Why can't our son make friends?

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Our son is seventeen. Assuming nothing unusual he is in his second last year of school. My current best guess at his diagnosis is ADD-inattention with a dash of PDD-NOS. (He was initially diagnosed ADD inattention and latterly HFA, but I think the latter is more of a mis-diagnosis).

He was a very pleasant, easy going child and is still quite pleasant (for a teenager). He showed some empathy when very little eg I recall him very sweetly pulling his mom and dad together when we were fighting. He loves his dog. He got on quite well with and had friends at junior school.

But now at seventeen he does not really appear to have any friends. He has been invited out once to a small party in the past three years. He has never invited a friend back to our house nor gone to town with a friend or friends in that time. From talking to his teachers he seems to get on with some of the "naughtier" kids in classes who sit together. From going to teacher-student course meetings it does not seem as if he talks to any of the kids (although this may not be representative of his general school experience).

I think he does have some contact over the internet with various people, but do not know how far that goes; certainly not far enough for anyone to invite him out or for him to feel comfortable inviting them out.

I do not feel he is very upset by this lack of social contact, but he has always said when the matter has been discussed that he would like to have friends.

Just wonder why he can't have at least one good friend. When I was very young I was shifted around about five schools in my first five years, and, as an introverted child, I absolutely hated it. But from my recollection I always had at least one good friend in each school. And I was quite popular at his age (eg twice voted class captain from recollection in the last year of school). His mother is generally underlyingly a sociable person.

But our son does not seem to have any real friends at all.

I am thinking one of the main reasons is some cognitive problems. His brain just does not process information properly, whether social information or other information. He does seem to understand sarcasm and irony and humour, but I don't think very well. His best friend at junior school was the son of a doctor and intellectually able. I think that boy just outgrew our son as they moved into middle school. I am guessing he just does not really properly understand the give and take of the boys conversations.

A second problem is that his interests are limited. He does not seem interested or able to play some of the games that other boys seem to be playing (eg black ops). When he was in junior school his best friend at the time was also very interested in film (apparently then wanted to be an actor). So that fitted in with our son's obsession with film (which did not proceed in due course when he was unable to deal with the logistical difficulties of shooting a film eg basic stuff like ensuring that the camera's batteries were charged in advance). Our son really does not seem very interested in anything outside his limited range of interests. He will watch a film again and again, which I'm sure a friend will not be interested in doing. It is hard for that reason to get him involved in academic work and, although he seems to have a degree of empathy, he does not presumably participate in some of the activities his peers are engaged in.

A third problem is possibly in his reactions, which are a little flat. On thinking about this I think he does not ever nod his head in agreement, or shrug his shoulders. He does make eye contact, and does not "act strange" (although sometimes he does look a bit like a fish out of water), but there isn't really any vivacity in his actions.

While we are not concentrating on the social side of things at the moment, but rather the urgent issue of trying to get his academic work up to scratch, and he does not seem particularly upset with no friends being around, it still does seem sad that he does not at least have one real confidant or friend.

I'm 23 and have never had any friends (Aspie female), and am puzzled as to how one gets them. I figure I'm a lost cause, so I have no advice.

I wish you the best, though.

how to make friends... hard one.

i do have a few friends, but i cannot tell you how i made them, other then 'common ground'.
the best advice i have is to enroll your son in some out-of-school activity matching his interests.
doing this will get him in direct contact with other people sharing him interests/obsessions, which is a strong requirement for making friends.

Speaking as a parent I can say that I used to worry about this all of the time. I was always trying to figure out how my daughter might get more friends. I eventually realised a few things:

i) it bothered me much more than it bothered her. Yes she would have liked a few friends but she didn't think/worry about it anywhere as near as much as I did.

ii) my efforts to 'help' were actually counter-productive. She told me years later that she hated it when I 'tried to help' - in her words - she didn't worry about it until I kept bringing it up.

iii) You can't force it. It will happen if/when it happens. Usually through a common interest.

My daughter does now have have a few friends - not many - but she is happy with those that she has.

You are stating possible causes for your son's lack of friendships, have you considered mentioning them to him?. I had a hard time understandings that relationships are based on a give and take and it took me a while to get things right, even after it was pointed out to me what was I doing wrong(still struggling with the subject at the moment but I made some improvements after things were pointed out to me).


As for not hanging out with anyone from school, I dont hang out with people from my classes, Ive made friendships with some of them but even though Im invited to some social events most of the times I dont feel like going(barely know anyone, they are older than me so Im allways worried about being consider a child when they introduce me to a friend of them...). This doesnt imply that I dont have friends there, it just means that most of the times Im not comfortable seeing them outside classes.

I dont think that theres an issue with him sitting with the naughtier kids unless he begins to look for trouble... I felt more connected to the kids that had some sort of academic trouble and most of my friends at school had repeated the previous year(felt like an outcast and they were considered outcasts so in my mind it made sense). I didnt have any academic trouble and this friends helped me getting some sort of social status on the class.

@ValentineWiggin - sorry to read that; hopefully you can make some friends on WrongPlanet

@izzeme - yes, I have thought of getting him involved in a group which was engaged in a shared endeavour he likes; I think that would make the interaction easier as there would be more doing and less smalltalk. However finding such an activity is easier said than done, although sometimes they have groups making short films, which is one of his interests.

@AspergerFiction - as an introvert myself, I do understand how someone can be perfectly happy with few friends (and that schizoid personalities may even be happy with none); however our son has always said he did want friends when asked, but does not seem to have even one real friend.

@spongy - thanks for your comments. Maybe, although real communication is difficult with him, I should talk with him. He does not seem to grasp some things that a NT person like myself just takes for granted. (We are not incidentally worried about him sitting with the "naughtier" boys, as his academics are shot anyway and these are only slightly naughty boys)

At the time my daughter said the same (she did want friends) - it was only years later that she told me she wished that I hadn't kept trying to help.

I hope you have more success than I did.

As a parent, I am in your EXACT situation. My son is a little younger (15 years) but your description of your son sounds exactly like my son. Also, my feelings about the situation exactly mirror yours.

I am really aware of the fact that I may be a lot more concerned with his lack of friendships than my son is, but I guess what I'm really concerned about is this: we only have a few years left with my son at home, and I feel like time is running out to teach the concepts of how to make friends. I have a mental picture of my very kind, funny, sweet son living out the rest of his days without any friends at all. I can easily say that he has never had one good friend -- and he's a nice, likeable kid who does fairly well at socializing. He just doesn't have the inclination to invite anybody over, and he doesn't have the ability to reciprocate his behavior appropriately with others. Any friends that have come over have been invited by me, and my son is at an age where that type of arranged "play date" can't happen any more.

I have tried a variety of things to try and figure out something my son could be involved in that would help him share interests with other people -- theatre groups, church groups, various sports (back when he was younger), and my latest endeavor has been to get him to learn how to play the guitar. He just lacks an interest in ANYTHING other than his iTouch games or Xbox games. He actually doesn't see a problem with playing those for the rest of his life (well, he does understand that other people think it's a problem, and therefore he gets the concept that he SHOULD think it's a problem -- but hey, he's only 15). Right now we are very active in our church, and that provides the bare minimum of social life necessary for him to learn some skills.

I just wish he could experience the give and take of ONE FRIEND. I don't expect that he should have a group of friends, or that he should be popular or typical for a kid his age. I'm almost at the point where I would welcome him being accepted into the group of "naughty kids" -- which, by the way, he does seem to gravitate towards currently in high school, because they are a lot more accepting for our kids than the popular, athletic, or brainy kids. Like your son, even though he doesn't seem to do anything about socializing, I do think that he wishes to a small degree that he could have a friend. I just think he should be able to do something other than always hanging out with his elderly, boring parents...

My current concern is that my son is on stimulants, and although they help radically for homework and school, they seem to stunt his personality. We had him off the stimulants for a few days this summer, and he is SO DIFFERENT -- so much more personable, happy, and outgoing. He is also impulsive and says really inappropriate things. So I guess there is no perfect situation. Sure wish there was -- because I MUCH prefer the non-medicated son to the medicated son. BUT, the highly impulsive non-medicated son will have just as many social problems as the medicated, quiet, under-socializing son.

>>theatre groups, church groups, various sports (back when he was younger), and my latest endeavor has been to get him to learn how to play the guitar.

Sounds so very familiar. We did the theatre, sport and guitar too. My daughter enjoyed them all to a greater or lesser extent - but no friendships came out of it.

It's possible that you're worrying too much.

I'm 17 years old and although at school I used to sit with the "cool" kids, I never made any real friends, or at least not somebody I'd ask over or talk to after school. I haven't talked to any of them since I left high school (at 16 years old - high school was very boring to me), but I don't really care about not seeing the people I used to be with every day, and I certainly don't feel any 'loneliness' at all. I'm not sure if that's the case with your son but parents tend to overreact, maybe he's just fine with being alone and watching the same movies all over again?

To all who posted, sounds pretty much like my son too. And I have spent many, many hours pondering it and pretty much getting nowhere. When he was younger, my son (now age 20) did have friends. And he enjoyed being with his friends. However he was not at all good at initiating contact with his friends. I engineered many 'play dates' for him and he enjoyed them.

I also recall when he was very young, taking him to the play ground and he came over to me and said, 'they are not playing with me'. I tried to explain how he can just hang out with the group and blend in, or yell 'throw me the ball'. or whatever. I really did not know how to explain it to him very well. Sometimes you just have to ask, "Can I play too?" and deal with the rejection if they are mean enough to say no. I certainly recall from when I was a kid, growing up in a neighborhood of kids, the expression "gates closed", meaning no you can't jump rope with us, play tag, or join in. I digress.

As he got older, he became more isolated. We had him in Little League, Soccer and Boy Scouts. He did not like sports so when the arguments over going to practice escalated, I said fine, no more sports. He left Scouts after getting his "Arrow of Light", what you get before you move up to Scouts from Cub Scouts. I wish he had stayed in scouts, he enjoyed the hikes but the camping, not so much, a serious drawback in scouting....

He had friends in middle school and he had friends in HS but he never invited them over without me or his Dad saying, call someone up and invite them over. When he had a physical sometime in middle school, the doctor asked him some questions and my son said he was 10% lonely.

He would have friends who would walk to the Mall (possible where we live) stop by our house to ask him to go with them and he always said no. In retrospect, I get that now, Malls, loud, too much noise, and confusion. At the time I could not understand why he would not want to go hang out at the mall with his pals and check the cute girls out, eat junk food and talk trash.

Now, here comes my 'theory' as to where my son seriously went off the tracks socially and some of you may not want to hear or read this. Sorry in advance but I sincerely believe my son would be much more social today, never a social butterfly, never comfortable asking friends over, but in his own way much more social, if there was no internet or electronic games.

He would have been one of those kids who liked reading Popular Mechanics, playing chess at school, starting a collection of who knows what and finding other people who like to do the same thing, he would never have been a jock, he never would have been class president but he would have found his place and his peers. Some may say, in your dreams Mom, but that is what I think.

Technology, the double edged sword. And no I do not have an answer for this issue. I wish I did. And I have the same fears that as he gets older, he will never have friends IRL (In Real Life) and remain isolated and lonely. And yes I think he is lonely and would like friends again but for the moment he has given up and it is just him and his computer.

For those of you with younger kids, if you can find a private school where there is a ban on all electronic devices, off the electronic grid, send them there. Such a place does not exist as far as I know but it might enable your HFA kids to become more social.

P.S. I get the irony of me posting this on the internet. Roflmao.

Just to get back to this, much of what you described sounds like Asperger's, and I'm curious why you don't think it's HFA or why you don't think his PDD-NOS is his dominant dx. The attention thing may be ADD or may just be that he doesn't attend to / avoids non-preferred activities.

I found it much easier to deal with my child's reactions when I knew that her difficulties making friends were very much a part of her and stopped trying to push her to talk to people, invite them over, etc. She used to want to have friends over constantly, but now she is happy with her online contacts. I figure the social distance is about right for her; she can talk about what she wants. Being with friends is hard work for her, so we limit it to the times she really wants to do it.

She's much younger, though, so I can definitely see why you would be worried about how your son will manage when he is on her own. Then again, if he goes to college he might meet more people who share his interests.

J.

Duh, I forgot.

There is now a mountain of websites and advice givers on teaching ASD people social skills....if your son is interested, and willing to work it, it might help him a lot.

My favorite is:

[url=//http://www.socialthinking.com/]Social Thinking[/url]

Michelle Garcia Winner has a very practical approach to teaching ASD kids and adults. She has worked with adults in their 40s example a man with a doctorate from Harvard, to learn how to improve their social skills. She breaks it out bit by bit. How to approach a group, how to leave a group. How to stand in a group.

How to think with your eyes, perspective taking, etc. Things that a lot of ASD people do not know instinctively how to do. She feels that the 'just do it' approach doesn't work because some people literally do not know how.

She does not lump everyone into one group and knows some kids will not even work in a group.

My son has refused to meet with her. As in I don't care, meaning this will make me feel even more incompetent, perhaps? I truly hope some day he will be willing to meet with her. And she approaches her clients as, 'you are going to learn how to do something', it is not at all about, 'how does that make you feel', like traditional insight therapy.

And yes, I read an article in my newspaper about her and then found her on the dratted internet. Joking....

Her website is terrific and she offers tons of information, also has written books on the topic etc.

I think the problem here is a lack of understanding the difference between want and crave.

For example, I want chocolate chip cookies. They are tasty, and I like eating them. But I do not crave chocolate chip cookies. I am not sitting here and thinking, "O woe is me. I have no chocolate chip cookies. Why can't I have any! " Infact, aside from this post, I don't really think about it. I know that if I really craved the cookies, I could go to the store and pick some up. But that seems like more effort then it is worth because while I may like the cookies, I don't crave them.

Likewise, I like having friends. I generally get together with them 3-4 times a month and play D+D. But I don't have a deep needful craving. If D+D gets canceled I just say, "meh, O well, next week" I have moved twice, and on both occasions it took me about 3 months to settle in before I went out looking for a D+D group. During those 3 months, I didn't have any in person friends, and it didn't really bother me. I just saw it as, "Yeah, I will find a group and play D+D eventually, but I haven't gotten around to it yet. It will be nice when it happens, but it isn't a pressing concern".

Likewise, after I moved and lost contact with everybody I knew, it really didn't bother me. I didn't have any desire to call them up and talk, or see how they were doing, or maintain a relationship because I really wasn't that attached to them. I just don't get addicted to other people like that.

So that being said, do I have some friends now? Yes, but they are not close friends or 'good' friends. Do I like having them? Yes, I get to hang out and enjoy spending time with them occasionally. Would I be terribly distraught and sad if I didn't have these friends? No, not really.

I know this may be hard to understand for socially addicted people, but there are some of us who just aren't that addicted to other people. We may like friends, but we do not crave them. Friends are nice when they come along, but we are not lonely and despondent without them. And I am willing to bet your son is the same way.

As far as being social, I highly recommend online gaming, particularly MMOs. Some people, such as the poster above me, may not view the relationships in those games as acceptable. But I can tell you that the friends I formed in those games often meant far more to me then the people I spent my day with. The games give you a chance to be social, and make friends, and enjoy activities, and talk, and most importantly, not be judged.

Real life is full of judgmental people who are mostly interested in maintaining the social hierarchy and puffing themselves up at others expense. In online games, you just go there to have fun. There is no need to 'act cool' or 'blend in' or look the right way, dress the right way, play sports well, etc. You are just accepted as a fellow player and treated with respect. That is something I am seldom able to find in 'real life' relationships.

You can say what you will about electronics making people 'less social'. But if 'less social' means you spend less time in uncomfortable surroundings, trying to pretend to be somebody you aren't for the approval of people who don't care about you, and spend more time talking to and enjoying the company of people who respect you for who you are online, then I am all for that. You don't have close connections with people 'In Real Life' in order to have real friends. In my experience, the opposite is true.

Tracker you are not in the same category here. If I have your background story correct, you finished college and now have a job. You also wrote on a different post that you made college your priority, gaming second.

Here we have parents of children who are floundering in the world, not doing well in school, and may not even go to college or went to college and quit.

Just saying.

I think you have it all worked out and it works wonderfully for you and that is terrific.

However those of us parents who have children/young adults who are not doing so well, who cannot use the internet or gaming in moderation, and cannot manage college due to social issues, are in a very different place.

I feel what I feel and know what I know about my son. If he had gotten through college with a 3.5 GPA, and gamed 35 hours a week at the same time, and got employment in his field after he graduated, I would have no quarrel with him and the internet. But sadly that is not the case for him at this time.

Thank you, PaintingDiva, for writing a bunch of us "out of the same category" based on a superficial understanding of our lives.

This is offensive, and it's crap.

It also doesn't take into account the variable ways in which we might be affected by our impairments. I graduated college--a very good one--with a 3.8+ GPA and am in graduate school now. And guess what. I still have significant problems related to being on the spectrum!

I don't think there should be shame in not going to college. While it's prescribed in our culture, it's not for everyone, and that's fine. But I do object to the notion that autistic kids should be kept from going to college because of social issues, or anything else that does not directly relate to academic abilities. If my parents had done that I would have ended up bored senseless with my life and without a college education.