Extreme difficulty doing imaginitive , descriptive writing

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misswoofalot
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12 Jul 2009, 10:42 am

My 12 yr old has severe difficulty in this area. His school have helped a little , but he is falling behind so I got him a tutor ( £25 per hour!). Yet still he is having so many problems and cannot
even describe the most basic of things. For instance, his homework this week was to describe a family member. He chose my brother ( his uncle who is a musician and wears funny clothes, with long hair etc. When asked what he wears my son got upset and chucked his homework on the floor saying he couldn't think of what he wears, what he looks like, and he definitely can't describe what his personality is like. I'm at my wits end as I'm paying a tutor and end up doing the homework for him with fights all the time as he can never do it on his own. I understand it's not his fault but I just need to know how to help him without actually doing the work for him. He needs to pass his GCSE at at least a C level to be able to go on to do A levels and Uni, where he dearly wants to study maths and the sciences ( things he excels at!).

I'd be grateful for any advice, or if anyone has faced the same difficulties, how they dealt with them. Thanks.



Califather
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12 Jul 2009, 1:03 pm

Not sure my first comment posted...Am here in the US with not much knowledge of the demands placed upon your son but here in Cali we special ed teachers encourage kids to follow the writing process (pre-writing, drafting, editing/revising, publishing) when they write. Thinking Maps are a good way for kids to organize their thoughts. (Try thinkingmaps dot com for examples.) Instead of writing words you might have your son try to draw pictures--anything to get him started. If you can do it, break each assignment into manageable chunks. Use a timer, have him write fifteen minutes per sitting, or more if he can handle it. And of course writing on a computer would also help. Good Luck...



TheKingsRaven
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12 Jul 2009, 3:15 pm

I find personality a nightmare to describe but objects much easier; perhaps try describing an inanimate object to see if its easier for him.

If that dosn't work maybe as "training wheels" you can try giving him technical specs and working from those, turn a list of specs into a descriptive paragraph.



gbollard
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12 Jul 2009, 5:23 pm

Having to describe what someone wears isn't really being imaginative.

Instead, try two things;

1. Have your son invent something non existent and describe it - eg: a monster.
You might want to get him to draw it (and talk about what it looks like while he draws it).
This is the Imaginative side of things.

2. In terms of normal every day description, get him to sit near something he likes - eg: a star wars figure (if he's into that) and have him again "talk through" the description.

If none of these work, you can try an old computer programming thing - object properties.

Every object has properties, choose some objects and get your son to write down the properties of these objects - WHILE he can see them.

Sample Properties List
Color
Name (what is the object called)
Pattern
Shape
Smell
Sound
Taste
Text (any writing on it)
Texture (what does it feel like)

You could probably think of a lot more properties.
Once you've got the properties down, you can start arranging them into descriptive sentences.
It's slow but it will build up his confidence and he'll eventually be able to do them in his head.



misswoofalot
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13 Jul 2009, 4:06 am

gbollard wrote:
Having to describe what someone wears isn't really being imaginative.

Instead, try two things;

1. Have your son invent something non existent and describe it - eg: a monster.
You might want to get him to draw it (and talk about what it looks like while he draws it).
This is the Imaginative side of things........



Apologies for maybe not explaining properly... My son has difficulty making up and inventing anything! This is his problem. He is unable to lie or make up things that aren't real...so therefore we have reverted back to describing things that are real for sake of making up stories with 'real characters' . Yet because he cannot 'imagine' what something looks like without it being there ( he doesn't seem to have a 'minds eye', and cannot create a picture in his head of something ) he has serious difficulty doing anything that is descriptive, or imaginative.

His comprehension of things is fantastic, as is his reading age. When able to answer a direct unambiguous question about something, in one word or a sentence, he is fine, and excels.

However the OBJECT PROPERTIES is a fantastic idea!



jat
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13 Jul 2009, 11:39 am

Is his primary problem with describing these things, or with writing the things he needs to write? If the problem is with envisioning the thing he's describing, maybe you can provide him with a picture of his uncle, if that is who he's describing. If the problem is the writing, the properties suggestion may help get him started, using a computer can help, or he may need to use a program like Dragon Naturally Speaking to dictate to the computer. But it would be important to try and determine the reason for the difficulty with writing - is it a fine motor issue, a working memory issue, or something else? Identifying the underlying problem can help figure out how to address it.



DW_a_mom
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13 Jul 2009, 2:13 pm

Ugh, I just lost my first two paragraphs ...

First, I wonder if your son could have some version of face blindness. There are AS members here with that, and in that case, I believe, the person really can't "see" all the visual things he would be asked to describe about a person - he would know them by voice. I actually find it unlikely this is the issue, and the issue is probably simpler than that, but if he has that impairment, you will want to know, and it should be checked out.

Second, I understand from my son's teachers that descriptive writing (and many other forms) can be very, very difficult for Aspies. My son was in an advanced language arts class this year and everyone was worried about the expository writing and similar assignments. I got him through them, and I'll describe how, in the hopes that it might help for your child. I don't know if it will; it sounds like your son lacks the imagination of my son (some AS are very good with creative figures of their own imagining; others not), but it could still be worth a try.

The first thing I did was separate the process from the actual writing. Writing ANYTHING is so stressful for my son, that he needs to already know what he intends to write before beginning, or he simply gets overwhelmed. The first large assignment he had was to provide context and hidden meaning for a series of quotes from a book that had been assigned. He totally freaked out at the idea of even trying to do that. So we took a walk. In the dark, lol ... but we took a walk. And talked. First about all sorts of things, gradually I turned to the book (which I had read, too, knowing that he was going to need help). I asked innocent questions about what parts he liked, why he liked them, and so on, eventually steering into the parts of the book that were in the assignment. I never mentioned the assignment; we were just walking and chatting. But after about half an hour I turned to him and told him that he had just casually provided the answers for the first three quotes, and repeated back to him what we had discussed but in the format requested by the teacher. We walked back home and typed it up.

I suggest trying to break it up into the smallest, and least threatening, pieces possible. Couple it with rewards and de-stress breaks. Work in an environment he finds calming. Etc.

Finally, it would seem that some adaptation to the requirements may be necessary. I know from our IEP meetings and previous threads here that such writing requirements can be real roadblocks for AS kids. They are not exactly real life, deal with daily life, abilities; a person can get by in life without being able to write descriptively. So why shouldn't someone be able to graduate without it? Look into it; there may be ways around it. There SHOULD be ways around it.


_________________
Mom to an amazing young adult AS son, plus an also amazing non-AS daughter. Most likely part of the "Broader Autism Phenotype" (some traits).


misswoofalot
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14 Jul 2009, 2:40 am

jat wrote:
Is his primary problem with describing these things, or with writing the things he needs to write? If the problem is with envisioning the thing he's describing, maybe you can provide him with a picture of his uncle, if that is who he's describing. If the problem is the writing, the properties suggestion may help get him started, using a computer can help, or he may need to use a program like Dragon Naturally Speaking to dictate to the computer. But it would be important to try and determine the reason for the difficulty with writing - is it a fine motor issue, a working memory issue, or something else? Identifying the underlying problem can help figure out how to address it.


The primary problem is envisioning the things. Unfortunately, he does not have a 'mind's eye'. He also shows a real lack of imagination too. The secondary problem is the writing; organising and constructing paragraphs. Filling them out really. He can report on an experiment with ease, but when it comes to creative writing it's a massive issue.



misswoofalot
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14 Jul 2009, 2:54 am

DW_a_mom wrote:
Ugh, I just lost my first two paragraphs ...

First, I wonder if your son could have some version of face blindness. There are AS members here with that, and in that case, I believe, the person really can't "see" all the visual things he would be asked to describe about a person - he would know them by voice. I actually find it unlikely this is the issue, and the issue is probably simpler than that, but if he has that impairment, you will want to know, and it should be checked out.


I have face blindness and I have a great imagination, I just have difficulty recognising people from their face. I recognise them from where they live usually. However my son definitely doesn't have this, so I know this isn't the problem.

Quote:
Second, I understand from my son's teachers that descriptive writing (and many other forms) can be very, very difficult for Aspies. My son was in an advanced language arts class this year and everyone was worried about the expository writing and similar assignments. I got him through them, and I'll describe how, in the hopes that it might help for your child. I don't know if it will; it sounds like your son lacks the imagination of my son (some AS are very good with creative figures of their own imagining; others not), but it could still be worth a try.

The first thing I did was separate the process from the actual writing. Writing ANYTHING is so stressful for my son, that he needs to already know what he intends to write before beginning, or he simply gets overwhelmed. The first large assignment he had was to provide context and hidden meaning for a series of quotes from a book that had been assigned. He totally freaked out at the idea of even trying to do that. So we took a walk. In the dark, lol ... but we took a walk. And talked. First about all sorts of things, gradually I turned to the book (which I had read, too, knowing that he was going to need help). I asked innocent questions about what parts he liked, why he liked them, and so on, eventually steering into the parts of the book that were in the assignment. I never mentioned the assignment; we were just walking and chatting. But after about half an hour I turned to him and told him that he had just casually provided the answers for the first three quotes, and repeated back to him what we had discussed but in the format requested by the teacher. We walked back home and typed it up.

I suggest trying to break it up into the smallest, and least threatening, pieces possible. Couple it with rewards and de-stress breaks.

Finally, it would seem that some adaptation to the requirements may be necessary. I know from our IEP meetings and previous threads here that such writing requirements can be real roadblocks for AS kids. They are not exactly real life, deal with daily life, abilities; a person can get by in life without being able to write descriptively. So why shouldn't someone be able to graduate without it? Look into it; there may be ways around it. There SHOULD be ways around it.


Unfortunately, this writing is part of his GCSE, and unless they change the spec dramatically, he will not be passing at a C grade, even though he will do good in the reading and comprehension side of things. I will definitely look in to this though. Maybe I'll try to get him statemented too for some extra help, although I've been told this is near impossible.