Autistic boy's arm flapping and wiggling fingers

Page 1 of 1 [ 9 posts ] 

heman
Emu Egg
Emu Egg

Joined: 27 Mar 2016
Age: 50
Gender: Male
Posts: 3

28 Mar 2016, 5:58 am

Hi,
My son (12 years) is struggling with hand/arm flapping and wiggling fingers in front of his face. He is having this symptoms close to a year.

Recently he is more aggressive on wiggling fingers in front of the face and arm flapping.

What should I do? Where to start from?

thanks
Govar



eikonabridge
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Sep 2014
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 929

28 Mar 2016, 9:50 am

heman wrote:
My son (12 years) is struggling with hand/arm flapping and wiggling fingers in front of his face. He is having this symptoms close to a year.


As long as he is harming no one (including self) and not causing disturbance, I believe that in the USA it falls under freedom of expression and is protected by the constitution of the country.

He is a child. The only issue I see is underdevelopment: he is behaving like a child, and that's about it. Children are entitled to behave like children. If grown ups are still behaving like children, that is called underdevelopment. That being said, underdevelopment is not necessarily a consequence of autism. Underdevelopment comes from neglect: neglect from parents and educators. And the neglect comes from a lack of understanding about autistic children.

Let me ask you one very simple question: what have you been teaching your son when he is stimming (flapping hands and wiggling fingers)? What have you been doing in these 12 years of your son's life? Did you just stand there and did nothing, except philosophizing about his stimming behavior? When parents philosophize, recession happens. It's just that in this case, the recession happens with the development of their children.

Stimming behavior (as long as not harmful) is your son's way of telling you: "This is the door to my world, please come on in." STIMMING TIME IS LEARNING TIME. Stimming time is the moment of maximum attention of these children. If you don't teach them skills at those moments, when are you going to teach them?

Teach him to read, to write, to sing, to play games or do physical activities, to solve math equations, etc. etc. These children have plenty of things to learn. Mix work (learning) with play. He can always go back to his stimming, he is entitled to. But, let him do one short activity (e.g. reading a sentence) before he is allowed to go back to his stimming.

I meet with autistic children from time to time. When they jump, I jump. When they spin, I spin. I never felt an iota of embarrassment. I don't mind people staring at me. Hey, it's my freedom of expression, as an autistic person myself. If I ever meet your son, guess what? I am gonna flap my arms and wiggle my fingers, together with him. And that will be fun. But more than that, I am going to teach him about electronic circuits and computer programming. I just found out about Raspberry Pi. Guess what? You can make it into an Amazon Echo, and you'll have a voice-activated digital assistant at home. Yeap, that'll be a fun project for your son.


_________________
Jason Lu
http://www.eikonabridge.com/


League_Girl
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 4 Feb 2010
Gender: Female
Posts: 27,280
Location: Pacific Northwest

28 Mar 2016, 11:06 am

heman wrote:
Hi,
My son (12 years) is struggling with hand/arm flapping and wiggling fingers in front of his face. He is having this symptoms close to a year.

Recently he is more aggressive on wiggling fingers in front of the face and arm flapping.

What should I do? Where to start from?

thanks
Govar



12 is at the age for puberty. You say he has been doing it more so that could mean he may be dealing with more anxiety and the hormones change so it's not uncommon for kids on the spectrum to be more autistic in puberty. Some even get aggressive. Some get more tactile defensive and your son is doing more self stimulation.

Find out why he is doing it, find out what you can do to make feel more calmer so he would do it less. Talk to his therapist about it if he is seeing one.


_________________
Son: Diagnosed w/anxiety and ADHD. Also academic delayed and ASD lv 1.

Daughter: NT, no diagnoses. Possibly OCD. Is very private about herself.


Ettina
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 Jan 2011
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 3,971

28 Mar 2016, 9:46 pm

heman wrote:
Hi,
My son (12 years) is struggling with hand/arm flapping and wiggling fingers in front of his face. He is having this symptoms close to a year.

Recently he is more aggressive on wiggling fingers in front of the face and arm flapping.


What do you mean by struggling? I do the same thing, I don't think it's automatically a problem. Is it actually causing problems, or does it just look weird?

Regarding him being more 'aggressive', what do you mean? Is he resisting attempts to stop him from doing this behavior? If so, that suggests that it's fulfilling some kind of need for him.



angelbear
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Gender: Female
Posts: 1,219

30 Mar 2016, 8:35 pm

My son is 10.5 and has been flapping his hands since he was 1. I don't think there is anything you can do to make it stop. He will stop it only if he wants to. I agree with the other posters, it is not hurting anyone. However, it can be extremely distracting to other people especially in a classroom setting. We have tried to work with my son on it, and so have his teachers and therapists. He does not care what other people think of him at this point, so he continues to do it. Some therapists have told me it is his way of self-regulating. We don't try to stop him as much at home, but we do ask him to try and control it when we go to places like church or to restaurants and stores. Most of the time, he can control it for short periods of time. Also, it might be helpful to find a replacement behavior that he can do when it is getting to be too much. Good luck.



eikonabridge
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Sep 2014
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 929

02 Apr 2016, 9:09 am

angelbear wrote:
Also, it might be helpful to find a replacement behavior that he can do when it is getting to be too much.


That's one of the problems with our current approach to autism. We think the children are sick, we think they need "redirection," "replacement." Basically, we treat them like circus animals, subjectable to our whims on behavioral correction. We don't treat them as equals. We don't treat them as equal-rights fellow human beings. We think we are smarter than they are. We think we are entitled to tell them what to do.

How's that approach been working out in these 70+ years since the formal discovery of child autism?

Total failure. Yet, we keep giving out the same failed advice, to millions of families with autistic children. (Not referring to you, but to ABA specialists in general.) Tell me, who are sick here?

-----

These children need no behavioral correction. What they need is skill development. For focusing too much on their behaviors, we neglect to develop their skills.

I've described plenty of times how I deal with my children's meltdowns. I don't tell them what to do. I don't attempt to change their behavior, at all. I simply talk to them. I draw pictures. My basic message to them is simple: "life sometimes is tough/stressful, some some other times is nice/fun." That's all. I connect their bad moments to their good moments, and vice-versa. When I took out my daughter to an ice cream treat, when she was having fun eating her ice cream, that was the moment I pulled out my smartphone and drew picture of her getting upset in her school party, when she was playing bingo and not winning the game. The next time she was having a fit because I made a silly joke with her, I then could bring up the ice cream treat (and her recent pony ride at her friend's birthday), and remind her that life sometimes is bad, but some other times is good. That's all. Tantrums gone, right away. For my son, I still take him to elevator rides in shopping plazas. When he was having fun in between elevator rides, I sat down with him, drew pictures on my smartphone, reminded him of his bad moments at home. Next time bad moments happen, I would remind him about the fun time he had at the elevators.

Where in my approach have I tried to "redirect" their behavior? Where in my approach have I told them what to do?

My position has always been: my children are smarter than I am. I'd better treat them with respect. All I do is simply talking to them, as an equal. I draw pictures for them, talk to them. That's all I do. And guess what? Miraculously tantrums stop. Not only that, they acquire an important skill: how to look at the positive side of life.

I write all these things in the forum, so my children can read about my writings, when they grow up. If you are writing things that you hope your children will never read about, then I'd say you are doing something wrong. My daughter is 8 years old, and I've already written a letter to her (on her birthday), explaining to her about autism and explaining to her about her being autistic. On her next birthday, when she turns 9 years old, she will have permission to read WrongPlanet.

I can do all that, because I have treated my children with respect, as equal-rights fellow human beings, since the days they were born.

-----

Similarly, stimming behaviors have never been the issue. My view is: skill development trumps behavioral correction. If Bill Gates were to flap his arms and wiggle his fingers, he would still be Bill Gates. We don't worry about developing our children intellectually into Bill Gates, and all we worry is about our children flapping their arms and wiggling their fingers?

Stimming time is learning time. We don't teach our children at their moment of stimming, and we then later complain that it's impossible to teach them because they don't pay attention.

That's how smart, happy children turn into seclusive, underdeveloped damaged goods.

-----

Are the parents of autistic children victims? Or perpetrators?

For viewing our children as sick and intellectually disabled, we have forgotten to look at ourselves in the mirror, and see how sick and intellectually disabled we have been, in all these 70+ years.


_________________
Jason Lu
http://www.eikonabridge.com/


fastfission
Emu Egg
Emu Egg

Joined: 6 Apr 2016
Gender: Male
Posts: 1
Location: London,uk

06 Apr 2016, 6:52 pm

Thanks for that Jason. This is my first post. Just found this forum, this thread, your post, read your site, bought your book. Have a hyperactive preschooler on the spectrum, suspected ASD diagnosis, pro visual, non verbal (except for speaking his own language that only he understands!), sharp as a tack with a long memory and humungous generosity of spirit. Had no idea we should be expecting him to read before speaking, now makes complete sense. Getting him to understand the stick images and moving from pro video to pro picture seems the next step. Look forward to reading your book!



eikonabridge
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Sep 2014
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 929

07 Apr 2016, 10:36 am

fastfission wrote:
Thanks for that Jason. This is my first post. Just found this forum, this thread, your post, read your site, bought your book. Have a hyperactive preschooler on the spectrum, suspected ASD diagnosis, pro visual, non verbal (except for speaking his own language that only he understands!), sharp as a tack with a long memory and humungous generosity of spirit. Had no idea we should be expecting him to read before speaking, now makes complete sense. Getting him to understand the stick images and moving from pro video to pro picture seems the next step. Look forward to reading your book!


Good heavens, there is no need to buy the book. Information is free in this world. My postings on WrongPlanet have more updated information and insight. The book is only for me to establish my "credentials" in autism, so I can talk with some "authority." I am very busy at work, and I don't have time to update my website or the book.

Nowadays I am recommending starting with alphabet around 9~12 months old, and be able to read books around 18 months old. It saves a lot of troubles later. Sounds crazy, but really doable (for pro-picture children.) For hyperactive type (pro-video), unfortunately the only route to go is to teach them to focus on stick figures by making a metamorphosis video for them first. And then, it'll be easier to teach them to read. Still, both of my children learned to read before they learned to talk. Their brains are not damaged. There is really no need to teach them to verbalize or to socialize. Those things come later, for free, as long as their brains are developed in the visual-manual direction.

Later this month I will be giving a presentation at Teacher's College, Columbia University, New York. Hopefully I'll find time to turn that presentation into a video clip. Autism is not my job. I just don't have a lot of time left, after my work and raising my own children. It's just that I get "pissed" at the progress in Autism research, it seems like it will take another 30 or 40 years for paid researchers to catch up with me.

Making videos on a tablet (or even smartphone) is a snap nowadays. My children are grown up so I don't make videos as often. (Check my YouTube channel for video ideas.) Apps you need are

On iPad/iPhone platform:
- for image editing: Autodesk's Sketchbook (free version works perfectly fine.)
- for video editing: please spend $5.95 and get the Cute Cut Pro video editing software.

On Android platform:
- for image editing: Autodesk's Sketchbook (free version)
- for video editing: VideoShow (free version OK)

After you have some experience doing image and video editing, you may want to check out GIMP (image editor, free) and buy some commercial video editing software (I personally use Pinnacle Studio Ultimate, but there are just too many other choices.) These two tools are more advanced, and allows you to do magic. They are much harder to use, though.

Do read my posting about "Yogurt is Yummy, Because it has Honey." That's the most important piece of information you need.
https://wrongplanet.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=293342

Somehow the videos don't seem to work after a while. Here are the relevant video clips from that message.
https://youtu.be/EvZ1KeG2UvQ

https://youtu.be/IXAJAerJV4o

https://youtu.be/QA4jof1if3o

https://youtu.be/Lime3GgYdwQ

https://youtu.be/L5m7yThb4W4

https://youtu.be/AYdqoatKhVI

https://youtu.be/oXIXUA79vTo

https://youtu.be/PkBavblOoHI


_________________
Jason Lu
http://www.eikonabridge.com/


Kuraudo777
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 20 Sep 2015
Posts: 14,743
Location: Seventh Heaven

14 Apr 2016, 6:20 pm

Well, I guess I'm underdeveloped, because I act like a child most of the time. :D :roll:


_________________
Quote:
A memory is something that has to be consciously recalled, right? That's why sometimes it can be mistaken and a different thing. But it's different from a memory locked deep within your heart. Words aren't the only way to tell someone how you feel.” Tifa Lockheart, Final Fantasy VII