Lying

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My 8 year old son is lying, even when the truth is easier, he still lies. I don't know what to do about this. He tells "stories" about places he has been or people he knows, that is an issue, but it is the lying that is "out of control". For example, today while in school, he had an arguement with another student over a pencil and from what the teacher said, grabbed the students head and pushed it away. When he was confronted by the teacher he told them a different story and how it wasn't his fault. When the student told their side, my son said that HE was lying and took the blame for the incident. I wasn't there so I don't know the truth, but, this has happen so many times before I don't know what to believe.

My son is NOT an aggressive or mean child, he doesn't start fights, but when it does happen I cannot get the right story out of him. Is there anyone else going through anything similar to this? How do you handle the lying? Any help will be greatly appreciated.

I used to lie all the time because I could not think of anything else to say

I think that it isn't all that unusual for children with an active imagination to make up stories and tell them. They are just playing. As long as they learn to separate fantasy from reality as they grow older, I wouldn't think that would be a concern.

In my own case, when I was a first and second grader in the 1960 to 1962 time period, the space program was a major news item. I had fantasies about being an astronaut and would tell anyone that I was an astronaut. It was just fantasy and quite separate from lying.

I've seen a number of kids who were convinced they were marines or cowboys or police officers or firefighters and would not hesitate to tell you so.

If it keeps going for many years, then it does present a problem. For example, I used to know one college kid who would tell everyone that he was both a world famous race car driver and the reincarnation of Elvis Presley.

But for an 8 year old? I doubt there is much to worry about there.

I suspect that the other problem about lying to shift the blame is much the bigger problem.

The child have autism or Aspergers? I think this might be a rhetorical question, and I am only answering this based on the thought that your kid is. My answer will be of that of a person who is Aspergers.
I remember I would tell stories as a kid as well. I was a good athlete growing up, so some of my fantasy stories revolved around how many goals I could score at hockey, soccer, and how many home runs I could hit playing baseball. It was all fun and the older guys ate up the stories (they knew I was lying, but they liked the cockiness and saw that I played hard playing pick up sports games).
When it comes to outright lying, it would present a problem. Most of the problems I had at school were what I would tell the principal at school when I got into trouble that others started it, and at some points this was not true. Once proven a liar, the principal would not be as willing to help. When it comes to lying, I have read that Aspies have to be told what is right and wrong in the honesty sense. I also know from my experience that this holds true.
My parents were very good at catching me in a lie. I would reckon you would be as well. Aspies, and Autistics are not very good at lying. Keep that in mind. I will not tell you how to handle it personally, because I don't want to make you feel like you're being told what to do as a parent. But one suggestion to get a story out of your child is to repeat the questions at some point in the story and maybe change the wording of said questions. Something I learned from crime scene investigation classes during my law and security classes in college.

My daughter lies and makes things up, I think its often because she feels pressured or questioned like Im interogating her even though Im just asking how her day was. She does know shes doing it and will often go back on it and say she was just tricking me or joking. At the moment its mostly annoying, shes only 5. But I can imagine it will become more of a problem when shes older

This is a common topic on this site:

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt204892.html
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt161029.html
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt161991.html
http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt106243.html

Many kids with ASDs seem to have a slippery relationship with what others consider t be "the truth". Check out some of the threads above (sorry you might have to copy and paste, I'm being lazy). There is some really good stuff there!

ETA After reading some of the other posts, I felt I needed to modify my comment about "the truth". As you can see from what others have posted, the truth can indeed be relative. This is difficult for us as parents sometimes because it looks like our kids are intentionally being dishonest but if we take the time to really figure out what is going on, we might find that is not the case.

Last edited by Bombaloo on 02 Nov 2012, 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

Yup, I think I've talked about it myself with my own son. He is just now starting to understand the idea of "we value the truth" and why at 12 years old.

While he does like to escape consequences or because he's uncomfortable, very often he also lies because he doesn't understand what's going on and people do push kids to say something: sounds like that is what's happening here. Very often, the impulse control issues we had were something that DS was barely conscious of, so when confronted by a teacher it would appear he was lying - but he was really just very disconnected from whatever happened.

Sometimes, what we do is tell my son that we will wait until he can think about his answer a little bit, and then ask again in five minutes or so when he's had a chance to calm down. This helps a lot in situations where I can't tell if it is a lie or that he isn't certain about the truth.

I don't know how common this is among aspies (if your son is on the spectrum; I'm going to assume so like everybody else; sorry if I'm wrong), but I definitely have experience with it. I used to do it ALL THE TIME. I was just pressured and I'd acted impulsively, and I was really sorry for whatever I did but I didn't want to get in trouble, and I didn't want my classmates to think I was mean, etc, so I lied. It was almost fun, really, making up these almost plausible stories on the fly. It was also probably because I was angry at the time, but only partially.

I used to lie because I thought it keep me out of trouble. Telling the truth would just get me into trouble so it didn't keep out out of it like my mother claimed it did. I also used to make up stories just to get attention. Also it was because people would probe me for an answer when I didn't know the answer so I make something up or just pick an answer they were giving me. Also it was because of the way my mind worked like for example if I hit my brother while we were both playing in the playroom, my brother would go running to our mother saying I hit him and she and him would talk about it getting his side of the story. Then mom would come downstairs and I be in the kitchen coloring let's say, mom would ask me if I hit my brother, I would say no. In my mind my brother wasn't in the room and I was coloring so I didn't hit him because my brother wasn't there. I wouldn't know she was talking about when I was in the playroom with my brother playing. Also it was the way I communicated, I would say I wouldn't do it anymore and I would think we were talking about that day only so I wouldn't do it again, but the next day I would. So it seemed like I was lying. But of course I would figure out they meant forever when they would tell me I said this before and I am still doing it.

That's not lying, that's having an active imagination. I used to play out different scenarios in my head all the time, and still do. I mean, it might be that your son pushed the other child. Or it might be that the teacher just doesn't like your son. But don't call your son a liar just because his sense of reality might be different from your

Ive been wondering about this imagination thing, it seems a lack of imaginative play is one of the criteria for Aspies yet Im always being told what an active imagination my daughter has, and in a way she has, she can make some really odd stuff up! But when she plays shes just repeating real life scenarios in play form so not really playing make believe like most kids do. Sorry not wanting to hijack the post!

My youngest has the same issue with lying. She will say something, and then deny having said it a short while later even though there were witnesses who all tell her she said it. She has a fabulous memory too so it's not that she forgot. She will regularly lie about lots of things and she's always had this problem. My eldest was the total opposite (both have AS). She would tell the truth scrupulously even when it got her into trouble for admitting to something. Eventually, very late on (and more so because she witnessed her sister lying) she cottoned on to potential benefits of lies and started to twist the truth a little bit more (but in that AS way it's obvious she's lying) and she only started doing this in the last couple of years (she's now 11).

Both behaviours are written about by Tony Attwood (can't find the link) because whereas a lot of Aspies are utterly honest there are others where the lack of empathy means they have no problem lying.

...found it:

"Where lying is becoming an issue for the family and friends of the person with Asperger’s syndrome, explanations will be sought. First, due to impaired or delayed ToM abilities, the person with Asperger’s syndrome may not realize that the other person is likely to be more offended by the lie than by any apparent misdemeanour. Second, he or she may consider that a lie can be a way of avoiding consequences, or a quick solution to a social problem.What the person might not acknowledge is that lying can also be a way of maintaining self-esteem should he or she have an arrogant self-image, whereby the making of mistakes is unthinkable."

http://www.peaknt.com/files/The%20Compl ... ttwood.pdf

I wonder if it's possible than an aspie can lie pathologically because they were told that they shouldn't be honest and they have to lie and it's okay to lie. Tell an aspie that lying is wrong, they take it literal and end up being too honest. But tell an aspie it's okay to lie, they take it literal and start lying all the time.

I did a lot of lying when I was in school, to protect myself from getting yelled at by my mum.

It's commonly thought that people on the autism spectrum are bad at lying or unwilling to lie. I'm on the autism spectrum and I lie a lot, and I did moreso as a child. I feel kind of bad about it.

The situation of being in trouble and being questioned about doing something wrong is horrible to me. (And always makes me cry. Even now that I'm 20. It's embarrassing). It's a very pressureful situation. And I tend to be awkward at communicating at the best of times. Generally, speaking out loud the thing I want to say in my mind doesn't come wholly naturally to me. It's like, there's the thing in my head I am trying to say, and the thing that it comes out as, and never shall the twain meet, so I end up making stuff up because it's easier. I can usually say what I think when I'm not under pressure or when I'm having a casual conversation with a friend, but when an older person is angry at me and questioning me angrily, it gets incredibly hard to express what is in my mind and I usually end up making random things up.

Maybe if you really commend him for the times he is honest and point it out to him, that might improve things. Or taking a non-confrontational approach. It can be very hard for an autistic person to tell the truth when they feel confronted.