How can I explain to my son, that his friend isn't really...

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How can I explain to my son that his friend isn't really a friend?

Now, before I go into that, I suppose I should give a little background on this kid, on the story in general.

This boy used to come to our house every so often, and I am absolutely convinced that something is up with him-no doubt about it. When he would come over, it was for one reason solely-to play my son's Nintendo DS. Which, Zack never really had a problem with, but I had some major problems with it for the simple fact he was using Zack.

I let people walk all over me when I was younger for the sake of keeping friends, and it's a really hard thing to teach to my son so that he won't do the same thing... in many ways, I still do it.

He would come over, play the DS, sit in one spot the entire time, completely zone in, and wouldn't stop playing it unless I nagged forever about it. Which, Zack does it too, so I was quite used to it, and it wasn't a huge deal at the time-annoying yes, but not a really big deal unless we had a lot of things to get done that night.

Last year (I think it was a year ago, at least... no sense of time here), the kid lied and said another child sexually assaulted him... The parents called the cops, didn't talk to the other party accused or the parents or anything, ripped him out of school (for like, 3 weeks and switched his school), and removed him from church (which really isn't super churchy, it's just a kids arts and crafts group for the most part it seems, while teaching respect of one another of course) all in the course of one day, all to find out it was a lie. They still deny it was a lie.

Now, of course I don't want to share this information with my son, as I'm pretty sure it would be a bit overwhelming and he would likely go around telling everyone about the incident (which many already know of course, but the kid accused still goes to his school so doesn't really need that brought up over and over again after that ordeal-the kid accused is really the one it all happened to).

So... recently the kid started coming over to my house again. I let him in ONE TIME, and that is all it took for me to just lose it and say he isn't allowed back in.

He kept trying to take Zack's DS games, begged to borrow them (like to the point where I was just saying "No" every time he asked and he continued arguing for 10 minutes after) the entire time... when it was time to eat dinner, I told him it was time for him to go home and he said "No-that's okay, I'm not hungry. You guys can eat and I'll just stay in here." I had to physically put his coat on him and shove him out the door because he would not leave. I actually have to block the door when I open it now so he won't just walk in.

Then I started thinking about that incident... and wondering if he would accuse Zack of the same thing if I made him mad enough by making him leave the house or telling him no all of the time about things. Paranoia, maybe... but it's still a lingering thought from time to time.

I've explained to Zack that I just don't have time to have to argue with a kid for hours about not being able to take our stuff with him, or the time to escort him physically out the door every time he comes in.

I have tried to explain to Zack that he doesn't even come over to play with him, but to get games from him basically and sit uninterrupted on the couch playing his own DS (he got it for Christmas).

Zack even said once, "well, if he comes over, we know he won't steal anything if he wants it bad enough, because we all hang out in different rooms so there would always be someone on guard." I asked him if that is how he should feel about his friends, and he said no...

Yet, every time the kid knocks on our door, Zack gets really upset when I tell him that he cannot come in to play. He's only partially grasping this concept and since he's even said it himself, I'm kind of at a loss as to what else I could tell him so he will realize this.

Any ideas? Suggestions?

My mom let my friends use me because she wanted me to be happy and have friends. She used to tell me to put some of my things away and not let my friends use it and only I can. She said they had their own and they don't need to be coming over and using mine.

Maybe you can share a story from your childhood that is similar and he'll see a similarity to the kid you're talking about.

Or you can just come out and say it.

Resolved venting

Last edited by anxiety25 on 24 Feb 2010, 4:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I always use my profile to find my thread if it's missing.

The major concern with this one, is the problems that he caused for that other child and the child's entire family. I still have no clue why he said it, but it ruined their lives and gave them a bad reputation around here (granted, they didn't have a great one anyway, lol), and the kid's family reacted just so... wow. I mean, that is all I can say about it-not even looking into the situation and all...

Now, that is an extreme situation, but how am I to know this kid won't do it again?

If it was simply him being used, that probably wouldn't be terrible as long as he's happy and the kid isn't just stealing his stuff or anything. But when it's taking up our family's time to get this kid to leave the house afterwards, haha, then it's a problem :S big problem.

I've flat out told him the kid isn't allowed over... so he knows this. But is still just having a really hard time grasping why, even knowing (most of) the problems I have with the kiddo.

Maybe I should just explain that he has said some really bad things about people before that started a lot of problems, and don't want it to happen to us?

I just really don't know what direction to go with it all.

As long as your son isn't being directly hurt by this child there is no good way to explain it. To him, it's a simple, "so what. Doesn't bother me." My son can be like that about certain things, and I'm left with a basic, "what I feel matters too and this is how I feel." Which is how I would approach it with your child: having this boy in your home makes YOU uncomfortable, and your son doesn't really need to know more than that, as he should be considerate about what you want as a member of the household. If he won't let it go and needs to hear more, you say that the other child has been known to tell hurtful lies, but that you don't want to go into any details because the lies should be left to rest.

Have you talked to the boy's parents about his coming over so often? Could they be SENDING him over because he seems bored, they need childcare, or ??? Do they have any idea what their child does when he comes over, ie show no interest in your child and just in his toys? Seems to me like there could be a missing piece somewhere in this. When you say it's time for the child to go home, it would seem that it is also time for the child's parents to WANT him home; it is rarely a one sided thing, in my experience. Once they know you don't feel it's a good idea for their son to keep coming over ("they aren't really friends" "he doesn't listen to me when I tell him it's a bad time to be here"). if they have any social manners at all, they will not allow their child to. Most parents want to know when things aren't going the way they would want them to with their child. If they don't, the problem may be more with the parents than the child, and getting your son on board about this child and the level of their friendship isn't going to be enough to solve the situation.

I'd say let him play with it so long as your son's happy, but the accusations are a bit worrying.

Maybe hide the DS for a few weeks and say it's away being fixed?

Or tell them to go play outside for a while.

Oh, he has his own now... now he comes over to beg for our games for it.

The parents... well everyone in that household is an alcoholic, and I'm pretty sure they send him to my house as a babysitter-or try to. I mean, he'll come over once, then a few hours later come knocking again. Which, is why I let him come over as long as I did-he was working my nerves before all of that stuff anyway. Kinda felt bad for the kid in a way, then realized, I REALLY don't want that around my house.

The father used to call and make sure everything was going okay and all, but the last time there was absolutely no communication... and even when he was in touch, it wasn't usually a "I need my son to come home type of thing", it was "keep him as long as you want". The kid literally had no schedule of any sort.

There were times before the incident and all, that the father would be sitting in my house, while I'm telling the kiddo it's time to get ready to go, and he would tell his son to get his stuff together, but didn't really make him do it. I mean, I'd be sitting there for an hour waiting for them to go home.

I seriously doubt they know what he's up to when he's out, or if he goes straight home after being told "no" here... he rides around on his bike at night and we have registered sex offenders on our street...

I'm actually rather surprised they allow him to go out alone after all of that happened, especially since they still believe him. *shrug*

I just know it's a really messed up house and I think I am a babysitter to them.... or was.

The kid's personality has changed a lot too, since all of this. He looks... angry... always angry. He's always ready to argue about something, has a defensive stance when talking to you. (My boyfriend noticed these things when he came over once)

...and I really don't want my son on board to solve this problem, but I just want him to understand WHY I don't think this kid is really good to be around in general. I tell the kid no regardless. I just want my son to be... more okay with it. Does that make sense?

I don't know if its possible to get your son to understand at this time - he'll get it years from now, but that's beside the point. For now, its about protecting him - not just from being used, but from being bullied and perhaps even publicly accused of a crime he didn't commit. Do whatever you have to do to prevent them from having contact of any kind. I will lay you dollars to donuts that neighbor kid will be in prison before he's twenty, and in the meantime if your son's anywhere near him, he'll only get sucked into whatever trouble is at hand.

I pity the child for the obvious neglect (at the very least) that he's subject to, not to mention that he's being given absolutely no guidance in how to behave like a civilized human being. But he already shows such blatant selfish disregard for others, you can bet he's going to spend his life walking all over anyone who'll let him, and going behind the backs of those who won't to get what he wants. And sadly, the angry posturing you're already seeing only indicates the likelihood of early and frequent substance abuse. Some people you can help and some you can't, but I strongly believe that most personalities are born half-formed and are shaped insofar as they will ever be by about age 6. If you haven't given a child enough love and lessons in respect by then, God help them.

Thank you all so far for your responses... so it just kind of seems, if I don't want the kid around, that's all there is to it and my son is just going to have to adjust to it.

I at least give him credit for acknowledging the fact that the kid isn't a true friend... there are going to be many more over time.

I've had to make him quit playing with quite a few other people because they were either stealing from him right in front of me then denying it, lying to me constantly, or hurting him.

I learned not to tell him a whole lot about things, because one day he was playing with our next door neighbors. Well, the neighbors went over to another kid's house and Zack followed them over. Before I could get over there to bring him back (trust me I'd been calling to him before I started to go over there-took me a minute to realize where they were going), he was telling the mom... well, kind of yelling it since he has absolutely no volume control, lol, "My mom says I'm not allowed to be anywhere near you because you're nothing but a big bully!! !" ... fine and dandy for him to stand up for himself and tell the kid and all, but the mom was outside with the kid, lol...

Now, I'm not a fan of being great friends with the neighbors, but I'm not exactly up for being enemies with them either. These people live only 2 doors down, lol. So I got to explain to the mom all the crap her son had done and everything... and got to explain to Zack why he can't go over to the neighbor's house to tell them he's not allowed to be there, lol.

You could sit down and have a talk with him, about what you think a real friend is. After you tell him your opinion, you can ask your son if he thinks that his friend is a real friend. I hope this helps.

I would not let my son be friends with that kid any longer. It sounds like the other kid is not really a friend to your son, so the interaction is pointless. Your son might be upset, but you are the parent and you are allowed to decide who comes into the house. Maybe try to find your son another friend.

This whole bad friend thing happens with NT children as well. I know this from other moms who have NT children that are my son's age. In some ways, I think their situation is worse because some NT children are so desperate to fit in that they will cling to "bad" friends. My son is at an age that if I explain to him how another person isn't treating him right, then he sees it..accepts it and doesnt give that person the time of day. When he was younger though, he didn't see it and would actually get upset with me when I tried to explain it.

Hmm it seems like your son must be low functioning.. I neer had a problem sorting fake friends as a kid.

The best way I guess is to keep the child away from your house. Talk to the parents and tell them that you will not tolerate their son coming near your house any more.

Hopefully that will give your son time to forget him for now.

[removed - M.] You did the right thing. Just keep telling Zack that he's a user and never let the dweeb come into contact with Zack again! If he doesn't learn it now then he could be abused for years. Its better to have no friends than friends that use you.

This way he'll find proper friends.