Need Aspie Feedback . . . Maps in His Head?

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Quick background—my son is 4 1/2, we are waiting on full OT/Psych evaluation which has unfortunately been pushed back a few weeks. We know he has sensory issues (SPD), guessing he may be Aspie.

So, we did a family supermarket outing tonight. The entire time my son (4 ½) could not keep his hands off his sister (3). Stomping on her feet, shoving her, poking, aggravating. Not in an angry way, but it seemed he just had to be ‘acting’ with his body against something. Something was driving him, whether in fun or not, to be aggressive. (Though in truth he is a sensitive, sweet boy.) We made the rules clear—he already knows about the ‘good touch’ he is supposed to use with others. We separated them into different carts, etc.

However, when we got in the car, it started up again. We moved his booster seat and he dissolved into tears of course. Anyway, we told him we wanted him to think about not touching in ways that make people sad, etc. He was silent a few moments, then voluntarily said, “It’s because of all the maps inside my head.” We’ve heard him express this concept before, but not in relation to his behavior. I asked if he was saying he had trouble following our rules—good touch—because of the 'maps'. He said yes. Then he said, “All the maps—there are so many maps—inside my head in a big book, and they keep coming out and I have to put them back in. And I just have to think about them. And they’re always going in and out.” Remember, he’s just 4 ½. Do NT kids say this stuff?

Then, after we got home, we tried to give him some sensory stimulation--music and jumping/dancing on the bed, which made him quite happy. Again, at bedtime he spoke again about the many maps and pictures that were in the ‘big book’ in his head. “There’s also a little guy in my eyes who shoots out and takes pictures of everything.” “There’s so much important stuff in my head. So many important maps about stuff.” he says. What am I to make of this? I think he is trying to express how difficult it is for him to sort out so much of the information we give him when he already has so much of his own ‘stuff’ going on in his head? Just my guess.
Any other possible insights from those of you who think differently than I and maybe a lot more like him? I love his little brain, but I’m having trouble understanding what he is trying to express. Any ideas on how we can help him ‘organize’ his ‘maps’ or help him stop thinking about all that ‘important stuff’ in his head and bring him back into our world/moment so he can interact in ‘good ways’ with his sister and us? I have never heard anyone, let alone a 4-year-old, talk about having ‘maps’ in their head.

(Note: He calls those ‘Lego’ building guides ‘maps’ and science diagrams on how to make stuff ‘maps’, etc. Anything that is a guide, map, diagram. )

That age between 4 - 5 is very difficult for children. My son, now 13, switched personalities completely, but he says he remembers the time before 4 - 5 and how much of what was in his head he couldn't, or wouldn't want to, talk about.

He did draw intricate mazes at that age. Have you shown your son a book of mazes? If he's anything like mine, he will be reassured that there are other people having maps in their heads, and it could be a playful way of dealing with this. My son was very lively, but could be perfectly peaceful for hours, drawing his mazes on A3 sheets of paper.

For my son, that's developed into attempts to develop games which sometimes are far too complicated for others, but he's learning. It's a question of giving him the tools to translate what's in his brain into something we can all take part in.

Extraordinary when I just read your post.....I often say "I have maps in my mind" because I do. In regards to your sons behaviour, I cannot know. Maybe he's making a mental map of his sister? Quite like how Spock runs a tricorder over someone/something? Like a sensory topography. I do not know. Could he draw the that map?

About lego 'maps' and science diagrams, I bet someday your son will be a good scientist. In the meantime, sorry for the mix-up at the supermarket! Like you wrote, it is hard to assimilate all that stuff......in confidence to you, right now I'm at my desk (in lab/office) on a holiday (nobody else is here, obviously), making a distribution map of brain injection sites (you can look at my profile). It's what I do.

Well, I guess when it's time for the evaluation upcoming, you could tell him/her about the map thingy. And that you happen to know one Aspie (that's a neuroscientist) that experiences the same as an adult. Case in point.

About how to organise those maps? (I wish someone would tell me ) but maybe let him draw! Or give him schematic tools (e.g. legos) to make them......maybe he'd like electronic stuff? When I was really little my father would find old used electronic equipment (like an old telephone or recorder, whatever) at 2nd hand shops that I could disassemble and reassemble. About "little guy in my eyes who shoots out and takes pictures of everything," could you get him an inexpensive camera? Or a globe or star map. Oftentimes my mental maps accurately guide me through places where I know (maybe even if I were blindfolded) where all is oriented. I doubt NT kids say this, to answer your question. Aspie brains can have a lot of background noise - - maybe he needs quiet. I have a machine that plays 30 minutes of quasi white noise at night (e.g. babbling brook, bird song, etc.) and this helps. I also happen to have a glow-in-the-dark astronomy map

I guess I did not really help you understand what is going on inside his mind, but I do think I understand. Just know that sometimes it all is overhwelming. As if there is a bigger picture, like a gestalt master images, where all these maps must fit together. Somehow, they do.

Best to you and your son, I bet he'll be just fine. Please do not let the evaluator ever tell you differently. Oh, you could check out books by Prof. Olga Bogadishna as she's written about synaesthesia in ASD and her latest is 'Autism and the Edges of the Known World.'

It sounds like your son is a visual spatial thinker. It's a great skill but he'll need some practice in translating the way he thinks to words that everyone else can understand. Temple Grandin is a visual-spatial thinker among many.

My son is 11 years old with Asperger's. He has been driving us nuts lately as he joins in any conversation going on anywhere between anyone. He interjects his facts or corrects the person (regardless of them being an adult). I asked him one day about what he is thinking of...He sums it up to this: He has facts rolling thru his head all day (except when he is sleeping) that keep coming up and it makes it hard for him to hear what you are saying to him. You may tell him 10 times to do something but he doesn't "hear" you. He also has a ahrd time sleeping because the facts just keep coming.

I have always seen the world as it sounds like your son sees it. Growing up was difficult because no one else experienced things the way that I did and as a result, much confusion between me and my caregivers ensued.

Instead of acting out by harassing my sister (she is 18 months younger than me and as such, probably deserved some harassment), I spent a lot of time blinking very hard for very long periods of time. I think I may have been the only human in the history of mankind to have frown-lines etched into my forehead before I entered the first grade. Anyway, the very long intense "blinks" helped me organize all of the sensory input that I was experiencing. This leads me to suspect that your son is having a hard time integrating all of the information he is constantly receiving into useful knowledge.

The "maps" most certainly refer to the virtual diagrams his brain is creating to try and link all of the new information he recieves via the "little man with the camera that shoots out of his eyes" in some meaningful way. The "little man with the camera" is likely your son's way of describing to you his eidetic memory.

An important note: be careful with punishing this little one since he will likely internalize anything said or done to him forever. Having near-perfect recall came in very handy for me during engineering school but it also means that every painful thing that has ever happened is immediately available for recall in astonishing detail.

Oh. My. God.

I am the same exact way, right down to the correction of adults...

I think maybe you hit on it... maps=diagrams. It's a clear little analogy for how some of the rigid thinkers organize their thoughts. When A happens, B must follow. When I feel A, I must do B. It's interesting that he only acted out physically in the supermarket - that's a common sensory trigger.

This is all conjecture but here's my take on it.; his little sister is his 'go to'. I'm assuming that they spend lots of time together. When he has a sensory need, she's there to help him meet it. The supermarket triggered a negative sensory experience but, his little sister is his 'go to' - she ends up being the target of his unfocused efforts to regain control of his sensory issues. Almost like he's poking her expecting her to somehow 'fix it' because she 'fixes' his other needs too.

He sounds like he can verbalize quite well. Ask him. Do the lights in the store hurt his eyes? Does something there hurt his ears? What doesn't he like about the supermarket. He may very well be able to give you a clue. If it is a sound or light sensitivity issue, they can be addressed with earplugs or an iPod, and sunglasses. I'm fairly certain the issue isn't his sister - she's just the unfortunate one at the end of a much longer process.

The maps/diagrams very much sound like rigid thinking from the POV of a visual thinker.

All just supposition to consider - definitely not any sort of dx.

I have maps, too! I'm a spatial thinker.

My best guess is that maybe he was trying to tell you that he forgets about what you've told him about the rules when he's thinking about something else (and/or that he has trouble hanging onto information, and/or that he can't think of multiple things at once).

Because he's so young, the rules about good touch may exist only in one map in his mind...maybe as the map of "rules about good touch." Or, those rules might exist only in (or be attached to) a select collection of maps that have become associated and "merged" (so that they overlap, are "strung together" in various ways, or exist in the same "chapter" of his enormous book of thoughts)....this means he may not be able to apply his knowledge about how to treat others in all contexts. (The maps don't connect, or the information about good touching may not be part of all the maps it needs to be in.)

My maps can be broadened, edited, and associated with other maps (this is what "learning" and integrating information looks like for me), but it takes time, experience, and effort to do these things....so for me, there can be a very large time gap between being given information about general rules, and being able to fully understand, remember, and apply those rules across contexts. (If this is what happened, then the solution might be to try and create a link between maps, or a "compilation map" that simplifies the information he needs to work with, so that he can keep it all in mind.)

If he has (or spontaneously creates, from moment to moment), maps about, for example, how to deal with sensory sensitivities or feelings of unbearable restlessness, then these maps may take precedence in overwhelming or "high gear" situations--they might take up all the space in his mind, leaving no space for the maps that have information about how to treat others. Whatever maps he had in mind for the situation at the grocery store may have made it impossible for him to call up the maps he needed to access to refrain from poking and shoving his sister.



I think LabPet's ideas are great. And if you can give him a way to show you his maps (or parts of them) using concrete things, like photos, drawings, pictures or objects--then you might be able to show him different ways of organizing his maps. (i.e. you might be able to show him connections between situations/rules/ideas that he wouldn't automatically see/create in his mind--by showing him visible, physical models of those connections, using the same concrete things that he might be able to use to show you the connections that he already sees.)

We are left-brain thinkers to a fault. Most rules and advice from parents, school, and society at large push us further in the left-brain direction.

Right-brain thinkers seem to easily know to take all this with a grain of salt.

So, what we on the spectrum probably need are advice and modeling, take a medium step, see how it works, feedback, and another medium step. Something that simple has been helpful for me. And also permission that I need not be perfect.

PS I AM NOT A PARENT. I have lived life on the spectrum and am a pretty good guy.

I totally understand this, we notice everything all at once so it is like a guy taking pictures of everything. This can make you dizzy and floaty so there is a need to touch things to ground yourself into the world. He may be touching his sister to show that he has an effect in the world as he can see a reaction. Maybe he could have a logic puzzle game to play with whilst he is at the supermarket or maybe one of you can go off and play a categorizing game with him so the other and his sister can get the shopping done.

Fantastic analysis and suggestions! Even now as an adult, I often must actually touch things in loud crowded places to remember that I am in reality and not in dreamspace. For a little one, this could be an even more necessary behaviour.

Hmm, I don't ever recall having those specific reactions to it, but I do literally keep maps in my head when it comes to navigating and direction finding; it even translates into video games where I just intuitively map the world as I play. This is in stark contrast to my brother and half sister, who both need GPS to get to the corner store and back without getting lost, it seems to be a unique ability in my family. It's certainly not a universal AS trait, there are many more threads on here about getting lost easily than there are about never getting lost.

[quote="animalcrackers"]I have maps, too! I'm a spatial thinker.

My best guess is that maybe he was trying to tell you that he forgets about what you've told him about the rules when he's thinking about something else (and/or that he has trouble hanging onto information, and/or that he can't think of multiple things at once).

Because he's so young, the rules about good touch may exist only in one map in his mind...maybe as the map of "rules about good touch." Or, those rules might exist only in (or be attached to) a select collection of maps that have become associated and "merged" (so that they overlap, are "strung together" in various ways, or exist in the same "chapter" of his enormous book of thoughts)....this means he may not be able to apply his knowledge about how to treat others in all contexts. (The maps don't connect, or the information about good touching may not be part of all the maps it needs to be in.) [quote]

Really, really helpful insight animalcrackers. Everything you said made a whole lot of sense when I think about my son and his 'maps' and his inability to listen or follow directions sometimes. Love your point about info being on different maps and not 'connecting' necessarily. Going to have my husband read this. I also like the suggestion Inspirations made about being more proactive and giving him a logic game (he loves those) to help him focus in on something and block out the over-stimluation. Although, I've asked him if anything--noise, lights--bothers him and he says 'no', but I do know from birth he has hated any situation where there are lots of people. So, that's probably part of it. So hard to remind my NT brain to remember this sometimes. This is all kind of new to us too.

Anke & LabPet, appreciate your ideas on giving him the tools he needs to express what's in his mind. I should find some old electronics for him to take apart. He’d love that. Problem we have right now is that he has a big delay in his ability to write/draw. He can, however, make some pretty amazing Lego creations from scratch . . . and he will design stuff in his head and then direct me on how to ‘cut’ it out of paper. So, he is able to visualize right now but can’t use all the tools necessary to produce! I can’t wait until he can draw or use computers to create . . . hoping to get some kind of ipad when I can afford it to allow him to ‘draw’ with his fingers, etc.
LabPet, appreciate your points on sensory topography and assimilation. Also, the book suggestion. Looks fascinating. I’m an avid reader, so it’s going on the list.

missybilly, we have similar issues with him ‘hearing’ us too. He is too lost in his thoughts and it can take awhile to break through! We gave up on naps at an early age, because he would keep himself awake by reciting information in his head! Oh my . . . .

Ghostar, your thoughts make so much sense. About sensory integration, linking virtual diagrams, and processing information. He is such a thinker . . . I haven’t thought (sorry to say) how hard it might be for him to process what we say/want/do in addition to all that is going on in his head. It is virtually impossible for him to break away from a 'project' and think about anything else, such as dinner.

We are definitely very thankful he is so articulate and verbal . . . though he isn’t that way all the time. Sometimes he just melts down, but when he does express himself, it is typically meaningful and articulate. He has been astounding us with what he can say and the incredible thoughts that come out of his head since he was 18 months . . . it's just the social/behavioral breakdown that ends up frustrating us and leaving us baffled. SO helpful to hear things from an aspie point of view!! I think I need to go read some stuff about siblings of aspies as well . . . I think we have quite a bit more sibling rivalry because they are 1) close in age and 2) polar opposites, as well as my DS using poor DD as a sensory 'sounding board'. Yesterday, I drew him a 'touch' map for a guide on how to touch his sister. He got very, very excited and asked me to draw more . . . I've just got to wrap my own brain around this spatial/visual stuff!! Not me at all.

Maybe these maps are photographs that he takes with his brain and he remembers most of the ones that he has taken because he has a great visual memory. When you store many many many pictures of your environment in your head, they will pop out, just like he says, at the slightest provocation. Any word that someone says, the corresponding pictures will pop out, things that he has seen in real life, things that he has seen on TV, in books, on posters, related to that word or concept. It's involuntary and uncontrollable. They are like pictures in a big book that is ever growing, and the pictures come out so easily, one after another, and basically takes over the experience of whatever mundane thing is actually going on in the world outside his mind's eye. He might not even be able to describe the pictures, because the picture or video experience is so vivid and takes over so much of his mental processing that he can't recall the words to associate with these visual experiences. I'm only guessing at the last one, but that happens to me a lot.