My daughter is saying disturbing things-what do I do?

Post Reply New Topic

It seems as soon as I get one behavior under control another one pops up. My daughter, 3 weeks ago, had a very peculiar incident. She was crying and very upset and was saying to me "I can't keep the secret any more". I encouraged her that she could tell me anything. It took a few hours but later that evening she told me a boy kissed her (she's 7) and told her to keep it a secret "or else". She couldn't tell me when it happened. But she very much insisted it did happen. After she told me she continued to cry and say "she couldn't keep the secret.". I was confused by this because she had told me. She expressed that she needed to tell everyone or else she was keeping the secret. I tried to explain she didn't need to tell everyone.

She has brought up the kissing and the "secret" several times since then but has not been crying about it as in the beginning, now she says she "can't get it out of her mind".

Shortly after this situation occurred she made the statement "I hate my life, I just want to be dead". While this alarmed me very much I did not react to it in the moment. Later that evening I discussed with her what "dead" means (which she already knew-she went through a death fixated phase when my grandmother died) and why we don't say things like that. She went on to complain that she thinks "bad" things and can't get them out of her head.

Since then, she has made the statement in various forms that she wishes she were dead (she also stated she wished everyone else was dead) for the past few weeks. I have made her an appt with a counselor but her previous encounters with counselors were not positive nor productive. They just can't "get" her. I am afraid if she says things like this at school or to the counselor they will take drastic actions.

BTW, I've taken care of the boy...he won't be near my daughter ever again.

Anyone have any suggestions for me? I am very concerned about this!

Do I have any suggestions? Not really; you've already mentioned looking into counseling and your concerns on why it might not be the answer.

I will tell you that my NT daughter was VERY much like that around that age, for several years, minus the kissing incident, and it concerned me greatly, but I never found a good answer, either. I never discounted her feelings, and I spent a lot of time asking questions and listening. I don't think, fortunately, that a child that age is serious about ending life, just feeling in the moment that not feeling and not thinking might be a good thing.

I do think that all those expressions from my daughter are a part of why I'm such a pushover for trying to keep her happy, and I'm not convinced that has been a good thing. But, I don't really have a solution for that; it's more of a warning to you that it's possible for us to forget a few of our own parenting basics in the face of hearing these things, and I would recommend preparing yourself NOT to do that. Once you start making extra allowances for a child, it's hard to go back, and by the time they reach my daughter's current age, they learn how to play it big time. Just ... be careful with that fine line.

Otherwise, love her and make sure she knows you love her. That's pretty much the most important thing we ever do.

Disclaimer: I am not a parent.

With that being said, even very young kids can develop OCD symptoms, which is what this sounds like (perhaps).



See how it goes with this counselor. IMO, you should be in the room with them while the session is going on so you don't find things out secondhand. I hope this one goes better.

I remember feeling like what she's saying (about myself, not others) as early as age 10, but I never made any attempts to hurt myself.

Both of you take care. Let us know how things go.

I hope that things get better, for you and your daughter.

My son starting saying he wanted to be dead when he was 8 yo. For him, it was absolute frustration because he had so many (undiagnosed) issues going on that he could not express and that were out of his control. He was later diagnosed with Mood Disorder NOS and PDD-NOS. She could be having a similar frustration, not being able to express it any other way.

Perhaps the boy did more than just kiss her, you might want to investigate that.

She could have OCD. This would be a typical thought process of an OCD mind.

She could be depressed.

Not to scare you - my brother also started obsessing over death at age 7. He was later, in his teen years diagnosed with depression and OCD (no ASD, although I suspect he had sensory issues). He did later kill himself at age 17.

The point is, whatever is going on with her, take it seriously. She is not happy, whatever the cause, and you need to help her.

FYI - the docs generally will not take drastic action unless the child had a plan to kill themself. If they just state 'I want to be dead' but don't have a plan such as 'I am going to kill myself with my shoe lace by hanging from the staircase', the docs will not consider her a harm to herself. Don't hesitate to talk to her doctor or councelor about it.

Could you elaborate on how this is associated with OCD? She does have other OCD stuff. She taps her dresser drawers, counts a lot, and pulls her hair. If this is related to OCD how do I address it? Meds? We have tried various meds (SSRI's) with side effects, etc.

That's the dynamic of OCD. Or, that is a dynamic that makes it worse. You try to push the thought out of your mind and it kind of gives the thought more power.

(I am not a parent. I did struggle with OCD as a teenager and later.)

Saying that she has bad thoughts she can't stop is the "obsessing" aspect (what many call "pure O"). The other stuff you just described could be either AS-related stims or compulsions.

Bring all of this up to the counselor. Meds in young children often create side effects and don't always work. You would need to speak with a specialist. I'm not sure what works best with OCD in kids.

for childhood onset OCD, you want to look at the possibility of PANDAS,

the antibodies to strep attack a specific part of the brain, somewhat similar to rhematic heart fever, MAYBE, this whole thing is controversial, some doctors do not believe in this as a possible cause

Can You Catch Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder?
LISA BELKIN, New York Times, Published: May 22, 2005.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/22/magaz ... gewanted=1

[the theory:]
page 2: ' . . . So the antibodies mistake the basal ganglia for strep and attack. This, of course, will not happen to every child who has strep throat, or even to most children, in the same way that every child who gets strep does not get rheumatic fever. "It's the wrong germ in the wrong child at the wrong time," says Swedo, who suspects that some children are genetically predisposed toward Pandas. . . '

[prophylactic antibiotic treatment]
page 4: ' . . . The O.C.D. went away. A year and a half later, Maury got strep throat again, and the O.C.D. symptoms returned. She is now taking prophylactic penicillin, an approach that is also controversial. ''It is not proven that it will help her, but it is likely that it will, so we are trying,'' Sehic says. . . '

[and considerable skepticism about the whole thing]
page 5: ' . . . Kurlan and his collaborator Edward L. Kaplan, an expert in strep at the University of Minnesota Medical School, have become Swedo's most vocal critics. They describe strep and O.C.D. as two things that are ''true, true and unrelated.'' Yes, it is true that some children develop rapid-onset O.C.D. And yes, it is true that a high percentage of those test positive for strep. But that does not mean that the former is caused by the latter. . . '

page 6: ' . . . While turning to antibiotics to cure their child's Pandas, parents might be ignoring other treatments that could alleviate what skeptics believe the child actually has -- plain old O.C.D. It may come on slowly or gradually, in the presence of strep or not; whatever the details, a child who cannot stop washing her hands needs to be treated with one of the many drugs and behavioral-therapy regimens that are successful in battling O.C.D., he says. . . '

Last edited by AardvarkGoodSwimmer on 16 Aug 2010, 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

As always, you want a doctor you can halfway talk with. And that's often easier said than done.

Try a medication, give it a couple of weeks, see if it works, feel and texture. And if it doesn't work, move sideways and try something else.

Who would I consult for a possible case of PANDAS? A pediatrician?

Her OCD behavior started after taking Zoloft for 4 months. We then weaned off the Zoloft. I read that Zoloft can cause OCD like side effect behavior so I weaned her off. The OCD like behavior has only been going on since April. But it seems to be getting worse.

She is very adamant that the bad thoughts are stuck in her head and she can't get rid of them. Anyone out there with experience with OCD know how I could help her with these thoughts? Is there some reasoning I could use?

can these antibiotics cross the blood brain barrier???? If not, even if the meds and condition are legit, the treatment is a waste of time and money. More and more evidence is showing that autism itself is likely caused by abnormal auto-immune activity in the brain and spinal cord (Johns Hopkins); however, many parents are wasting their time and likely causing side effects (stomach issues, etc.) by using NSAIDS and medications to suppress the immune system to treat Autism. Sadly, at present, the NSAIDS and immune blockers available usually can't cross the blood brain barrier and aren't targeted to treat the particular chemicals that they need to suppress and so they are ineffective against autoimmune conditions of the brain.

Last edited by matrixluver on 16 Aug 2010, 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I am not a big fan of counselors, straight up, in large part because they tend to be “be righters.” Once they’re made a decision that it’s bad communication in “transactional analysis” or the child rebelling (with some technical theoretical language) or whatever it is, by God, they stick with this decision. And it is a losing proposition to 'argue' or debate with the counselor at that point. You'd think as one adult to another the two of you could just take, but no, as part of this unhealthy dynamic, you really can't.

And what is lost of course is any kind of healthy ping-ponging back and forth, of trying something and seeing how it works, and of then trying a revised version etc, etc.

i'm not a parent, and i'm not wanting to say "hey, look at me", but i had a similar experience with a personal issue that i couldn't keep secret, i felt i had to tell everyone. it wasn't that someone had told me not to, just that i couldn't keep it a secret anymore.

I'd say a pediatrician would be a good start. Again, it's controversial, probably some are believers, some are not. I'd say (and I am not a doctor) that taking a longer than average course of antibiotics is not that big a deal and may be worth it.

Permission from those she loves not to be perfect. And if a bad thing happens to happen, we will shoulder the burden together.

And then kind of the zen approach to what some Buddhist meditators call the "monkey mind" or the "chattering monkey." Just let the thought be there, simply observe the thought in a nonjudgmental way, just let the thought float around and float out in it's own good time.

---------------------

And again, it's the whole phenomenon, "Don't think of a white horse," the very act of trying not to think about something.

And, very important, don't let OCD, even if it's bad, derail you from other positive activities.

Last edited by AardvarkGoodSwimmer on 16 Aug 2010, 6:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.