Venting

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I am highly irritated with my 12 yr old, right now. In fact, I am down-right p*ssd. I understand the nature of his condition, and I understand his need for academic support. I also understand his need to take me for granted, everytime he has a homework assignment. Ok, so maybe it's easier for me to be creative.. and as an adult, I can obviously write better than he (one would hope). But, it's no excuse to suck me dry and be disrespectful once the homework is COMPLETE. At least, that's how he's been acting lately.

He filled out a multiple choice questionnaire today - describing himself (for a high school entrance).
A question read:

You are a hard worker.
a) This is very much like me.
b) This is somewhat like me.
c) This is not at all like me.

He chose b. Somewhat? So he's aware he doesn't put enough effort into things? That's not what I hear from his teachers, as he works so diligently for them. I'm such a sucker. I am done holding his hand, every step of the way. Really, he just wants me to help him so he can get it done faster! Last week, he even said he didn't want to read a science page, to answer some questions, because it would take "too long" .. yet he can read chapter book after chapter book to his liking. No thank you.

Rough night. I'm ticked off. He is learning his lesson the hard way tonight.

Hang in there. Tweens and teens are supposed to push our buttons, aren't they? At times like this I humor myself by saying they are engaging in "typical" behavior.

I'm about to crack open a beer. Want to join me?

I would love a beer! I don't think it will mix with my migraine, though.

My son is seven and also wants help on things he can do himself because they are boring.

I don't think your son's answer to the questionnaire is disrespectful. It probably was not the answer they wanted, but Aspies do not do a good job of playing the game. Maybe I do not understand how you mean "disrespectful."

Do you think it was disrespectful because it was not the thing you should write for an entrance exam, or do you think it was disrespectful because he admits to not being 100% dedicated? To me, if it is the former, then it was just a matter of him not understanding what he should put to "look good." If it the latter, then he was giving an acknowledgement that he could try harder and that he thinks it is somewhat of a fault. I don't think that is disrespectful, so much as him giving an honest but subjective perception of himself. Maybe he understands that he has trouble pushing through boring things and that NTs think of this as not working hard.

So, it could be something to build from and maybe help him improve. It might be a sign that he wants to improve his tolerance for boring things or is at least a little receptive to it. My son has no clue this it is unusual to have the degree of difficulty in pushing through the boring stuff, to me your son seems to at least understand that. I don't think that means he is playing you so much as that maybe he gets that he is different from his peers.

Last edited by ASDMommyASDKid on 29 Jan 2013, 1:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

What exactly is a hard worker?

To me it means you don't do any hard work. I don't even know if I am a hard worker or not but if I was going through a stressful situation and couldn't handle things anymore but I kept trying to push myself to get it done, despite having someone help me through it to make it easier for me, yeah hard worker. If I just avoid it just because it's too much for me, yeah not a hard worker.


But define hard work. Some people may think their job they do is hard but they do it anyway so they call themselves a hard worker. Other things people do that are hard but they don't have to work hard at it to do it because it's easy, not a hard worker. I don't see myself as a hard worker at work even though I do do my job and do it all on my own and do a good job with it. I am only a hard worker if I get behind so I had to catch up by working faster and not let myself get distracted. That is working hard. If a change in my routine happened and I had to deal with it and still made it through, hard worker. For other people, not a hard worker because they didn't have to work as hard as I to deal with it and get though it.

Your son sounds a little like me, and honestly, if I were the one answering that question, I'd probably respond the same way. I always did well in class insofar as I got good grades and I didn't act out, and I got high marks when it came to in-class effort. But when it came to homework, I put in the least amount of effort I could get away with.

My mom didn't hold my hand, though, when it came to homework. I did my homework most the time without any outside assistance. She would help me if I had a hard time with my homework, but if I made a fuss over a difficult assignment, she refused to help. Her line was always, "Fine; then you have to explain to your teacher why you didn't finish your homework." It may have taken me a little while for me to come around, but when threatened with having to face the teacher with why I didn't complete an assignment, I did my work.

I was somewhat of a "Rule Boy" as a child: I was passive and obedient at school, but I had a defiant streak at home, which might have had something to do with it:
http://life.familyeducation.com/asperge ... 40202.html

I can't say that such a tactic will work with your son, but it might be worth trying at least once.

I think you misunderstood me. I don't think being honest with the questionnaire was disrespectful. He described himself in a way he sees himself. Stating he's "somewhat" of a hard worker was an eye opener for me.. And almost a confession from him. What I find disrespectful is taking advantage of me because he wants to rush through his homework.. and then after the hard work I put into helping, he doesn't appreciate it. He's becoming a typical preteen with the ATTITUDE.

Last night he spent a lot of time doing his work with very little hands-on help from me. Yes, a learning curve for me too.

I think it's more about my son's perception on how hard he thinks he works. I saw it as an unintentional confession. I'm glad he didn't lie! It just means he needs to pull up his socks, rely on me less, and rely on himself more. It's been a bit of a trend with him lately and it's going to stop.

It's actually quite interesting, now that I'm not ticked. Maybe it's his next hurdle in life.. to practice critical thinking.. or at least put in the effort. I don't mind being his buffer. He just needs to adjust his thinking that mom will save him all the time.

When it comes to homework, he does it all.. unless we're in "survival mode", which isn't very often anymore. There are certain things he can do and there are certain things he has difficulties with. When I try to step back.. and I mean by giving him the tools to find his answers, his behaviours come out. It's harder for him and he just wants me to find the page, point to the answer and read. The other day, I thought I was helping, same situation.. looking for a definition of a mineral, from his science text book. As I was reading it to him, I started chatting. Wouldn't you know, he was writing word-for-word all I was saying. Which meant he really wasn't processing ANYTHING. Just rushing to get his work done. Lol

I have used the "explain to the teacher" bit. It's tricky though because there are so many variables for us. I've even left a note in his agenda but now he threatens to rip it out. I worry he's going to get himself into a habit of NOT doing his homework at all.

Maybe you have held his hand too much. He is 12, which is old enough to do his own homework, and if he has trouble, then he can ask you. You can tell him to ask you if he has trouble, but you are not going to sit with him to help him finish his homework faster. He should be able to look up answers in a book by himself. If he can't, then you can teach him to do so. Doing his homework with him has perhaps instilled in him a habit of dependency on you, him knowing that you will help him so he doesn't have to work as hard himself.

Well, I nag him about that all the time and truth is, he's only 12 in number. He hardly acts his age until the preteen hormones kick in. But, yes, I have held his hand too long. I was actually thinking, a few days ago, HOW I'm going to survive high school. I hated it the first time! Lol

I do not really understand this question myself. I will explain why.

Let's say we have the statements:

a. All A are B.
b. Some A are B
c. No A are B.
d. By implication, if some A are B then some A are not B.
We have qualifiers all, some and no.

I will define the qualifiers.

All means that every member c that is in A is also a member of B.
Some means that for every member c that is in A the amount of c that is in B is >then 0% and less than 100% . We have 0%>c>100%.
No means that for every member c that is in A no members of A are members of B.

You are a hard worker.
a) This is very much like me.
b) This is somewhat like me.
c) This is not at all like me.

Let's analyze this question and dissect it.

Choice a could include the qualifier all but does not have to. To me very much or a lot is a subset of some but it is still a version of some. It still have the properties of sum which is 0%>c>100%. Choice b directly says the qualifier of some.

This is where I become confused. If he believes a then by implication he must believe b.

premise 1: If a then b.
premise 2: a
conclusion: b

Why does this questionnaire consider these two answers separate and only allow a person to choose only one answer.

I used critical thinking on this question and this is my analysis. If my analysis is wrong then why is it wrong?

This is what The Foundation for Critical Thinking says what critical thinking is:
http://www.criticalthinking.org/pages/d ... inking/766




Do any of his assignments that he receives from his classes teach him how to conceptualize, apply, analyze, synthesize and evaluate information gathered from, or generated, by observation, experience, reflection, reasoning, or communication, as a guide to action? What exactly did he have to do with his reading? What kind of questions were these that he had to answer in his book? Were they asking him to just regurgitate definitions or formulas or were these things examined and analyzed? If the former then how is he critical thinking?

With these terms like clarity some of them seem to be a matter of opinion and is based upon some subjectivity and the culture. So is relevance. For me, something could be clear while for another person it is unclear. What is the essence of relevance and clarity? For me, I have said or written things down I thought were relevant but others have said these things were not? How does one determine relevancy? Is it relevant when most people in a society or group say it is relevant?

What is considered a good reason? What is the essence of good? How does one determine this? One person could think something is a good reason for x and another may not think so? How does one determine what is good?





Is he being taught to do any of this whatsoever by his school or you? For me, I didn't know the concept of critical thinking even existed until my freshmen of college. Does he even have the concept of what critical thinking is and what it even means? How can one do something or apply something that one does not even have a concept of?

Does a society's moral standards ever become inconsistent? To me, it does when one is supposed to consider a person's feelings at times over telling them the truth. Let's say a person has a smell to them that indicates that something may be physically wrong with them internally. They may need to go to the hospital. If other people will not tell them the truth because it is socially inappropriate and if this person dies then does this mean the social veneer becomes inappropriate and immoral? What is the essence of morality?

I have a 2nd cousin who used fraudulent magnetic bracelets because she has arthritis. What she is experiencing is the placebo effect. Let's say she used these bracelets as a placebo to relieve other pain. What if she needed to go to the hospital and she developed a permanent condition that could've been treated at its early onset? My family thought she it was making her feel better and it was inappropriate as a teenager to try to convince her other wise by explaining the placebo effect. Why is it considered moral for social appropriateness at times to trump a person's life and health? I don't understand this whatsoever? Why is dishonesty in this case considered moral especially if it could lead to the bad health or death of a person? What exactly is the essence of appropriateness, morality, goodness and behavior?

Is he being taught critical thinking skills and how to determine things like this? My point is how can he determine what is appropriate if one does not know how to determine it? How can one be inappropriate if one does not know what appropriateness is? If one does not know what appropriateness is then how can one intentionally be inappropriate.

I'm not sure I was able to process most of this but I will respond to your last section. The basis of the questionnaire was to see how the students measured up against their program's expectation. It is very subjective and it's true, one could have selected all socially "perfect" answers. Maybe it was all about credibility though. How do YOU see yourself? There were probably over 100 applicants fighting for 20 seats. This meaningless questionnaire was their attempt to screen out unwanted candidates. I thought it was silly. I thought, if anything, they should have presented them with an open-ended one. It may have been more helpful.

Does he get frustrated with his work and get anxiety over it? Does he get stressed out about it and shut down?

When I find things too stressful and it's going to make me meltdown or shut down, I always find the easy way out even if it means having my husband do it for me. I do feel I am being lazy most of the time but hey I have a disability. Are crippled people not being a hard worker if they don't push themselves to keep on walking without using a wheelchair and not having people help them walk? I heard if a girl who preferred to use a wheelchair instead of using a walker because it was too much effort for her to do it so using a wheelchair was easier for her and less work. She had spina befida.


But if it weren't for support from my parents and husband, my life would have been a lot harder and I would have more shut downs and have more anxiety and when I get anxiety, I shut down and run from it. Anxiety is hell, meltdowns are hell.


if I read your post right, it sounds like your son can handle the work off and on and there comes times when he can't do it so he needs a crutch. Just like how my husband needs his wheelchair as his crutch when his feet are hurting too much. He has lot of days he can walk around the house fine with sore feet but he has times when he is in a wheelchair.

Why can't you process most of this? May I have constructive feedback if you do not mind? It would help me to improve my thinking and my communication towards others.




What is the program all about?



What do you mean by socially perfect?



Are you expecting an answer or is this a rhetorical question? How does one answer this question? How do I give an answer without my own biases being involved? Part of what makes me is my thoughts, personality, my genetics and my experiences? In order for me to give you this information in a truthful, unbiased, and accurate form I would have to experience being outside of myself? I would have to go outside of my own I'ness and what makes me me in order to give you an untarnished and objective version. Issac Asimov wrote a short story called "The Last Question." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Question

Like all of the iterations of what the computer said "There is not an enough information to give you a meaningful."

Let's say my identity is the set I. How can I use my own subset to accurately describe my own subset? You're asking me to use myself to determine myself. How do I do that without contradicting myself? How do I know what is truthfully complete about myself without contradictions forming?

In order to do that, I would have to be me which is not me and experience not being me. After that, I would have to return to being me to give a more accurate representation of how I see myself. So, how does one answer this question? I don't understand and I am ignorant as to what my true self is. Will you please explain further?



Can you explain the program in further depth?

I can empathize with you on the feelings you have. You're right, anxiety is hell and meltdowns are hell. For me, I overthink. It is crippling as well and it can be difficult for me to get things done because I have to regurgitate all of these thoughts out. I think in a very systematic way and algorithmic way.

I have problems when steps in a process are skipped and I don't know how we arrived at the last step. I become anxious and freak out. My wife is the type who does not want to read the instructions when putting things together. I do. She sees things more in a holistic manner. I am more sequential. I do not and I don't know how to see things in her way. She does things in a A-B-D-A-B-C type manner. I don't think like this. I don't know how to even conceive and think this way. I think in an A-B-C-D manner. When she is telling me something she always starts in the middle of a topic without giving me a background to what is going on. She'll start off with C without telling me A and B.

I ask her questions and I expect accurate answers and when I don't I freak out. I base what I need to do and formulate my solutions on accurate information. If the information is inaccurate or contradictory I don't know what to do. If the input given to me is garbage the output I produce will be garbage as well. I love her a lot and have learned not to make a fuss. I am getting better at not freaking out.

Is your husband like this? How do you effectively deal with it?