing it too in my childhood. One time my mother told us "No Nintendo" and I knew she meant no video games but because we didn't have a Nintendo back then and we only had a Sega, I broke the rule and played it anyway. I just wanted people to be precise then so I would listen to their words only and when mom catch me, I always told her she said no Nintendo, not no Sega.

I also remember another time in 5th grade, I was coloring and my teacher told me to close my binder. I knew he was telling me to close it because he didn't want me coloring so what do I do? I take the page out and close it and the teacher tells me to put the page back in the binder.

Okay this behavior would piss me off if someone did it to me and they full well knew what I meant and I would kick my child's ass for this. Not literally of course.

Of course playing this game is very bad for an aspie because it's crying wolf and one day they will take something literal and the person will think they were playing the word game and not believe they genuinely thought they meant what they said.

Last edited by League_Girl on 15 Dec 2011, 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

My parents straight out said "No video games". This always confused me if they said something like No Nintendo. Because I am over thinking and rather critical. So if they weren't specific enough I'd ask a buttload of questions about the perimeters of the punishment. For me, I wanted to know if they were singnaling out one thing or multiple things. As I got older I understood it more. But I was the opposite of your case. As a kid if someone told me something not so specific, it wasn't understood much.

My younger brother J-bird, however, is much like you. It's pretty funny how he can behave so dumb, but I know he understands. You can see it in his eyes, his little head working. But he'd never double cross what I'd say. He follows the rules. And even though he can easily play dumb, he has never really done the opposite if I state a less specific. It's cause he'll try, but his need for following out rules overrides it. I find it kind of hilarious to be honest. I've been waiting for him to do it to me.

I just think everyone is a different case. And I feel that people should understand instead of accusing. Because what they think is completely different to how I think.

In your case it was different because you genuinely didn't understand. I am talking about aspies who full well know what someone meant by what they've said. That can be bad for us if we play that game because if we do it too much, the NTs are not going to know when we genuinely didn't understand what they've said and will think we are being a smart ass because we had cried wolf too many times. It is annoying when people do that. My husband used to do it to me all the time and I didn't buy it so I told him "That doesn't work with me, I don't care what I said. It only matters if you knew what I meant."

I don't think it's being a smart ass nor playing the game if you aren't sure what someone meant so you ask. You just want to avoid a misunderstanding so you want to be sure you understood what they've said. Like if someone said you can't do something anymore and you think they mean forever (Not today, not tomorrow, not next week, never), you ask anyway if they mean forever just to be sure they meant that.

Today I spent hours shopping for just the right Star Wars gift for Seth for Christmas. Then I helped him with his homework, made him dinner, talked to him about his day, etc. He was complaining about things as usual but I listened and sympathized with him. Later, his dad came in to help him with a math problem and Seth was whining and whining and his dad blew up at him and made him go to his room for the rest of the night. I told my husband that that wasn't cool and he needed to find another way to express his anger at Seth. Then my husband pointed to the computer and said "read the Word document up on the screen"...it was an essay that Seth had already handed in to his teacher (who I ran into at the store tonight by the way)...It was called "My Family is a Bomb"... I'm paraphrasing, but it went something like this:

My family is a bomb. It explodes without warning. My stepmother is the fuse, she excels at making me angry. My father tries to defuse the bomb with kindness, but he is unable to, and ends up exploding as well. I am the explosives because all the blame is put on me.

Again, that's a paraphrase...it was a little longer than that. After I read it I had to leave the room. My husband was really angry about the essay and said it was incredibly unfair and not an accurate assessment of how things are. That Seth just didn't want to blame him (his dad) for his angry eruptions. I said that it made me not want to try anymore. My husband admitted that he doesn't want to try anymore either. He said that he feels hopeless, and like jumping off of a cliff or turning into an oncoming dump truck.

I am so worried about my husband! I'm thankful that he has a counseling appointment in the morning, I hope he doesn't choose to skip it. I made the suggestion (given to me earlier in this thread) that when my husband starts getting angry he should say to Seth "I'm starting to get really angry and I'm going to start yelling at you if you don't stop and I don't want to start yelling". My husband said that he has already tried that several times, but it doesn't stop Seth from doing whatever behavior is getting him into trouble.

The line in that essay that really kills me is the one that says "My father tries to defuse the bomb with kindness, but he is unable to, and ends up exploding as well." First of all, 95% of the "explosions" that happen in the house are between my husband and Seth without any input from me, as in, I may not even be in the room or involved in any way in the interaction that's causing the friction. And *I* am endlessly kind to him everyday, even when he treats me like total crap. Tonight, for example, I was giggling because I had just whispered to my husband what I had bought Seth for Christmas and I was excited because I know he'll flip out over it. And I smiled really big at Seth, very genuinely (he knew it was about his Christmas gift), and he gave me a really dirty look and rolled his eyes and made an exasperated sigh. I told him that it made me feel bad when he rolled his eyes at me and he just said "whatever!".

I mean, it makes me feel so sad that that essay is an honest expression of how he feels, that that is how he sees me. The stuff I do that makes him angry, like making him do his homework, brush his teeth, bath, eat, etc. If I stopped reminding him he'd probably flunk all his classes, become emaciated, and continue to get cavities in his permanent teeth, etc. My husband doesn't have the drive to check those things, if I don't, it just doesn't happen. I feel right now like I'm damned if I do, and damned if I don't. And really, it's probably easier to just check out of it all!

I can understand how reading those words must have been really hurtful. You have two choices for how to deal with this now. You can harbor resentment or you can use this as a wake up call to make some changes. I think the essay was about HIM not about YOU (or his dad). I know that may not make much sense to you right now because you are hurting. I don't think his intention was to make you feel bad. He was expressing the pain he is feeling. Be careful, if you squash his expression like this, he may never share anything important with you ever again.

In my observation, you have a lot of expectations that you should examine and perhaps revise. And before you object to that look at what you have written here. You do a lot of things for Seth and you perceive that as your way of showing you love him. You expect that when you do these things for him he is going to appreciate them and it is going to make him happy. That may be an unrealistic expectation. AS a matter of fact, he is telling you that all the things you are doing for him are not making him happy. Yes there has to be rules about brushing teeth and doing homework but not too many kids that age are very appreciative when Mom makes dinner. I hate to say this but you are really enabling your step son and your husband. What you have described is a very co-dependent relationship. One step you can take is to let other do for themselves what they can. You kind of hit it on the head at the very end of your last post - if Seth doesn't do things for himself, there will be bad consequences but how is he going to learn that if you never let him fail?
I'm sorry if this sounds harsh because my heart really does go out to you. It jsut sounds like you guys really need to make some changes in your lives.

Right - I think this is another gift that feels like a slap.

It's tricky to sort out what to do from this, but it's a real blessing to know how your stepson feels. My son also feels that I'm the "bad cop" in our family, and points it out to me (often in a hurtful way) on a regular basis, and I think he things magic elves make meals and buy clothes and clean the house . Parenting, especially the part about keeping things going and moving forward and glued together, isn't rewarding in the short term, kids just don't understand how things work or why the world doesn't go the way they expect.

Somewhere, underneath everything, your stepson appreciates or will eventually appreciate what you're doing, provided you find a way to address your feelings of being put-upon. He's got an awful lot of very generalized hurt and angry, and right now, you are the safest place to direct that. He doesn't have a lot of safety in his life right now - you can think of this as an extremely backwards compliment. Three years is not a long time to try to recover from your life being turned completely upside down.

You all really do need professional help. While I think it's great that you're using this forum as a sounding board, we are none of us professionals, and are all guessing the reasons behind what's going on and how to help you. Untangling family dynamics is a complex process. This letter (which should really be offered to a counselor with your stepson's permission) should be most helpful to a counselor, and may actually be a good way to "vet" a counselor: I'd look for a counselor who sees this letter as good information but doesn't use it as an opportunity to judge or lay blame on your stepson, you, or your husband. A good counselor will treat everyone in the family as equals, will call out everyone equally, will listen equally to all sides. Make sure your counselor is well-attuned to people with autism (many say they are, but aren't.)

I would approach your stepson in a non-blaming way, something like "I can see you're really struggling with our family. We're all struggling, too. Thanks for writing what you are feeling, I think it's really important - since I don't quite know what to do with this information, I'd like to take this to our counselor and see if she (he) can help us sort this out to make things better." Better still, ask the counselor how to approach your stepson to ask about bringing this information in.

One of the ways we are approaching parenting with my son that seems to work for him: I tell him we're a team, and we're all working together to help him become an adult. He is a critical part of our team - he's a part of parenting. It's a helpful way to think about things; teamwork rather than hierarchy.

Something to consider -

Parents and parenting are taken for granted by their children UNLESS something is terribly wrong and missing.

SO - if you don't have enough of something, it is less likely to be taken for granted. BUT, if there is abundance of whatever, it is taken for granted that that thing is there. So, all of the stuff that all of us who are parenting do because we love our children, is typically taken for granted even though we would like it appreciated. You (and probably your husband) are probably having trouble with that part because you went from one extreme to another (providing little to providing everything) - you really feel each thing you are doing for this child, and he's like "so what".

I came from a childhood of not enough. I used to overplay gratitude for everything I got in hopes that I would get just a little more. For instance socks. I made a decision a long time ago, that my kids should take the basics for granted and more.

I don't have any answers for you on what to do next, but i just wanted you to know that most of us know that feeling of being taken for granted and it's totally normal, you need to get used to it and just know it means you are well providing for your DSS.

Both of my children (on NT and one AS) are very thankful of what I do for them. Although my NT DD is much more aware than my AS DS. I have taken it for granted, but in reading you post, I realized I totally have my husband to thank. He makes a point of thanking me for things I do. (He learned this from his father). He always compliments the meal maker (usually me, but sometimes the children if one of them prepared a part of the meal or helped. After I fold the clothes, I have 4 baskets and put each person's clothes in their basket to put away. He always thanks me for washing and folding the clothes as he puts his away side-by-side with the kids. If I ask a child to do something and they grumble. He will stop and ask them "what is your mother doing now for you?" (its usually dishes, laundry or preparing a meal - neverending tasks) and then remind them that "we all have to contribute to the care of the family."

I am not saying your husband does not do these things, but maybe it would be a small bit of help for both of you to model the appreciation of each person in your family.

I realize this will not even begin to "fix" the dynamics in your family. It is very tiring to be around an angry child day in and day out, especially when you are the "punching bag" as an outlet to their anger about life. My heart goes out to you.

Let me clairfy -

My children have very good manners, they will thank me for buying them socks. that said, they expect me to buy them and have no idea that there is a choice to not buy said socks. They are not actually grateful for the socks, they are polite.

I joke that my kids take travel for granted and will regret that when they are older. We were just discussing going on a family vacation and our eldest said, no thanks. In my opinion, if he really understood the cost and effort that vacations take, he should be appreciative of the opportunity and jump at the chance to go. Until there is an absence of invites to go to Hawaii for free, and he has to figure out the way to pay, he really does take it for granted. (that said, he still says thank you).

That said, all members of a household should have their efforts appreciated, including the kids. I train people at work and one of the things I teach is" you get what you pay attention to: so if you see something you like from someone you live with, thank them!

First of all, I apologize for not responding to all the comments I received before I posted last night, but I was in a pretty dark place at the time and I just posted without reading what others had written. I especially wanted to say how sorry I am about your son liloleme! That is so tragic, really just beyond words. It's a good reminder too, to not take anyone for granted. Even when family is making you crazy, you know you would be totally lost if anything happened to them. As difficult as things are with Seth right now, I appreciate that he is healthy and safe.

I also wanted to say that I enjoyed hearing about your mainly "NT" daughter and her relationship with her boyfriend. You didn't say so outright, but I'm assuming he's an Aspie? I know that my husband's first wife (Seth's mom) thought that he was a controlling (i.e. abusive) person, but she had no understanding of AS. I know that he needs for things to be a certain way in order to feel secure and happy and I knew that, and was perfectly happy to make the accommodations, before we got married. He is truly a kindhearted, good person who gets easily over-stimulated.

To Pandora's Box...you think that Seth is really no lying just being very literal, and yet there are times when he out and out lies. "What happened the the pumpkins we carved" "I don't know, I think teenagers smashed them." Only to later find out that he smashed them. That kind of thing.

I agree with League_Girl that there's a lot of word gaming going on. I'm sure a lot of the time it's a legit miscommunication but It's good to hear that people with AS are capable of understanding some things when we speak in generalities such as that "don't play Nintendo" means "don't play video games"...and decide to take it as literal in order to get their way. I had a strong suspicion that has been the case with Seth on many occasions, just based on the guilty way he gave his response. Oh well, it keeps me on my toes and I try to speak very intentionally so we just don't have to go there.

It's possible for an aspie to be controlling and abusive. It's also possible for an aspie to lie to stay out of trouble and to avoid doing things.

But sometimes an aspie is controlling unintentionally because they like things a certain way so they can keep calm and unfortunately that effects people around them because they are forced to do things their way or else they have meltdowns from having anxiety.

An aspie can get abusive due to their meltdown like is they hit and throw stuff at people.

Control is control and abuse is abuse. A label doesn't disqualify someone from these terms. It's like saying a serial killer isn't a killer just because he may have no control over what he does or that a rapist isn't a rapist because he couldn't control his urges.

Hi Bombaloo, thanks for your comments, I wanted to respond to some of them because I honestly don't know where you're coming from on a few of them. We are constantly trying to make changes to improve our home life. We have family meetings regularly where we use a big sheet of paper and we go around in a circle, each person sharing something that they think will make our home life better and no one can shut down another person's idea. Then we prioritize the ideas and assign someone to help make whatever the desired outcome is, possible. It may sound weird, but it actually works. Some of the things have been to do more things together as a family outside the house, to give back more to the community, to rearrange the kitchen so it's easier to get to the things we use often, and to get new flooring (as a long term goal). We always give Seth's contributions as much respect and weight as anyone else's.[/quote]



I agree that the worst thing to do would be to squash his expression or make him feel that he can't be honest about how he's feeling. Of course, there are private and public ways of expressing this anger...writing it in an essay that will likely get hung in the school hall-way, is perhaps not the best outlet for our family problems, particularly when the perspective is skewed.



As far as examining my expectations goes, I'm not sure that my expectations are out of order. I do not expect Seth to appreciate me helping him do his homework, or doing his shopping, cooking, and cleaning...I *do* expect him to appreciate the fact that his dad and I buy him an incredible amount of toys related to his special interest, that I take him to the library and video store to get books and movies related to his special interest, that I take him skiing, and to music performances and other events *because he wants to go* and would not be able to without me as he's only 11 years old!

I do expect for him to have quirks, to want to talk about his special interest all the time, to get over-stimulated, to be disorganized and literal and forgetful. Those things might annoy me, but I never get angry with him about it.

What I also expect, is that he will treat people, including me, with a little common courtesy and respect, the same way I treat him. That he will *not* roll his eyes and respond in a nasty tone of voice when addressing me, or his dad or his grandparents or teachers...that he will "on occasion" do as he's politely asked without arguing for 20 minutes first. That he won't complain continually that he "never gets what he wants" when it feels like we are constantly catering to his needs. That he won't steal, or lie to me just because he wants to get away with doing something he knows he's not supposed to do. And yes, there may be times it's a literal word game thing but most of the times, I state *exactly* what I mean, and he lies to my face. I think these are reasonable expectations.

I honestly don't understand what you mean by saying that I'm enabling my son and husband, or that we're codependent. My husband has AS...he doesn't see some things as being that big of a deal...for example, he wouldn't care if Seth didn't bath and went to school for 3 weeks in a row, in the same nasty stained t-shirt and blue jeans. It's not that he's being neglectful or that he doesn't care, it's just that neither of them think that's such a big deal. Seth has enough of a hard time making friends without being seen as the class Pig-pen.

You said "if Seth doesn't do things for himself, there will be bad consequences but how is he going to learn that if you never let him fail? " He's already failing! Literally, failing his classes, getting cavities in all his teeth (and I end up spending a lot on his dental bills because we don't have insurance for it)...plus, he's vegan so when you say to let him live with the bad consequences ...the consequences of not eating enough protein when you're starting puberty would be permanent! Your muscles, bones, and especially your brain need proper nutrients. I'm unwilling to let him learn the hard way about his choices...he's already skin and bones! Besides, every parent on this forum has shared all the ways they are trying to help their children succeed. What makes my efforts codependent?

I have taught him how to cook vegan food and he is responsible for making his own snacks and sometimes cooks us dinner but he can't be expected to cook every night for himself on top of all of his homework and chores?

And my husband is incredibly hard-working. He has a job that has him on call 24/7 and he also takes night classes, helps with house cleaning, does his own laundry, helps Seth with his homework when he can, does some cooking etc. He works very hard but he gets overwhelmed too, and then he just "turtles" by playing solitaire for hours and hour and hours on end. It's his way of coping with having too much on his plate...but don't we all?

I am not a martyr. I am just trying to find a way for our little family to stay afloat!

Kailuamom: I didn't mean offense, actually It was a combination of yours and step's posts that made me realize what my hubby does. It was an eye-opener for me. Something I have taken for granted. The comment I made was actually directed toward Step. I totally get what you are talking about and believe me, my children are the same way. I would hope my children expect me to provide basics like socks, food, home, love... and you are so right in saying people are often only thankful of these basics when they have been neglected.

Control may be control, but I would say the motivation for it is what makes it abusive or not...in most cases.

My husband is not motivated by jealousy or wanting to control *me*. He doesn't try to control or restrict who I'm friends with, where I go, what I do, or anything like that as he trusts me 100%. What he tries to control is his *environment*. He may ask me to wear headphones when I watch TV, but it's not because he's getting off on the power of having me do his will, it's because he doesn't like to watch TV and he's very sensitive to sound. Sometimes just the flashing light from the TV bothers him, even when he's facing in the other direction! Because I love him and don't mind wearing headphones in the least, I don't mind making that accommodation for him.

There were misunderstandings when he and I first started dating. He used to always dictate where we were going to go out to eat. I used to think that was controlling. I asked him about it once and he said it was because when he'd asked me where we should go out to eat I'd flood him with choices and that would make him feel anxious. For example, I'd say "We go out for Chinese, like to The Spicy Wok or Panda Gardens, or if you're in the mood for Mexican we could go to that new place on the pier...although pizza sounds good too...there's Pizza Hut or Pizza Olympia?" He'd get overwhelmed with too many choices, so instead he would decide in advance somewhere we could go and since I always seemed fine with his choice, he didn't think it was a problem. Once I found out his motivation, we compromised to where he'd ask me and I'd only give one or two choices and he could make an alternate request if those didn't appeal to him.

If a person is unaware of the needs of a person with AS they could make all the wrong moves without even knowing it, and cause their partner to react in a way that seems controlling and/or abusive. If in a dispute the AS partner is trying to retreat and calm down until they can discuss the matter in a less flooded state and the non AS partner continues to advance, the partner with AS might explode and have a melt-down and say hurtful things even though they are not in a state where they have much, if any, control over themselves.

If I recognize my husband is getting flooded and simply say, "let's talk about this later when we've had a chance to think about it" and allow him to retreat and calm down...the melt-down can be avoided 100% of the time. That doesn't mean the situation gets swept under the rug, it just means we talk about it later after we've had a chance to cool down and think about things. My husband and I never get into heated arguments, we rarely argue at all and when we do, it is *always* related to Seth.

Seth on the other hand, can not recognize when his dad is getting flooded and therefore keeps advancing until the point where a melt-down happens on both sides. That's not really Seth's fault, nor is it my husband's fault. I get stuck feeling like a referee who has to send them to their corners. It's not a lot of fun. And yes, I felt it was abusive when my husband told Seth "That's why you don't have any friends" and I told him as much. He knows it too, but he doesn't know why he says those kinds of things when he's really angry and no matter how much he desires NOT to say those things, they can still slip out during a melt-down. I don't know what the answer is. We've tried hand gestures and code words and a hundred other things but nothing seems to work. I hope that when we start to work with an autism specialist in Feb. she will have some new things for us to try.

I think Kailuamom hit the nail on the head - what if you stopped doing all these things (or some of them at least)? If going to all that effort is not making him happy, and his response is obviously making you unhappy, maybe you need to cut back. Then maybe you won't feel so unappreciated and he will start to figure out that you are a very valuable person in his life and that he needs to treat you better.



You say you don't get angry with him but you've posted about how upset you get when he reacts badly after you have gone out of your way to do fun things with/for him. Perhaps his negative reactions are due to over stimulation or mis-understanding what is expected of him. When you told that story about the day of the gingerbread house making all I could think was, WOW you did that ALL in one day? If we did half that amount of stuff with my DS in one day, he would be an utter basket case by the end of the day. I would completely expect eye rolling and screaming when the movie was cut-off and I would not take it personally. I think you might be missing some signs of him being overwhelmed. Meltdowsn come in a lot of different forms.



What makes your efforts co-dependent (IMO, I'm not a professional psych or anything like that just been in a lot of therapy myself) is your reaction to the situation. It's the "Oh woe is me, I helped him with his homework and cooked dinner for him and let him tell me endlessly about his special interest and he then he says I'm a terrible person and now I feel hurt". We want the other person to feel a certain way about what we have done and when they don't we feel bad about ourselves.
The following example you gave speaks volumes about the assumptions you are making.

He had no idea what you whispered to your husband. It's possible he thought your smile was because you were making fun of him. Aspies are kind of notorious for not understanding teasing. You are thinking that he knows what is going on inside your head. He doesn't know that anymore than you know what is going on inside his head. You were feeling excited about something nice you did for Seth and you wanted him to feel that too except there was no way for him to understand the situation. And even if he did know you were feeling excited, he shouldn't be forced to feel the same way just because you want him to. The thing that really rang the co-dependent bell for me was when you said,

This sounds to me like you are excusing your husband from taking responsibility for things he needs to take responsibility for. Seth is his kid too. Taking on all the responsibility for this stuff is obviously having deliterious effects on your health and well-being. I was on a similar path. I had to take a hard look at myself and figure out the things I was doing for other people that they are perfectly capable of doing for themselves. I think this is hard because many of us moms just react and do what we see needs to be done but then we can end up feeling resentful and angry. Amazingly enough, sometimes when we back off and just let things go undone (and I'm not talking about meals or other such essentials) the other people in our lives will actually pick up the slack.

You say you are not a martyr which may be true but it sounds like you are taking a lot of Seth's reactions quite personally. One thing I've learned hree is that Aspie's are generally not trying to make anyone else feel bad when they act in a way that we perceive as rude, they just don't see what they are doing. He can, however, learn to be more perceptive about how his actions make other people feel. That will be a slow process.

I understand being frustrated when your kid is being incredibly stubborn, I feel that way a lot. What I don't do anymore is let my feelings be hurt when he does things like yeel at me that I am the WROST MOM IN THE UNIVERSE at the top of his lungs in public. I know that he doesn't actually mean that and what he is really trying to say is that he is overwhelmed, uncomfortable, scared, anxious or is otherwise very upset. You mentioned a couple of times that Seth's essay was not "accurate" or that his "perspective is skewed". I find your reaction here alarming. It is as if you are saying his feelings are not valid. His feelings ARE valid, Your feelings are valid, your husband's feelings are valid. Yes we can talk about appropriate methods of communicating those feelings but everyone is entitled to feel what they feel.

Sorry I'll stop rambling. It is obvious that you are really putting forth a lot of effort and that you are doing your best.