Failing in setting rules for my teenage Aspie-I'm desperate

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Hello,
my son of 14 y.o has Asperger's. He showed pretty obvious signs of it quite early, but we didn't know Asperger's even existed back then. I became aware only few years ago, since that I try to research and look for possible best solutions. There are periods when he is not showing too many signs of AS, then sometimes there are times when he is tence, nervous and the way he acts is like taken from some book, describing Asperger's. There are better and worse times, sometimes I feel hopeful, sometimes down and failed, but life goes on this way or another.
But last weeks I feel completely stuck.

He likes computers and if he could choose, he'd live in the internet. Every little thing that in his opinion doesn't make sense, makes him annoyed or angry. To make his life simpler, I talked with him about the rules/schedule and wrote as much, as I could, down, so there would be less "surprises".

As it's summer vacation now, we have an agreement, that he can spend time on the internet from 10am to 9pm, during that time he must have two breaks (3 hours total), during which he is mostly watching tv or (if I insist) read a little. I am asking him to go for a walk for 45 minutes every day. Once a week he has to clean up the room and also I said I will teach him some simple cooking one time a week (motorically he is very weak). He may have few more duties here and there, but it's pretty much all.

But it is still too much for him. I try to let him know of any changes in advance, but on anything, that interrupts him doing things he likes, he gets angry. He tells me he wishes I'd die, offences me in a rude words; his grandparents are very caring and they are very calm and loving, but he is rude to them, too. He hates my mom. He can't stand his little brother. Most of the time he speaks in an annoyed and angry tone.

That would be so easy to let him stay all day on the internet, but I am concerned what would that do to his health. Before we had an agreement that he has to go for a walk 3 times a week, but I changed the rule, telling him it is summer, the weather is nice and considering how many hours he spends sitting in one position and staring at the screen, every day less than a hour of fresh air is not much at all. For me. But not for him. He keeps repeating for two weeks already, that we had a different rule and how come I changed it.

The only thing I can keep him under control, is getting him banned from the computer. But is there any peaceful way to reach understanding and agreement? I don't feel this is right to only use authority to make him things he has to.

I don't know what to do with his offenses towards me. I have learned not to take those ugly words personally, but I can't allow him to speak with me in this way, can I? I am afraid that if I do so, things will get worse and worse, having no rules or frames at all.

He literally never sees his fault. Never. Blaming everyone around in fights, conflicts and him, having computer ban, he just doesn't take responsibility and I think that sometimes he honestly can not see that his behavior may cause consequences.

He seems not to be able to accept the fact that sometimes things change, agreements change - if it makes his situation worse (like going for a walk 6 times instead of 3 per week), he can go on and on, screaming and offending everyone around. When I try to explain, he wouldn't listen, only humiliating me even more. There are only few things that make him feel good (mostly for a short moment) - getting things he wants or money.

Once he confessed to me, that when we are arguing, for him it's like a battle, so he can't let me "win". I tried to explain him, that I am not trying to win him and things I do and ask - it's because I love him and wish him best, that one day he has to live on his own and he has to learn at least basic things to manage his life.

I try understand and imagine, what is going on inside him and how he sees things so differently and that sometimes little things for me have great importance for him. Just how to achieve agreement and respect, how to explain my son that there are things in life we just have to do even if we don't want to and that world lives by "neurotypical" rules? What am I doing wrong?

There are bright moments, too. There have been positive movements and changes during past few years.
For example, the newest change is, that during pauses from computer, he started having conversations with me and seems to be sincerely interested. He comes to me, talks about things he heard or read, asks on my opinion etc. Sometimes he is nice and funny with his little brother. He keeps an eye connection; and he loves our dog and likes to pat her and play with her (I guess he doesn't show that much affection towards anyone else in our family). Sometimes he asks me to come and sit next to him and have a chat before he gets asleep - the things he hasn't done for years until now. Sometimes he tells me (at a better times) that I am the one from the whole family who he "hates the least" or who annoys him the least.

But last weeks things are getting more and more sharp. Puberty and Asperger's seems to be an explosive mix. And sometimes I don't know where goes line between Asperger's (and the fact that I have to just accept some things about him) and teenager tantrums (that I have to set frames for).

I am asking for your help, I feel helpless.

I don't know that I will be much help, but I wanted to let you know that I understand both your son's perspective and yours.

I was the same as him, with regards to using a computer. I still am. I struggle immensely with being away from the computer for any period of time.

Honestly, it didn't do me any harm as a child to be on the computer constantly. There was nothing that I was missing out on, in my opinion. But, I'm aware that you're focusing on health. And, as a parent myself now, I totally understand that. I want my child to have a health, active, social, out-and-about lifestyle, and I've had to force myself to change for her. If it weren't for her being around, undoubtedly I would still spend most of my time using the computer. At home, I still do (though it's carefully controlled to ensure that she doesn't miss out on anything and gets all of the attention she needs and deserves). But it is hard. Constantly hard. It will be even harder for him, I expect, because he's not motivated to do this for a child that he loves so strongly. You're just asking him to do it for him, against everything that he really wants to do. That doesn't make sense. That's like someone saying to you "You need to be thrown into the ocean, it's for your own good". It doesn't make sense to you - as far as you're concerned you're happy how you are and don't want to be in the ocean - in fact, being thrown in the ocean could hurt you! - so someone telling you that going into the ocean is something that's good FOR YOU is going to be incredibly confusing.

I am not saying that this is a reasonable solution from your point of view. Maybe it's giving in too much. But, from a similar point of view to your son's, would a smartphone be the answer? If he goes on a walk, he can then continue to use the internet but he has the health benefits as well. There are even 'games' for smartphones that reward you for being active, so he could be motivated by achievements and goals. I believe there's one called 'Zombies, Run!'.

Like I say, I fully appreciate that from your perspective you don't want him to be using the computer constantly and you're trying to motivate him to do other things. But from your son's perspective, it doesn't make sense and being away from the computer might feel genuinely stressful and painful. Compromise might be the best you've got at this stage.

As time goes on and he finds more genuine reasons to be away from his computer, beyond just 'it's what we NTs do', he'll find stronger motivation. It will still be hard for him, but he will manage, I believe.

This sounds so normal. 14 year olds are snarly just alone. Adding in aspergers just makes things harder to handle. But frankly, if you could take the autism out of the kid, you'd probably still be driven to tears with him. The difference might be that a NT kid would be into his friends instead of the computer.

All those hormones! Its so hard to deal with. And he is getting surges of testosterone, which are specifically telling his brain to go dominate something. And because its new to him, he doesn't have the skills to deal with those surges.

That being said, its not healthy to spend all day, every day on the computer. Its a hard one, because you already set up with him the expectation that he can do so. But really, he should be spending some time every day being in the world. If he doesn't, he's going to start developing the kind of chronic pain that 40 year olds normally get. So, I think you are right on with teaching him that he has to engage with the real world for a certain amount of time.

I would also be concerned that he is exposing his brain to too much violent and/or porn imagery. Its hard with we autistics, because this stuff is totally normal. If you think your teen isn't getting into this stuff, you're kidding yourself. But many of us have these hyper-reactive brain types that will plug into intense imagery with much greater intensity than a NT kid. I really think that this leaves us way more vulnerable to the anxiety, depression, and sexual dysfunction that can happen if anyone is exposed to too much of this stuff online. Part of growing up for me has been learning that I need to keep myself from seeing too much of that. (A little is OK.)

You can't just pull the rug out from the kid, so I'm not suggesting you do so. But next summer, your family really needs to be thinking about camps (there are computer camps!) or a summer job - something to get him away from the family for at least a few hours a day! Any teen would be annoyed with their family if they had no other way to establish their independence. Teens need to start seeing themselves as separate from the family. Its a healthy thing. But if he's sitting at home on the computer all day, he's got no opportunity to do so.

Is there any way for you to access some help from a mentor or something for him? There's a program in my state that matches vulnerable teens with young men who share their interests. Its done a world of good for one teen guy I know. Its given him an outlet to work out all those completely normal feeling about his family.

Or maybe look into a computer camp for this year? Somewhere that would love that he's on the spectrum? Robot camp? There's nothing wrong with loving computers, loving to be online, or hyperfocusing on stuff. But if we don't learn to engage with the world while we're doing it, we get depressed. We think we'd like to do nothing but stay on the computer, but our brains need our bodies to be moving more than that.

In the mean time, I would turn off the internet for an hour every time he cusses at family members. I wouldn't even engage with him about it. I would just silently turn that modem off. Let him know before hand that's what you are going to do. And talk to him about it LATER if you have to do so, as he will not be able to process with you while he's angry. And if that doesn't work in today's complicated world, I would turn off the electricity. But I'm a bit of a hard-ass. I used to work with teens who have emotional problems as a teacher. So, I had the really hard cases. Also - make sure that its ONLY one hour (or what ever you decide on as a family.) Don't let the punishment grow bigger and bigger. Don't add time once you turn it off. Doing so just builds a despair and a sense that he doesn't have anything left to work for. One hour, in my opinion, is enough to get the point across without him being left with no outlet for too long. If he's really emotionally immature and/or impulsive, you can cut that down to 15 minutes.

^ Good call. I didn't even catch that. Get the diagnosis. Really important.

Hi again!
Thank you all for your replies.

ArielsSong - I appreciate you shared your experience and thoughts. I liked the example with throwing him in the ocean, it made me see what my son may be experiencing from one more side.

HisShadowX - My son has a diagnosis put by a psychiatrist (who, I guess, fortunately, is not keen on putting kids immediatelly on drugs - he didn't even mention it). But, looking back, even in an early years my son had so many signs of AS, that, if I had any information about Asperger's, I would have known myself - a long list of little details, so many special ways of behavior and those teachers - in kindergarten, at school, everyone and everywhere, telling me that I have to do something with my son's bad manners, while, as I later learned, was whatever else, but not what they claimed it to be.

When I said I was researching, I meant reading books, looking for information and educating myself, which I am still doing; learning on how to react or how to solve problems, how to make childs being comfortable (e.g routine and no unexpected changes of plans etc). It's a new journey for me, too.


somanyspoons - Thank you for so many good thoughts. I don't think he's much into porn (if at all, then he has not so many chances to watch it, as most of the time someone is at home and the door of his room is always open), but as for violence, it makes me worried, too - he likes computer games (war/shooting like CSGO etc). Yet not so long time ago he spent more time rather learning, making videos for youtube and programming, but it seems to me, that the ammount of time he spends on playing games, has increased. I am still figuring out, how could I control that. Recently we had discussion about using Time Resque, so we could see the statistics of how much time he spends on what activities, he didn't seem to be too against it.

Computer camp would be great, but in our small country and yet smaller town, we don't have anything like this. I've been trying to find him someone, who would teach him computer programming (he was interested in that), but all I got was some basic level courses and my son, learning on his own, is quite advanced already. There are some options of a private teacher, but I can't afford that.

As for insulting family members, I will consider switching internet off for some fixed time. I think that might work.
Ohh yes, he is going to be upset about that... If he thinks that someone is unfair to him, he can go on about that for days and even weeks. His reaction is very sharp, when someone does something to him, he thinks was wrong; but is blind to notice when he is unjust to others (I still hope, that maybe he understands that deep inside, but, being a teenager, can't overcome himself and admit his mistakes).

Yesterday, when I came home from work, we continued from where we finished - "it is unbelievable, it's above his understanding, how on Earth could I increase the time he has to spend outside, twice!! ! From 3 times to 6 - it's not normal" - that's pretty much all of the conversation, that he repeated again and again, being so frustrated, like it was 60 and not 6. I felt like running against the wall. Not a single reason or explanation made sense to him.

At the same time I can't say he doesn't understand that he spends more than enough time in pc. Because when I suggested that we visit a family doctor and ask her opinion on how much maximum time he could spend on the internet and how many hours he should spend outside, he refused, saying that doc will tell him about the internet addiction and give the minimum anyway, there is no point etc (followed with cursing and irritation). But it feels that we are moving to making up this time again. He takes changes very dramatically, but maybe he will accept these 6 walks, he just needs some more time to get used to the idea.

He is going to start therapy at clinical psychologysts' in Autumn, first reason was to help him get rid of his phobia, but I also hope to get help and a good advice from there considering whole situation.

^ The kid is probably right about the doctor. I think the last recommendation for total screen time per day for teens is something like two hours. Which, to be honest, never happens. I think the average is like 4.

And yes. You are totally right that 14 year olds have little ability to see into their own behavior. That thing with justice and getting so worked up about things being fair is totally an aspie thing. I've struggled with that my whole life. Its the reason I had few friends as a kid. I kept trying to make their games "fair." And the other kids didn't want fair, their wanted to let some kids get away with things and not other kids. It still makes no sense to me.

I think living in the country is hard on teens everywhere, for just the reason you gave. Its harder to explore different niches in life when there's not a lot going on in town.

I will say from your son's point of view, doubling the outside time requirement from 3 to 6 is going to look like a punishment.

If you do not have a foundation of trust where he understands that your rules are always for a good reason and not arbitrary, a teen under the influence of puberty with the corresponding hormonal changes is going to interpret that as a power trip.

If you gave no notice and it looked like you pulled the rule out of thin air, that makes it even worse.

I never had minimum outside time as a kid, but my parents would sometimes send us outside b/c my sibling and I were bickering or whatever and they thought it was healthier and better to be outside. I hated it on principle. I would sit on the front porch and do nothing but sulk. If they tried to make me walk for a certain amount of time, i think I would have lost it.

With my son, I would love for him to spend more time outside (as a parent I get where you are coming from even if as a kid it bothered me) but I never make requirements. I make suggestions and also agreements with him based on health trade offs. If he wants a treat that is not so healthy I might ask him to balance it out health-wise by exercising. My son is younger than yours, so I don't know if it could work in the same way for a teen.

For sure, when tempers are not flaring, I would have a talk with him about what is healthy and why you care about his health. If he trusts you are looking out for his best interests, it might help to persuade him you are not just trying to be a buzzkill. Although with aspies they suggest social stories and the like, I would instead go and find information on the Internet from bona fide medical sources to show him what is healthy for a young person his age.

This way he knows you are not making this stuff up, and again to reinforce that you are looking out for him. I have tried social stories for similar things and I notice my son really does prefer real sources so he can see there is real science behind what I am saying.

In addition, you are going to have to explain why 6x during nice weather is necessary when only 3x is fine in colder weather. I think you will have trouble explaining your logic there b/c if you have not been expecting inside exercise during poor weather to compensate for the lower amount of outside exercise, he will know you will not think 6x is really necessary all the time.

Internal logic and consistency is really important to aspies. He is not going to look at the extra 3x as a great opportunity to take advantage of fresh air if he does not value fresh air in the first place. He is going to be looking for a minimum necessary amount vs. added opportunities unless you can get him to enjoy the outside. That is where the prior suggestions from other posters might work; but if you approach it as a mandate as opposed to persuasion, it will continue to cause resentment and perseveration.

If he perceives your current relationship as primarily adversarial it will be harder to get him to understand you are looking out for him. You may need to invest more in establishing trust as hard as that may be at his age.

Let me flip this on its head for a moment; Does your son have friends, associates, etc?

Keep in mind this; while to a average kid, 3-6 hours outside is 'normal'. It's not to someone who'se autisitc, particularly lower functioning. You don't have many positive interactions with other kids; it's mostly them scoffing, laughing, and teasing at your kid. I know this because I lived it when I was a child, as I'm sure many of the other adult aspies here will tell you.

Ironically, I guess everything worked out for me socially even though I withdrew socially as a child, but this was mostly because I didin't have anyone to take care of me but myself; my father was(still is) a raging alcoholic bi-polar with a drug problem, and my mother worked 6am to 7pm to sustain the family. I'm still more of a father to my younger brothers (one is low-functioning autistic, 14-15 and has the same computer problem as your son) than my father was, so I can't speak much as to upbringing honestly.

But, I'd like to make a few points:

-If your son has social problems (assuming he does) and little or no friends, all you're doing by kicking him outside of X hours of the day is rubbing it in his face. This is why he's throwing a fit about it, even though he won't admit it. It's not fun to play outside if you have no one to play with, and it's also not fun to admit it. I know TV doctors will scream to get your kids outside for X time a day, but if all you're doing is furthering their social anxiety and fear index (There's probably a formal name for this, but basically whenever you get picked on for so long, you automatically assume anyone you talk with is going to talk down to and pick on you, obviously further damaging your social skills and making you fear general social conversation) there's no point to it. Maybe have him go on a walk a day, but go with him yourself to show you're with him for it and you're helping him out.

-Encourage him to do other in-home activities that aren't on the computer. Cooking, reading, watching TV all works. I'd also try to find him a hobby he can do by himself or with a family member. I made/flew model airplanes with my grandfather when I was a kid and it was a awesome way to pass the time when you're socially inept as a child.

-Find something like a church youth group. These are designed to be all inclusive and helpful, as well as getting your kid outside at least one day a week, as well as quite possibly making him a few friends. If he's anything like I was, he won't want to go then he'll have a blast once he's there. My youth group counselor knowing me and my quirks when I was a child actually hooked him up with my sister (I'm 19, she's 26, my two younger brothers are 14-15). He's now my brother in law and I'm a counselor at said youth group lol, funny how things work out. Maybe go with him a few times to said youth group, see if he makes any friends.

-If he makes one or a few friends, this is where you need to start pushing him. Get him to spend more time with them, eventually sleep overs, etc. I only needed a few friends growing up to turn me from someone completely withdrawn from society to being about as open socially as someone with the disorder can get. Don't panic about his quirks around other parents if he's highly functioning. I know I had a reputation as the nicest kid on the block because of my anxiety; i always addressed everyone as 'sir' or 'ma'am' and kept myself out of trouble due to it, my mom actually told me how other parents would ask her how she was raising me so well lol. But ultimately that's a individual thing. If your son is 14, you should already know by now if you think he's going to be able to make it on his own as a "productive member of society" as the Gov't would coin it or whether he's permanently disabled. I know people on this forum like to dance around the term - and I don't blame them, but as he's now only 4 years away from being a 'adult' per the government, that's something you seriously need to consider if you haven't already. You know him more than any of us.


-IF he must be on the computer. Try to find ways to get him to do something productive. You actually can learn some pretty valuable skills. I taught myself coding PHP/HTML/basic systems administration throughout high school. These have limited use to me now since I decided to go into emergency medicine (Not first choice you'd imagine a aspie taking but I enjoy it) as my career field, but it's still a nice skillset to have in today's technology based society. Try to get him into building and creating things over just playing games 8 hours a day, but, again, whether you want to gear him towards 'life skills' or work-related skills is up to you as a individual thing; whether you believe he's highly functioning enough to be able to maintain work or not.

1- I agree with everyone that typical 14-year-olds can also be pretty obnoxious.
2- I think he needs to get out of the house sometimes. Lounging around on the internet or watching TV might seem like natural choices of activities if he has nothing else to do. Other people mentioned getting a job or a camp/club. I'd also add possibly volunteering since the only problem with part-time jobs is that from my experience as a motorically-challenged teen on the spectrum is that the bosses for those kinds of jobs tend to be very impatient with all of the extra guidance necessary + a lot of the tasks for that (preparing and serving food, cleaning, carrying things) tend to be very physical. I've heard that some areas have job placement programs for individuals with disabilities, but I don't have too much experience with them. Still all three of these options would be great resume items and give him some more structure in the summer. So maybe sit down with him and talk about which of those options he'd like to do and then start searching for things (maybe a computer club or volunteering with an animal shelter or library). But yeah, a club or volunteering might be easier to start with since it's lower stakes. You could also pick a possible goal job (lawn mowing, food service, cleaning cars) and then do some "job training" during the day to practice the skills involved. He'll probably grumble about having to do anything, but kids do like to buy things.
3- Yeah, I agree with the others about not letting him get away with swearing at people.

Also, if fitness is a concern why not include him in your method(s) for staying in shape (do you go to a gym or use workout videos?). That way it is less like a punishment and more like you are working on it together. Walking outside may just not be very interesting for him. If it's more like a task to complete ("I need to do the bike 25 minutes then lift weights for another half hour"), it might be easier for him to include in his schedule than a 'fun' thing that isn't really fun. It would be a better work out too. You could always explain the purposes of fitness too (be healthier- put less pressure on your joints & avoid diabetes, easier to find clothes, make it easier to complete certain tasks like climbing stairs, make yourself more attractive to other people).