Aspergers v Very High Intelligence

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Hi everyone

I have a 5yr old daughter, whose behaviour has caused a lot of stress and confusion to me since she was born. After reading a ton of articles, I've recently come to the conclusion that she must have Aspergers. However, a mum outside school today mentioned that it was possible that she was just really intelligent. I mentioned her lack of friends and she said that she'd noticed my daughter has a huge personality and thinks perhaps the girls don't know how to take her 'joie de vivre', so shy away from her. The mum is being genuinely helpful, not dismissive of my concerns, and is trying to help me get to the bottom of things.

My daughter's development was very quick - she spoke in meaningful sentences at a year (not parrot fashion) and walked just like an adult soon after. She's always been a very physically active child and a bit of an athlete and good swimmer. We didn't need to show her how to hold a pencil and her writing and drawing are excellent. At her last development review, the health visitor was impressed, if a bit mystified. She also has a fantastic imagination, which is very different from average. I helped out at her school's science festival this week and had the pleasure of watching her entertain the class with her puppetry skills, out of the blue.

However, her behaviour has always been very difficult. She's always refused to take my hand outside, near roads. She won't leave a place when asked to - we're always last to leave anywhere. Until recently, I would have said she was hyperactive - she would be doing anything except what she was supposed to be doing. She often refuses to say 'hello' or 'thanks'. No behaviour management strategies have worked at all. She does have definite sensory issues, which contribute to her personality. Clothing has to be just right. She's very easily distracted and has trouble getting on with her work- which is the main issue at school. But, she can concentrate on what the teacher is saying, whilst everyone else is doing the same and she gets through her homework tasks very quickly, with very little help. There are a lot more issues and she seems to tick a lot of the boxes for Aspergers. But, could it be possible that she's so smart that she objects to being told what to do and the sensory issues (which I also have) are just coincidental?

I'm meeting again with her teachers in 2 weeks and I'm trying to figure out what's going on with her before we decide to go down the psychological assessment route.

Does anyone have any similar experiences?

It's often very hard to tell the difference between Asperger's and being gifted, especially since a lot of people who have Asperger's are indeed gifted. I have both AS and giftedness, and a lot of my behaviors as a young child overlapped between the two. One hallmark Asperger's symptom that you didn't mention your daughter having is an obsessive interest in a topic. Not to say that all Aspies have special interests, but it's very common. I started having special interests at 18 months of age, and had AS been known about when I was a child, it is most likely what would have diagnosed me right away.

Sounds like you are seeing some behaviors we've also seen. My son is very smart, but I wouldn't say he's "gifted." It's hard to say whether he would be considered "gifted" if he weren't struggling so hard with other issues, though. I was the same as a child, and still wonder as an adult where I would fit on that scale. I tend to dislike that term - my brother was saddled with it (he definitely fits) and it's been more of a handicap than a benefit.

I think the real key is - is your child happy and comfortable? (at least in general - all children have their days) If not, it really doesn't matter what box you put it in, you're right to look for strategies to help your child.

I suppose there are children with Aspergers who are happy and comfortable who may need intervention to function in the world for basic safety and ability to live independently, but I would guess that the majority of kids who have social and sensory differences are in some way distressed by them as children. School is hard on anyone, let alone those who don't meet the very narrow criterion of the "norm."

To me the critical issue in getting help for my son was that by the time he was seven or eight he was really, truly miserable, and I couldn't stand to see that. Yes, we had other pressing issues, but that one was my main concern.

From what you've described it's a tough call. Some of the common markers are missing but that doesn't necessarily rule out Asperger's. Aspies come in a wide variety of flavors. Try and keep a journal of the things you notice or have concerns about. Share that in any evaluations you may persue.

I personally would opt for going through with the evaluation. The quality of professionals involved in the evaluation process varies from place to place but I think it is worth it to have that professional opinion. While the tests and analyses they perform have many subjective qualities, there are a set of charactieristics that the testers are trained to look for. If she does fall into the Asperger's diagnosis or any other part of the spectrum, it is good to know as it is likely that school may become more difficult in years to come due to the social differences. Knowing if she is on hte spectrum or not would give you some clues about how to modify her environment to halp her cope. If it turns out that the evaluation process reveals that she isn't on the spectrum then you have that information and can act on it in whatever way seems best. I think Moms (or Mums, I should say) know when we see something different with our kids. Trust your instinct and try not to second guess yourself. When the people at my son's pre-school told me that his behavior could no longer be chalked up to difficulty transitioning to the school environment, I listened. We pursued the autism evaluation soon after that realization.

From what I've read here it can be a difficult process dealing with the school. We've been lucky with the pre-school we are at but that, I know, is just the tip of the iceberg. Others here have talked about good experiences with schools and there have been threads dealing directly with the assertiveness issues which you may want to look for. Much good info and much support to be found here so welcome to WP!

Asperger's in girls is somewhat different, I'm sure you have read about it before, but from your post only I am pretty sure we have a case of "aspergirl" here

The lines can be very blurry. If things you find on this website make life better for you and your child then it doesn't matter if she actually is AS, you use those strategies. And so on. Stay focused on the goal, which is parenting your child in the way that works for her. The school, you will find, won't be interested in labels if there are no problems that affect them.

Normal five year olds do go through phases of anxiety about school, or having social issues (especially girls) so do be aware of that. My NT daughter has always been the moody one there, and little girls can be quite mean.

My AS son has a group of friends that is a mix of smart yet quirky kids and AS. The other kids all get moody and apparently have posed some pretty big challenges to their parents , and my son likes to speculate if they are AS like him but, when you look at it hard, there are differences, one being that those other kids don't seem to have the areas of glaring impairment that my son does. They may struggle with organization like most boys do, but it isn't going to put them at risk academically. And they do have social abilities, and strategy abilities my son does not. And so on. But it's impossible to know.

Thanks to everyone for your great replies. Tomorrow, I'm going to make an appointment to speak to the head teacher, as she's the one who can progress assessments. I don't think she knows my daughter very well, so I can't imagine she'll be dismissive of my concerns, like the depute head was.

My daughter stayed with my parents overnight Saturday. When we went to collect her at noon on Sunday, she was still wearing her pyjamas. My mum couldn't get her dressed as the order in which she was doing things was at odds with what my daughter usually does. So I decided the time was right to speak to my parents about our concerns - we've never done this before. To my surprise, they didn't say 'Don't be silly, she'll grow out of it'. They agreed with me about how different she is and how difficult it is to deal with some of her behaviour. They're focusing on the plus side that she is very intelligent and a truly unique individual, who is likely to make her mark on the world.

It's good to have support on here and from my parents. I just hope the education system is as helpful.

Thanks again everyone.

It sounds like she DOES have AS. My life at her age was VERY similar. I was very smart, did well in school, and EVEN made some puppets! OK, they were really marionettes. I spoke in regular sentences even earlier than your daughter, and apparently walked ok as well. My writing has generally been clean and easy to read. I had the same clothing and sensory issues. In the 3rd grade, I did a drawing and painted it and, although there was an error with it I didn'[t like, because someone bumped some paint, I STILL won first prize in a county wide contest. I have EVEN gone as much as 24 hours without getting dressed. BTW I DID sound arrogant, and some would think I wasn't behaved, etc....

At the time, I was actually strong for my age, though I wasn't into exercise. I also wasn't taught to swim in a regular way until a bit after that.

I would say try to keep her interested and get her GOOD teachers, if you can. THAT would have helped me.