what happens when I go against better judgement

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My 7yo son has aspergers. I have a rule, no video games or iPad before schoolwork is complete, becasue when he has it first there is ALWAYS an issue getting him to do his work. It is like getting paid without doing your job.

SO, anyhow, this am he was begging to watch his iPad. I cracked, he promised to turn it off ASAP when I told him. So, I was giving him his 10 minute warning that it would be time to turn it off in 10 mins, and he started to argue that he NOW wants his DS. So, I go to pause his ipad game so I can get him to look at me and hear what I am saying, and he swats my hand away and I hit the button that ended the game instead. He now starts screaming at me. "Why did you turn it off? I want my DS!! !"

I just cant win. I want to be nice and let him have a treat, a special, every now and then, but EVERY TIME I do this happens. He was yelling at me, talking back, and now lost his video games for the day. I dont know how to get thru to him. He will beg and plead, "please mommy, I will not argue when you say its time to turn it off, I will not ask for more time, please just let me have 10 minutes, please, I promise!! !" then WHY cant he follow thru with it, and WHY does he talk back so bad???

I told him he just lost the video games for the day, and he is yellingg, "NO, I did NOT lose them for the day, I WILL have them later!" and so on. Seriously???

I know its all my fault for giving him them in the first palce, I should know better that it NEVER ends well. But as a mother, I want to treat him and give him what he wants on occasion. I just cant. I want to believ ehis words, I wantt o trust him when he says to give him a chance...And when I say no to the initial request, he cries, begs and moans anyhow.

When do you know it is time to try and trust and when it is time to bend the rules a bit?? Maybe 7 is just waaaay to young for this???

I don't think he was intentionally telling a lie. (My son is 7, too) I really do think they mean it when they say it. The siren call of the special interest is just too strong for them to resist at this stage of maturity, even with best intentions. With spectrum kids, I hesitate to say based on chronological age. Based on maturity sounds right.

Don't be so hard on yourself for trying it. The only way to know if they can handle something is to try it now and again.

I do not allow computer in the A.M, during the week, because the A.M is already too hectic and rushed. I do allow it when he comes home before homework, and he will transition from the computer to homework at the daily designated time relatively well. He needs the downtime after school, and it works alright for us, but it has taken awhile to get there. He could not do it in the A.M, though.

I think the way to figure out when to loosen up a little would be to kind of keep track of general improvements in self control. If he is regularly having outbursts like that when you try to transition him from (other) fun things to things he has to do, you will know he won't be able to manage doing it with video games.

Good poins, he has little self control when it comes to video games. I know he means is in the moment, but how do you explain to a 7yo that I understand what he is saying, but I just cannot allow it. How do I get him to understand WHY I am saying no. Not becuase I am mean or dont want him to have fun, I would LOV to give him 10 minutes in the am. But his reactions and his defiance and his refusal to turn it off makes it impossible for me to give him what he wants when he is asking. And every single day he asks for it in the morning.

I can ask my 3yo to please turn off the TV or iPad and she just does it. but then again she isnt obssessed with it. She has no obsessions.

It is just frustrating, and I have to stick to my guns about NO games or iPad in the morning no matter how sweet he is asking or what he is saying he will do that we all know he wont when the time comes.

I think I would have a talk with him about it during a time when the conflict is not going on, say over the weekend. Try telling him that you understand that he is disappointed when he cannot play games in the mornings. Explain that it is too difficult for him right now to control it to where he can stop when he needs to, and that he has to get better at self-control first. Maybe give him a list of baby step conditions like reducing meltdowns to x per week and maybe specific transition goals or something before you try again.

I have started very recently explaining that kind of thing to my son, and sometimes he gets it (sometimes not) but it enables me to try to enlist his help in controlling himself so he sees how it will benefit him. I have told him the overall benefits of self-control and why it is important.

We have so many problems with him and self-control. I just decided that I need him to be aware we are working on it, so he can help us help him. It also helps him understand that I am not just being a big, ol' meanie, but that self-control is an important attribute for a person to have.

We are just starting to arrive to where this may work, and if your son is not quite there yet, either, that is OK, too, because you are laying the groundwork. That is how I look at it, anyway.

Don't give up on the explanations, even when they don't get it now. I have found that my son at age 11 is just now understanding some of the things explained to him over and over the past few years, and I know there are things he doesn't get now but he is hearing me and will get it in the future.

We didn't know about our son's AS, but we would explain to him that he couldn't play certain video games that dad played because he would talk about them all the time and with other children. We explained that his off button didn't always work very well. Some parents didn't let their children play those games and some of the things on the games were not okay to talk about in school or with all kids (many of his friends were several years younger). We explained that we would help him develop better control over his "off button" and test it out once in a while. When we saw it was working, then we would allow him more access to those games. He didn't like that explanation and said he promised not to talk about it at school, but we knew what he wanted and what he could do were two different things.

He also gets really wound up in video games, which is okay until he starts having a meltdown over dying or not getting to complete a certain level or do a certain task. I would stop him in a game and point out. you are jumping up and down, you are frowning, you are yelling, you are doing it over and over and getting worse. These are signs that it is time to take a break from the game. I know you want to keep going, but as your mom I am going to help you by saying, "no, you need a break" This did not usually stop the being upset or crying or yelling at me when he was younger, but now at 11, I can point out that he might need a break, and he can pause the game and take a break, or change to something less frustrating. The yelling at me usually got him an additional break from the game for several days, while choosing to go away without lashing out at me would get him a second chance at the game later in the day.

Even now, we are working on how much is too much. He still gets so obsessed about games/videos of the game/websites talking about the game that he shuts out the family and we are trying to teach priority and balance. It is very hard. If we give him even a half an hour in the evening, he gets upset that he doesn't have more. If he knows he has to wait to the weekend, he wants to play and is a little upset, but is more with the family in our family activities. Its like once that part of the brain turns on, it is hard to turn off.

We also practiced the stopping. On a few weekends, we had him play on the game and told him if he stopped and did what was asked immediately, he could get back, on after doing the task. I explained what we were doing and why. I interrupted a lot. If he took longer than 3 minutes to get off (timer in view), whined, cried, stomped his feet, or yelled then he had to wait one hour to get back on. We asked him to do little things like go put up a pair of shoes, or give mom a hug, or run to the mailbox and back three times (for exercise). Short simple tasks. He still slips up sometimes, but does much better now.

I just wanted you to hang on and keep trying. Don't give up and know he is probably hearing you even if he can't control it so well now.

Stick to your guns and stay consistent. His behavior is telling you that he isn't ready for the slippery slope of "sometimes" its OK to play video games in the morning. Set your morning routine and stick to it. My DS will eventually stop begging me for something when I say "no" firmly several days in a row.

This, plus keep up the explaining. Maybe have DS help set up the rules for the morning routine. We starting doing this with DS9, so he feels like he has some say. My DS really does better after he wakes if he can play for about 15 mins before school. He usually wakes up and starts to panic/get very anxious about going to school; the game time helps calm him. We wake him up early enough so he can play before getting ready. Same with after school - he really needs the down time before he starts homework.

ee,I find I just have to say not at all until work is done (he is homeschooled) casue if you give him an inch, he wants a mile. I cant just say, "sure have 15 minutes" casue when the time is up he has a fit. UUUGH.

the other thing I dont understand, is he is crying, punching the chair, yelling while playing some games. I will talk ot him about switiching activities to one that makes him happy, and while he is crying, he is telling me he IS happy and having fun. I dont find crying and yelling as a sign of happiness, and I explain it to him, that wehn we hare happy we smile, say nice words, laugh etc...and when he is crying, punching and yelling, he is showing me he is unhappy. But he INSISTS he is happy and even having fun. Can this be or is he just saying that becasue he doesnt want the game changed?

I will not be giving in for a long time. Rule must stay firm and concrete, no matter how much he begs and pleads his case.

thats almost exactly how my son was/is sometimes still.

It helped me to think of it like when a toddler wants to play through nap time. Even though they insist they are having fun and in some ways they are, but they are still grouchy, cry easily, and are irritable. We see they are getting this way and as a parent we have to step in and provide restrictions. At 11 and with lots of help, my son is just now beginning to say ... oh yeah, I was upset because I was making fists, my heart was beating fast, I felt angry, I was yelling. Up to this point, he wouldn't admit he was upset or getting upset unless tears were falling.

This is spot on - I know my kiddo has a pretty tough time identifying his own feelings. It is a common spectrum trait. Keep talking to him about the way people look and feel inside when they are happy, sad, excited, angry... We have been using a 1-5 system for over a year now, 1 is calm and 5 is really angry, and DS is now able to tell me his number on a pretty consistent basis.

I like the 1-5 rating scale... something concrete for him to work on. I think he might have been having fun at one point, but when he is crying, the fun has ended. Even still he refuses to switch gears and play spmething else.

consistency is the first thing I thought when I read the first post of this thread. I always did better at predicting expectations when my parents were more consistent with me.

And I'll be honest, I don't think I could easily switch gears with putting the reward (viddy games/electronics, whatever) before a necessary task. If I always did that, nothing would get done around here (because it's just that hard to switch gears for me). I had no awareness of my struggle with it at the age of 7, but I know that about myself now as I'm 28.

Personally I would say he'd probably be better off holding off on ipad/games until after school and just plain not at all in the morning if he's anything like me.

I would probably vouch to say that you are right on about him being upset regarding unpredictability/change in a game.

And here's another thing. Some times, some of us can get perfectionistic or even downright obsessive about playing games. Think about it: if he feels that the NT world outside of him is out of his control, then naturally he'll want to have something for himself to control to call his own (and better that it's not an eating disorder like when I was younger, right?). This is where the ipad and the games come into question. I especially seem have a hankering for getting obsessive about games if I had a disagreement with someone and they're mad at me or I'm p*ssed at someone or they're embroiled in a flamewar with me and I desperately want to get my mind off of it, or at least channel my anxiety or frustration towards something else. My game "crack" in my case, comes in the form of the genre of puzzle games, all stereotypically involving dropping things that get manipulated to then get rid of them (aka things like tetris, puyo (sp?) type games, columns, dr. mario). You know the type. My current go-to in that department is the DS adaption of dr. mario, found in brain age 2 that was relabeled as "virus buster." This game is so addicting that it makes my adrenaline go sailing to the moon. Only problem is, that it's hard to get it to come back down again, like a cat who crawled her way into a tree. So then you are playing and you lose the game, and you can't come down from the adrenaline so you want to play it again and again until you reach a point of being satisfied to put up and go "ok, I've had enough" which is hard to do when you're perfectionistic. I'm not kidding, with that game, no lie, I could be losing the game, and as the pills are piling up in the game I'm barking profanities at the ds while I'm desperately attempting to salvage the game instead of losing. Sometimes I'm able to wipe my brow and go WHEW that was close after doing damage control on the high stack (after misplacing a pill/not getting it rotated right) and to knock it back down again to where I'm not losing the game. Other times the profanities stack up like the pills do and I lose. By then my brain is hooked. So I end up playing 2 or 3 more times again until I've had my fill. And I'll be serious. I'm really good at that game (I usually stink at most video games). Most of the time I play hard mode and I get plane status (scores on brain age are "categorized" by vehicles/speeds when you're done, dude walking is the slowest, then car, then train, then plane, then rocket is the highest speed). One time I got rocket and my score was over 3000 but since it was a subsequent play it wasn't recorded (top recorded is 2800). And that's part of what's so hard with parting with it, is the adrenaline rush, because my favorite part is when I'm long in the game and flying by the seat of my pants flinging the stylus everywhere scattering pills as they're dumping down in hoards of total chaos. And it could be a fascination too because it stimulates my brain in a way it's good at-- taking in a ton of information at once and isolating/highlighting what's "important" to accomplish whatever (total aspie trait too, btw).

When it comes to that game, I feel like I'm a music box that can't stop playing until I become completely unwound. I don't play it that often for that reason, but when I do feel inclined, god help me.

It's hard to switch gears. Especially when something like that has one all wound up.

Most things that work (at least with me) were concrete, consistent, outlined ideas. I wish I had a 1-5 rating scale when I was a kid. Because sometimes my mom would misinterpret how I felt about stuff quite regularly.

That reminds me of the time when mom and I were at Toys R Us. I was six and we were looking at The Little Mermaid stuff. I wanted to get a set of these toys and mom made a deal with me that I have to share one of them with my brother. I was okay with it. But when we got home, I had a hard time letting one of the toys go. I couldn't decide what to give away so I ended up breaking the deal. I cried and screamed and was very upset. Then my parents gave up and I had all the toys. Guilty I know. I honestly thought I could keep my promise and I failed. Mom tried to be nice and spoil me and that was the last time she let me get something I wanted.

I can only reiterate what some others have said: KEEP reinforcing. You will have to do it over and over and over and over and over and over and over and OVER (and over and over and over) again. Seriously... a million times. It's just 'one of those things' with Aspie kids -- they need to be told, then reinforced, then told again, then reinforced. Leaning a "life lesson" doesn't come as naturally to those with Aspergers because they think in terms of black and white.

Most "NT" people learn by trial and error. Most Aspies do not -- this takes YEARS of practice and 'behavioral modification' before they make the connection between cause and effect. People with Aspergers tend to think in synchronic terms. It's a matter of "act now based on my own interpretation of what's happening at this very moment". For anyone else, we'd use past experience to help us make a judgement about something. Both my husband and my son have Aspergers and they both struggle to actively think about how their actions could affect others (OR their impulse to get what they want right NOW overpowers any repercussions that may come later).

the good news is that repeated and constant reinforcement does eventually get the message through. You have to explain it in a way that is logical, though. "IF you do THIS, THEN this will happen BECAUSE..." Then you have to follow through with the consequence. And don't ever get complacent -- My husband is 40 years old and still struggles. If I assume he's figured it out and leave him to it, then he slips back into old habits every single time. Simple messages such as "when you avoid eye contact with people, it makes them feel uncomfortable because they think you aren't paying attention to them" have to be said time and time again to both my husband and son alike.

Yet, get them talking about something they are interested in and they learn REAL quick. Go figure.... How to make "learning to use eye contact" fun???? Hmmm... might have to ponder that.

Thanks all, I just have to not feel bad about not giving in once in a blue moon, and stick to my rules of no video games before school work is completed. Even when he is saying all the right things. I will contnue to explain to him that the rule cannot be changed. Should I tell him why? becasue whenever we do, he refuses to shut it off and has a meltdown? Or just leave it as, "sorry, the rule is no games before schollwork is completed." and leave it be.

I have a feeling I will just leave it at that, cause whenever I go to the , "You always say you will shut it off, but that never happens" he then prommises and swears he will do it this time. I dont want to open the debate up at all.

MMJMOM says, "as a mother, I want to treat him and give him what he wants on occasion. I just cant. I want to believ ehis words, I wantt o trust him when he says to give him a chance..."

We've been through it all with screen time for my son, currently 11 years old. It's hard to want to give your son treats at times. We have to stay super strict to the screen time rules, but try to establish other things that he likes and can receive as treats. Screen has a definite time and place, but other things can be more random. - like foods, silly routines, cool physical puzzles, art supplies, outings, etc. Just be careful that when he asks for screen time, you don't answer with a substitute treat. He probably won't accept that. Try to preempt him.

I want to thank the Asperger adults who have given explanations on this topic. This is so helpful to us NT's ! !!