Aspartners: Questions

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I appreciate your empathy. What happened to Emile? Emile, why did you delete your post?

I was sick and in a cranky mood yesterday, so not as thoughtful as usual - I was worried it would be interpreted as too critical, so I thought I'd just get rid of it. If it was useful advice, well then cheers. I like to give advice, but I don't have all the answers myself, so sorry if I got carried away there.

Oh man! Did you get the flu? My wife had it a few days ago and I had to nurse her back to health.

I hope you're feeling better. Make yourself some chicken noodle soup.

Thanks, Not the flu - got that a few weeks ago, this was just some 24 hr stomach bug. Feeling better already.

I am glad. Emile you and ASDMommy are right. These women are of no help, lack any critical thinking skills at all, are extremely bigoted and are hateful.

Look at 51-60. There is no use in speaking to these women as these women are ignorant.

Look at this snippet from BSTN.



Wrongplanet is wonderful and I have learned a lot here. There are a few NTs here but they're rare. For the most part, we're left here to conjecture amongst ourselves. Yes, NTs do come here and help at times and it is a blessing when they do but a lot are offended and are driven away . I do love the people on wrongplanet especially in the parents section. ASDMommy, you've been a great help, so has momsparky and InThisTogether. Emile, you've been good as well.

AS and their partners. I have never been there.

I have looked up life coaches and job coaches. They cost $500.00-$800.00 a pop. I tried voc rehab and they admitted they were not able to help me and sent me to the Autism center in which it is One session which is one hour per session and it is $100.00 per hour. I would get this session every other week. We can't afford this.

For the most part outside help is geared towards families whose children who have an ASD. This woman knows not what she is talking about. She says there is all of this assistance. Where? It may be out there if one has a lot of money to spare.

What government assistance is she talking about? Is she talking about SSDI? I can tell you it is not that much. These women have no critical thinking skills at all. This is why they don't understand the stuff I write on my blog. What resources do these women provide for aspies? They claim their website is a good resource for aspies. What utter crock. Why am I even punishing myself with this?(rethorical question). I guess I am just a glutton for punishment.

The help I need isn't just psychological or social skills training but is way more than that. It is philosophical and spiritual in nature. It is ontological and identity. http://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Ontological_crisis

I read 51-60. They must be lurking on here. I see, again, how they constantly refer to themselves as "nice people," I presume it is to make it sound like all the hateful things they say over there are not hateful. Double speak.

Don't let them make you feel bad b/c you need help. They complain about how so much help is out there for adult aspies, not knowing or caring that it is not so. There is barely any real help or tolerance for the little ones and that dwindles as the years go by. The alternate assumption that some NT IRL must have given you help is just as ridiculous. Nice for them to presume that that is the case or that this would be sufficient.

I notice that they have no problem (see post #57) accepting government assistance and charity themselves, but expect other people to just do it on their own. No one on there is criticizing the poster on post #57 for that, now are they? It is the height of hypocrisy. Ignore how they say you should learn from them. All they think is that you should learn aspies are intrinsically abusive and NTs are intrinsically nice. These are not facts, but only prejudice. It is a useless, hateful site with nothing constructive for you to glean.

I'm not going to let them make me feel bad. Post 61 will be my last post and just it case it gets deleted here is what I said.



There is no point in having a conversation with what League_Girl calls Ass Partners which is a fitting name for them. If these women used critical thinking they would be able to understand the stuff I am saying on my blog. http://whyifailedinamerica.wordpress.com/

There is no attempt on their part to dissect my logic whatsoever. All they did was instead of trying to attack my arguments they made ad hominem attacks against me.

For your child, I think you are doing the right thing by homeschooling him. It would not surprise me if some of his teachers was like these intolerable women. For your son they tried to treat it as a behavior problem instead of what it really was.

For me, the most difficult concept I am having difficulty with is theory vs. reality. NTs hang onto their theories even though they don't measure up with how it works in reality. They have such a strong emotional attachment to the theories they will fight tooth and nail to keep them and will do things outside of their theory. Yet, they will deny and never question the idea itself. This means their beliefs and actions become inconsistent and they believe in other theories which are contradictory to others they believe in.

I can't wrap my mind around this at all. How do they believe A and ~A at the same time?

**addendum**
She responded to me. I don't follow what she is even talking about. She is so incoherent. It is like word salad.

"Mock us"?

How is cube mocking them? Maybe she means me and others. It's obvious they also lurk here too sometimes and saw this thread. Cube did nothing but ask questions and they were all rude and hostile. I don't see how it's bullying. Interesting. I learn something new all the time, bullying now means asking questions to some people. Man, pretty soon I won't even take that word seriously anymore because anything is bullying these days and the real bully victims won't be taken seriously when they say they're being bullied.

League_Girl, they're so hypocritical and contradictory. They mock us all the time on their forums. The hypocrisy there is amazing. If any of us are going to get any answers it won't be from them. Why do they hate Noam Chompsky for? I've read some of his stuff and he makes a lot of sense.

I was questioning the whole Zeitgeist and Narrative of American Society itself and the assumptions that lead to this Zeitgeist and Narrative. Even some Aspies on here especially the philosophy forum believes the narrative and follows it without understanding the rationale behind it especially the beliefs and tenets. For me, as I grew up I thought society was a certain way and worked a certain way. In recent years, what I thought true is not true. My whole world has been turned upside which is why I've been trying to delve through mathematics, philosophy, what people say, etc to understand why.

For me, it isn't just the social skills that are the problem. For me, I believe I am having what is called an existential crisis. Have you seen the Matrix? For me, its like what I thought was the real world was an illusion especially how one obtains a job after he or she goes to college. I zigged where I should have zagged. Where did I zig at? If I have delusional and warped thinking then what is the delusion that I am under? I can't seem to get my doctors or family to grasp this. They think I know more than I really do. I am looking at societal beliefs and the zeitgeist as a whole and I don't grasp how this extreme internal locus of control was thought up. What is the rationale behind it?

In America, does one have to pretend to be something he is not? If he does, is he not forced to be dishonest? How can one live his life in virtue? What is virtue and what is vice?


*Addendum*

I left their site. I am not going to post there anymore. There is one thing I am going to have to agree with them on and I just looked it up on their front page. They do not want any aspie posting their whatsoever. I did not even know this. Why was lwaxy allowed to post? What is the rule behind when this rule is enforced or not?

Murder to me is wrong, I know about it and my conscious says it is wrong. There are laws and moral codes that prohibit murder and so does my moral conscious. This is in the set of known, knowns.


I will say this. Any rule that is in the set of unknown, unknowns I feel no obligation to follow. This elaborates further. http://whyifailedinamerica.wordpress.com/2013/04/23/42/

Based upon what they say, conformity is key. In America, they feel no obligation to helping those who can't because of their belief system.

My question is if one is not supposed to have the world conform to him in anyway then why give the advice to do so in the phrase "Be true to yourself"? The more I intricately think about American beliefs the more contradictions I see.

I do have further questions. Are there times in which committing trespass is a virtue and not a vice? To answer this question, I have to ask are some virtues greater than others? Let's say my trespass, breaking certain laws and breaking certain rules helps society as a whole to become better? I put forth my blog and a series of questions to them. I questioned and challenged the American belief system itself. By my writings, my questioning and my trespass help contribute to making society better and more virtuous? Socrates questioned people of the day. Did I commit a wrong or did I follow a nobler virtue? If my wrong indirectly helps to get ASDmommy's son the assistance he needs in school and to be able to live a happy and noble did I commit a vice or was I virtuous?

I say no because based upon the 2nd formulation of Kantian Ethics they have to be an end and not a means to an end. Trespassing is not a virtue. I will not post there anymore. There attitude like the rest of American society is "It ain't my problem" and "NIMBY."

I do appreciate the help I can get and I appreciate my family and my wife's family as well. I do appreciate the members on here especially those in the parent's forum. The parents have found excellent resources not only for their use but for other people's use as well and I do appreciate the help I have received here thus far.

To me it sounds like that site is for people who want to leave their AS partner, and are looking for encouragement and support in that decision. That's why it's so important to them that everyone agrees they are "nice" - societal approval is what they're seeking.

I thought you said they cleaned out so that meant they decided to not have any aspies there and just wipe them all out from their forum and their posts and have the rule be black and white, no exceptions.


You're right they're hypocrites, one thing I have observed is some of of them have said if they knew their partner had autism, they wouldn't have married them. Okay, so why did they marry them in the first place? Didn't they have problems with them then? Did they think they would just change? Do people expect someone to change so they stay with them? I thought if things are not working out or you don't like things about someone, you leave them and that comes before you marry them. Or do these people believe in working things out as in change them or expect them to change and stay and be in la la land and then they re surprised or devastated when they find out they're on the spectrum. To me it's no different because no matter who the person is regardless of NT or autism or whatever condition or mental illness they have, I do not accept certain behaviors in people and if things are not working out and they don't change, I leave them like I did with my ex boyfriends. How long can you wait for them to change? If someone isn't willing to change, you cannot change them. I do think it's hypocritical to put up with a behavior in a normal person but not in a ASD person because they're saying they wouldn't have married them if they knew.

Also "be true to yourself" is a bunch of bull. That phrase can be twisted and interpreted in different ways by people and taken literal by those on the spectrum and I think some people do use it as an excuse to be jerks and not respect your feelings or others or be considerate of others and just use it as an excuse to not change. Just a example of twisting it. I still believe my ex may have taken it too literal like you suggested but it still made him a jerk because of the kind of person he was. I bet telling him whoever told him that advice was full of it and it's a bunch of bull and what it really means, he might still be the way he is because he always stuck with his original thoughts and no one could change his mind. He would get a idea in his head and think he is right and stick with it. My mom called it a mental illness but I read online it's black and white thinking and I always want to throw something at my computer screen when someone says they don't see what is so bad about it or claim it's a good thing. They're so delusional. I don't see what my ex did was a good thing and black and white thinking is everywhere and I don't see how it's all good. How is it good to be judgmental and expecting everyone to be like you and be all self righteous? How is it good to be a bigot? I see people being black and white about mental illnesses and how is that even a good thing? I don't see what any of what my ex boyfriends did was a good thing so I want to scream at anyone who says "what's wrong with black and white thinking" or "don't see anything wrong with it."

OMG, Cubedemon, I just checked out that thread. Those women are horrible!! That site is full of anger and hate and ignorance. If you keep visiting it, it will just upset you without changing them at all. Don't put yourself through that. Never cast pearls before swine (proverbial pearls, not-so-proverbial swine).

CubeDemon,

Those people are ridiculous. They rant and rant and just make themselves look worse to anyone not in their own microcosm of hate and bigotry. I don't know what her irrelevant anecdote about her dragging her husband somewhere he did not want to be, exposing him to unwanted attention, and then becoming envious of said attention is intended to prove. To me, it makes her look inconsiderate and self-centered. Why would a person think that story makes her look good? (rhetorical) No wonder they are divorced. He must be so relieved. The people on that site play the martyr/victim card and then claim that is what aspies do.

Her non-sequitur about Noam Chomsky is no doubt political. I think that was the same person complaining about her son turned into a liberal (oh noes!! !! ! -- sarcasm) and blamed her AS ex for that, too, and then estranged herself from her son.

It is good for you to stop interacting with them. They are not capable of a rational conversation. As Yippy-Skippy said they are just there to get validation that their relationship failures are not their fault and cheer each other on. No point in arguing with an unarmed (in this case, unintelligent) opponent.

I don't care if they think we are mocking them or not. They are the ones posting things from Wrong Planet on their site mocking aspies. Their whole thread started b/c someone on there thought it would be funny to mock someone here who was wanting help with dating and relationships. Empathy...yeah ... I think not.

I don't think it makes them not nice if they are wanting to leave their AS partner. If it's not working out, if their partners are really that way they claim they are, why stay? I didn't stay with my ex's and didn't make excuses for them for me to stay and justify it. No one should be abused and have to put up with it. Also I am not even sure if they all have AS. I also shouldn't have stayed with my ex and kept on being used as a meal ticket and getting all depressed and it was affecting me at work and my mental health and he didn't wan to help himself and always had excuses.

No one should have to stay with someone because of their illness or disability. If they're not good people, you're not obligated to stay and mental illness or disability isn't a commitment to stay with them no matter what and "too bad so sad." Also if you don't have things in common and are not compatible, you also are better off separated. That goes for everyone, NT, any neurological condition, and mental illness.

I don't think it's a problem when people bash their ex's or partners, it's a problem if they are bashing AS. I think it's BS to say someone is bashing AS if all they are doing is bashing the person who happened to have it and they are talking about their behavior and what they did. But yet it's acceptable to bash a person if they happen to have BPD or any other personality disorders or psychopathy and no one takes offense to that, especially if someone wants to leave their partner with it, but yet if someone dares to bash a person who happens to have autism or wants to leave someone who has it, people look down on them. So that is why I never mention what problems my ex's had when I talk about them. If people just assume they were normal, I am not a monster. I just think their disability is not relevant.


Also look on the bright side, if their partners are really not jerks and it's just their NT's warped perception of them, their partner is better off without them. Would you want to be married to someone like them on there? Sometimes I find their attitudes scary and can't imagine being married to someone like them. Especially someone of them who have kids with it, I wonder how they feel about them and if they also resent them or are hateful.


Oh I am also noticing another irony thing about them, they want people to see things their way and agree with them or else they see you as a bad person if you have a different view than they do. Another example of black and white thinking and they're doing that. And why is this a good thing?

I think the problem that you'll run into talking to most NT people is that the reasons for many of these unstated rules are not examined by most people. We know them by intuition and often follow them blindly. We only notice the rules when someone violates them, and usually just enough to judge the person, not enough to examine the rule.

You want to have philosophical, intellectual and rational discussions with people who often are not interested in thinking on those levels, especially regarding the topics you are interested in. This doesn't mean all NT people are like this, but many are, in many situations.

I myself go back and forth depending on my mood...sometimes I'm happy to engage on that sort of level and find it fascinating. Other times, it can feel exhausting; I don't want to use my rational brain, just my intuition and autopilot. I do know people who are NT and love discussing philosophy, though. I'm thinking those are the types of people you should be trying to engage with some of this stuff. I'm glad you gave up on aspartners, but I hope you haven't given up on NTs. I'm thinking there must be some philosophy and sociology/social psychology discussion boards out there. Or grad /academics who would be fascinated by your perspective. You have a relatively unique ability to see society and culture without as much of that bias that intuition gives us NTs. And you explain it eloquently. I know this perspective has been a liability to you, but I know there are NT people out there who would value it highly, and be happy to have ongoing and mutually beneficial discussions on those topics. I hope you keep looking and find more people like that.

Yippy, I definitely should not have. It did upset me a bit and they changed not one bit. No rationality will work on them. I wasted my time with them when I could've been doing other productive things. I say let them stew in their own crap.