Autistic tendancies in 4 year old?

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My teenage eldest son has recently diagnosed Aspergers, or an Asperger like condition depending on which doctor we are with,and I am worried about my 4 year old daughter. She seems quite sociable at nursery although is a little shy.However she is not good with change. She still won't drink out of a regular cup and insists on her sippy cup. She had major problems about using the rest room when when are out and has only just become ok about that . She has problems with labels and doesn't like any clothes which are fluffy.
She hasn't been invited round to other kids' houses to play, although when I invite kids round she seems to play happily with them.
Now most of these issues I would have not been bothered with previously. I know that kids develop at different times and kids can be weird full stop. However, since my older kid's diagnoses I am worried.
He also was absolutely fine at nursery and junior school. His problems only emerged on adolescence. When I look back though I can see that there were little signs. He was slow to do certain motor skills. He was a difficult and slightly hyper child but he did play with the other kids. He had no sensory issues and he was happy and very successful at school. Not so now though. He is not depressed and out of school. When he was younger I thought that he had ADHD but the doctor told me that he did not and made out that I was just worrying because he was my first child.

I know that ASD can be genetic and I am aware of others in the family who may have undiagnosed Aspergers.
Should I get my daughter checked out now or am I just worrying because of my son's diagnosis

I would look into it now with her. As with your son, I am sure you see that if things are only investigated when things get out of control, it has less then favourable results.

She may not have it, more of a shadow syndrome, which means she has Aspie traits without actually having them cause a marked impairment. Still though, I think it is best to fully investigate as it will alter the way that you raise her, how you respond to things, how you handle her. Also with the school, the earlier you have a DX, (If she has AS) the easier it is to get the right accomidations in place before things get out of hand if or when they start to go south.

I would encourage the play dates, I have a feeling at four though, that a lot of parents just are not that "into them" to bother hosting. I know with my son I did a lot of one sided play dates, it was a total pain, but very valuable for him socially!

she does seem to have some traits-especially with the sensory (the tags). How is her eye contact? With my son he really started showing the AS stuff between the ages of 3-5. Before that it was mostly all sensory stuff that we stupidly thought he would outgrow (which his OT then said) and motor problems. But as he got older the social problems came out and the poor eye contact, and then the OBSESSIONS! Keep a close watch on her and depending on where you live, the school system can evaluate her for free. If you feel even a little bit get it checked out! the sooner the better so she can get services before it is too late for a lot of things.

At this age play behaviors can be very important clues! Most kids with AS will have a fairly strong showing on the list below when looking at them from birth.

2) Does/did the child
a. Favor objects for play that aren’t typically used as toys by their peers (such as wheels, sticks, magnet letters, etc.)?
b. Seem fascinated or obsessed by objects/topics that aren’t typical for kids of their age (such as numbers, the alphabet, words, math, geography, mechanical things such as air conditioners or vacuum cleaners, things with motors, etc)?
c. Play “differently” with toys or household objects (such as spin them, line them up in straight lines, set them up in formations, etc.)?
d. Exhibit weak or unusual pretend play skills such as
-act out memorized scenes from books/films/TV/DVD instead of creating situations and dialogue
-move toy trains around but not pretend to be the engineer/
go places/pick up passengers
-arrange pretend people or action figures but not create imaginary situations with them or have them interact with each other, etc?
e. Display behaviors and/or routines that seem unusual or quirky?

My son used to "stack'" things, can's, food boxes, it was amazing the towers he would build at 4! He would just get it in his head to haul half the food in the kitchen to the living room make a tower and leave. It was remarkable, I am not sure I could have build 1/2 of them, he had such a good eye and instinctual understanding of balance.

I also noticed that he had a huge imagination, playing for hours with Thomas Trains or role playing Ghostbusters out side with his friends. He did not just push trains around without a dialog or purpose, and he was the leader or director of the role playing games with his friends. The thing is, what I did not realize at the time, is that very little was his own "game" most of it was reinacting what he saw on T.V. verbatim, or mixing it up a little, but I am sure for every idea he had, you could find a direct T.V. reference for it!

It sounds as though she may have AS or CAPD (Central Auditory Processing Disorder).

CAPD? It sounds like most of her issues are sensory with some social... I was DX'ed with CAPD back in the 80's. I have asked a ton of doctors about it now for my son, recognizing a lot of similar behaviors, and they have all told me that CAPD is a dinosaur DX, and is usually not used anymore, in favour of ADHD in most cases... Not sure I entirely agree with that!

[quote="EarthCallingMy son used to "stack'" things, can's, food boxes, it was amazing the towers he would build at 4! He would just get it in his head to haul half the food in the kitchen to the living room make a tower and leave. It was remarkable, I am not sure I could have build 1/2 of them, he had such a good eye and instinctual understanding of balance.

I also noticed that he had a huge imagination, playing for hours with Thomas Trains or role playing Ghostbusters out side with his friends. He did not just push trains around without a dialog or purpose, and he was the leader or director of the role playing games with his friends. The thing is, what I did not realize at the time, is that very little was his own "game" most of it was reinacting what he saw on T.V. verbatim, or mixing it up a little, but I am sure for every idea he had, you could find a direct T.V. reference for it![/quote]

It's very common to see the reinactments as being highly creative play without realizing that the source often came from tv or a book. I know mom who had a master's degree in early childhood who misinterpreted this in her own child.

okay, I have a somewhat related question,

Is it unusual play for children to take objects and use them as something else?? for example, and I am referring to my 3 year old who we are "observing" before going for our dx. He will LOTS of times take other things and pretend they are rocket ships---like he stacks up toy dishes (always the same ones) and pretends it is a rocket ship, or he stacks several legos together and pretends they are a rocket ship, and my favorite, he wants me to take the head off of those really cheap plastic toy snakes and he pretends the snake is a bullet train.

jaleb, I guess that's a perfectly normal thing for children to do. Since autistic children somtimes show a LACK of pretend-play in any form (not only in social play), this is nothing to worry about, more like the opposite. Kids simply have a lot of imagination.

thats what I always thought, I figured it was good that they did stuff like that, means they have a good imagination, but I have had some people tell me that it was an "autistic" characteristic, but I guess I don't really understand what "unusual" play refers to.

Someone told you it was unusual your kid takes toys and pretends they're something else? I can't imagine that. Legos would be pretty boring for kids if they didn't imagine what they COULD be, right? And that's for example a rocket ship.
I'm sure "unusual" play refers to something that NT children wouldn't do. Lining up objects, drawing on walls and furniture, hours of staring at the floor, intense interest in the point-group symmetries of the wallpaper and that sort of stuff. Speaking from experience there.

Last edited by Eller on 18 May 2007, 6:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

My 8 year old's assessment is in 9 days and what you just said describes him.

When he was 2 he used to spend hours lining up sticks and rocks and counting them. He's sit on the top of the slippery slide and slide the sticks down - 1, 2, 3. Then the rocks - 1, 2, 3. I'd have to pick them up and he would repeat this over and over for an hour before I'd drag him home.

He also loved playing with this little fireman that was about 10cm (4 inches) high. He'd throw it into the bush and then I'd retrive it. Repeat 200 times until I got sick of this game. He played this game for about 1 year.

He found a paintbrush and painted the wall with his pooh! For a while I was confused as to where he'd found a tin of brown paint!

my daughter had similiar issues with socialization and sensory issues..........she's 8 now, and has only recently become comfortable with using public restrooms ( the sound of the air dryers makes her scream and cover her ears). She was dx-ed with ADHD~hyperactive impulsive type in the Fall.............do I believe the dx? somewhat....she definitely has asperger-like qualities. I think that one of the hard things for the doc was trying to decide if she was mimicking my hubby's and son's behaviors ( learned behaviors) , or whether her behaviors ere within herself. I guess he decided that she was mimicking them ( she is the youngest by 7 years).
My son, also did not start to have major problems until he was 13~looking back I can see minor issues that we just wrote off as him being quirky and like his dad............my hubby ( his dad) and my son were dx-ed within 3 months of each other, btw.

[quote="SmelenaWhen he was 2 he used to spend hours lining up sticks and rocks and counting them. He's sit on the top of the slippery slide and slide the sticks down - 1, 2, 3. Then the rocks - 1, 2, 3. I'd have to pick them up and he would repeat this over and over for an hour before I'd drag him home.

He also loved playing with this little fireman that was about 10cm (4 inches) high. He'd throw it into the bush and then I'd retrive it. Repeat 200 times until I got sick of this game. He played this game for about 1 year.
[/quote]

By way of contrast when my NT son was a toddler and preschooler he was obsessed with firefighters, but he would pretend to be a firefighter and put out fires or set up scenes with his Playmobil firetruck stuff and have the people do rescues and put out fires. Same theme, but lots of variety.

Whenever he misplaced this little fireman it was a national disaster!

'Where's man gone!' x 1000 accompanies by screaming.

I don't think parents of NT's appreciate the difficulties of beloved toys going missing.

But we still have this 'man'