Knowing doesn't really help to fill the hole...

Post Reply New Topic

Hello all,

I found this forum by chance because I believe that my partner has undiagnosed Aspergers. Having read as much as I have, I feel 100% confident that he does, and it totally explains the odd behavior, the anger he sometimes shows, the lack of physical affection, the lack of eye contact, to name a few of the traits he exhibits.

I then began wondering if one or both of my parents also might have it. There was something very 'wrong' about out household that's for sure, though I never knew what it was, until I began researching personality disorders, and had a kind of 'ahaa' moment. Not that it helps much with how I feel. Perhaps I have confidence issues, or low self-esteem? Maybe I have something wrong with me too, which might explain why I've always never really felt comfortable with being 'me'.

My Dad was a complete authoritarian, it was always about standing straight, eating right, talking correctly. He never involved himself in any activities, especially with my brothers (never watched them play a soccer game, or anything like that). His tool box was always meticulous and he would hate for even ONE thing to be out of place in the house. He would often tell me not to be silly (at any idea I ever had) and got mad at me cause I couldn't do things, such as math.

Mom, similarly, was a control freak, often saying that I wouldn't amount to anything, wouldn't have friends, etc, because I was moody, miserable, and completely shy. She bought me everything I ever wanted though, so I had lots of STUFF, I just never felt that it was enough, and as soon as I had one thing, I wanted something else. I wanted to be liked. I wanted to be like the other girls (I was maybe jealous of them being popular, or good at dancing). But more than anything I wanted a mom like they had... someone who was their friend, not like mine, who wasn't. I rejected all of her attempts at 'affection' because it didn't feel like that. It felt like I was being smothered and it made me recoil.

My mom patched up my school uniform with horrible leather patches. My mom wouldn't let me wear my hair down, just in case I caught nits. I was the only kid who wasn't allowed out to play in case I got murdered or abducted. All I wanted to do was leave, live abroad, escape. (I was pretty shocked to read that that is a common trait among Aspie parented children!)

Mom didn't mean to be nasty, but her defense was/is always to attack first. She spends her life looking out from behind her net curtains, jealous of the neighbors, especially if I was chatting to them as a kid, and not letting my dad talk to them. She's petty and illiterate, and filled with shame and resentment. And when I hear her on the phone even now talking to my Dad like that, I recoil.

Mom was social outside of the house. Dad was reclusive and would happily sing and whistle to himself all day, pottering around the house. I still don't know what an official diagnosis would be for them, though I'm pretty sure my Dad is Aspie, I'm not sure about my mom.

And, then there's me.

What or who am I...?

It's a question I have often pondered, because I spend far too much time in my own head, retreating into thought when things get tough or when there's a difficult decision to be made. When I'm tired I close down.

I had depression early on in life and beat it. Since then the hardest emotion I've suffered with has been loneliness.

But, here's the thing... the older I get the more these 'negative' traits seem to take precedence. I am much more of a loner now than I ever was. I don't care if I don't see anyone for days. And actually have few friends. (When I was younger I hated being alone). I still can't do maths, and am hopeless with directions. But, I have travelled the world and looked after myself financially.

I am no longer shy, and feel that I get on with people very well, mostly, as long as they are in no way confronting, intimidating, or angry. But, I don't draw any attention to myself at all, and mostly try to stay small and out of the way. I can't do crowds and noises bug me (a blaring TV for example). I am excessively neat and tidy, and everything has a place. I don't wear make up anymore (I used to). But I 'do' eye contact and have, I think, fairly rounded emotions. Perhaps I don't 'feel' as much as some people, and I beat myself up all the time because I'm not the life and soul of the party, but I can empathise with others... I think... But then there's the deep seated, overwhelming sense of shame. Inadequacy. Failure...

Do any other 'children' of Aspies feel a bit lost as adults? Do you have an overwhelming feeling of lonliness? Despair sometimes, or have you ever had depression? Are you shy, or do you sufferer from confidence issues? Have you unconsciously sought out an Aspie partner? I was just wondering what others have experienced. There's one thing for sure... knowing or 'finding out' hasn't really bought me any consolation and doesn't make me feel any 'better' about myself. Does it ever sort of stop hurting? I don't know if I'm angry at myself or at them, feeling like I've never been listened to... never allowed to be 'myself' because I wasn't eating right, talking right, standing straight... or if I have so internalized my anger (for fear of my mom's reaction) that I no longer know what it feels like to be angry. Hell, I don't even think I properly know what LOVE feels like.

Is there any chance your parents grew up in alcoholic households? Sorry to be blunt like that but what you describe could also be explained by them being the adult children of alcoholics. You don't have to drink to exhibit all the symptoms of or be effected by alcoholism. Just a thought, your description also sounds like possible Asperger's, especially in your Dad. If you haven't sought out therapy, I would strongly encourage you to do so.

When I read your description it sounded a lot like Borderline Personality Disorder for your Mom, or it might just be anxiety or any number of other things. Your Dad does sound Aspie, but maybe he was just shy, unhappy, and not good at engaging with his kids, or reacting to your mom by withdrawing? Impossible to tell for sure from your description, and I'm not a psychologist.

I think that self diagnosing, and particularly trying to amateur-diagnose family or friends can be a really slippery slope. Most of the time you just don't have enough distance and perspective to be unbiased enough to come to accurate conclusions. I wouldn't waste your energy trying to do this. Find a counsellor you like and trust, and see what they have to say.

On the other hand, if identifying with a certain diagnosis becomes a useful tool in becoming happier, more stable, empowered etc. then cool. I have found so much to relate to in the Aspergers literature and community for myself since my sons were dxed. I identify as Aspie or at least a person with many, many traits if not currently diagnose-able, and this has helped me to understand, accept myself and make positive changes in many areas. I have no plans on seeking a diagnosis, because it doesn't matter to me, and a formal dx would not be a useful tool, and might even be a hindrance, but knowing that I'm likely Aspie has helped in every way.

This does not sound like the case for you. You sound confused and miserable, and not at all sure if ASD is a good fit for you or your parent(s). In this case, I would talk to a professional, and not create even more confusion trying to figure it out yourself.

And specifically "Do you have an overwhelming feeling of loneliness?" -absolutely not. This is an emotion that I feel very, very rarely -almost never. And neither do my sons. They are remarkably emotionally self sufficient, and I attribute this to the Aspergers. We simply don't need people to fill us up. My mom, on the other hand, who if I was to try to amateur diagnose would be Borderline, is a gaping hole of emotional need and loneliness.

You might find some of the discussion in a long running thread, "Raised by Aspergers Parent" interesting:

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt87678.html

Most families are a bundle of issues, and resolving your feelings may require breaking it into its components. And knowing you aren't alone is a good first step.

Thank you for the replies, I realize that there is no substitute for professional advice and diagnosis (if I chose to go down that route) and armchair-self-diagnosis is not a satisfactory alternative. However, I am currently living in Japan, and my access to English speaking and affordable treatment options is not really an option at this time.

It certainly does sound as though my mum could be borderline, but I'm pretty certain my dad is Aspie, now I've come to research it.

No alcohol as far as I know, Bombaloo.

When I asked if you have an overwhelming feeling of loneliness (as though you are not WHOLE somehow, not necessarily towards people or company, but as thought part of you is missing from yourself) I was asking other KIDS of Aspie parents, not Aspies themselves. (I asked my Aspie partner, and he said, no never... so I know it is not an Aspie trait). However, I am trying to identify what other NT kids of Aspie parent/s feel, and if they themselves feel that they have picked up certain traits, or coping techniques (that may be emotional in nature, though not necessarily positive).

Some of your parents' behaviors could be related to Asperger's, but not all of them.
Asperger's might make your father think you were "silly", for example, but it wouldn't compel your mother to tell you you'd never amount to anything. That's just nastiness.

I think now my dad was an aspie, and so was my brother...although I also have some definite traits (shyness, need for facts, small obsessions with new topics, anxiety and a kind of tendancy to fall apart when something goes wrong, or when there's too much going on...and definitely naivaty). My daughter is sooo much like my brother was growing up it's kind of remarkable. But she also wants to globe trot, as did I. I've read that interest in other cultures is an "aspie" tendancy.

What I've come to about my dad...and my mom who is a diagnosed bipolar...and it took a while. My last big blow out with my mom was about five years ago and I'm 42. They did they're best. They did some good things (my dad taught me geometry when I was five...I know how to make a blue print thanks to him)...my mom was a musician...and she made us all learn instruments and helped us be creative. My dad taught me cooking...he LOVES cooking! It's his main "obsession." They did some bad things. My dad had full out meltdowns and would beat us with a belt. My mom had SOOO much anxiety. But they did what they could.

I honestly don't feel much toward them anymore except for love. I've learned to appreciate who they are and not wish for something else. I remember a few weeks ago actually we were watching a program at home that featured this wonderful, nurturing grandparent. My daughter said, "Mom, not one of my grandparents acts that way. Not even one." It was a good time to discuss...this is who they are, and you can only love who they are. They can't be who they are not. Just as I can't.

My daughter and I don't hug much. It used to bother me when she came from a trip or something...a day of fun with friends. All the other parents were doling out hugs to their kids...or now, youths. But we come to stand next to each other. I ask her how her time was and she explains...in great detail, what has transpired. I say, "I'm glad it was fun....or sorry it wasn't. I missed you." It's not like the other people's, but it is like us.

I hope that eventually you can come to acceptance. I got help off and on for a while. And for a while I was really really angry at my dad for his hitting. But aside from the meltdowns...he was a good dad. They didn't diagnose and support then. You just were what you were and that was that.

Bethanie

Hey Mandarin,
That link from DW is definitely worth a read. I also spent the last day or so reading Tony Attwood's guide book. This is all due to concerns raised at school re our son, although he's a ray of sunshine to everyone around him. A friend of mine mentioned AS. When I told my mum she said she's often wondered about my father being slightly autistic.
My father never showed any love towards me or my sisters. He just disciplined us. He showed no emotions except anger.
He always came across as a social ret*d - he doesn't even try to interact with others. If placed in a social situation he'll sit in the corner & close his eyes. Occasionally he'll tell a joke that no ones gets, and laugh his head off. The only person he ever contacts is his mother, she's 90 yrs old lonely & does a lot of talking.
My baby sis A (23) is 6m pregnant but our father refuses to speak to her & boyfriend as they are unmarried, which he believes is immoral.
When I quit college at 16, as I was struggling, he "belted" me, as all he wanted was children who were achievers. I got a job & then moved out at 17, as he forced me to cancel a holiday I'd booked because it was with a man (who I since married & we've been together 12 yrs now). However he'd been fine about me going to Amsterdam on my own previously.
Our mum has always been very caring and maternal, which is a blessing.
My two sisters & I have never quite fitted in or been stereotypical girls. Can't say whether this is genetic, environmental, or a mixture. The only time I ever stood up to my father was after sis B had a psychosis. She told him exactly what she thought of him. He was fuming and just about to batter her but I stood in his way and told him to back off. I think that's the bravest thing I ever did.
The best we can do is learn from our parents' mistakes. And make sure that our future generations grow up in a happy and loving family. If your partner feels the same, that's great.
I have a slight sadness that I can never love my father, but it's more of an emotional black whole.
Strangely enough our two boys get on great with him - and he seems to bond with them like he never did with us.
Try to follow your heart Mandarin, cos if you're happy that happiness can spread.
xx