The co-morbids/co-occurring condition nonsense

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Daddy63
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13 Jun 2018, 10:23 am

It drives me nuts every time I read another article about this nonsense. How is it that the medical and scientific communities are spending so much money researching this stuff instead of going after real addressable root causes of specific diseases and simply how to better educate our fine children who often have no other major issue other then having a different learning style. Similarities in symptoms (correlation) is in no way an identification of root cause. These "experts" should have learned a long time ago that drinking water does not cause cancer just because everyone who gets cancer drinks water.

Here is the latest article by John Constantino and Zoe Hawks I read:

https://www.spectrumnews.org/opinion/vi ... ur-autism/

The medical community seems obsessed with this idea that people with Autism often seem to have some other "conditions" but what is Autism and how are they defining it? Autism is simply defined as a person who has difficulty in communication, language, social skills, and abstract concepts. It is diagnosed by looking for symptoms, not root causes. Children and adults who struggle to communicate in our society which demands verbal/social skills behave in similar ways and have similar struggles/behaviors which are then often diagnosed as Autism. All of those individuals who struggle in this way display similar symptoms and are diagnosed as having Autism even though the underlying cause may be any number of genetic or medical issues or, as in most causes, the individual may just be significantly different (diverse) compared to societal norms and have no real significant issue other than a need for a different educational process that caters to their similar strengths and learning styles.

Children with syndromes like Rett, Fragile X, Down, Angelman and on and on have a clear underlying genetic or other medical condition. Their medical condition causes intellectual challenges that impair their ability to learn to communicate to have their basic needs met and they then behave in similar ways (anger, frustration, stimming, no eye contact etc) and are diagnosed with Autism. The Autism is not a different additional medical issue. It is simply a group of symptoms cause by the underlying medical issue.

Another way to think about it is to consider a specific child I have worked significantly in my neighborhood who has an Autism diagnosis. He now 8 years old and has both intellectual and behavior challenges that easily place him under the Autism umbrella but consider the root cause. This child was born with a severe heart defect and nearly died as an infant. He suffered multiple strokes that caused significant brain damage which has created significant challenges for him to learn language and social communication. Eventually he had a heart transplant, but the damage was permanent. His inability to communicate verbally in our society which demands it leads to frustration, anxiety, violent behavior, learning delays that lead to an Autism diagnosis. The reality is that he doesn't have a some separate medical condition with a separate root cause. The heart defect/strokes caused brain damage and creates verbal/social learning challenges and this causes the symptoms which lead to an Autism diagnosis.

My son with an ASD diagnosis simply learns in a different way which is almost exclusively visual. At 4 he had almost no verbal communication but could learn anything with his eyes including social behaviors and was already an advance reader. When diagnosed at 2.5 years old, pretty much every box on every assessment was checked for every possible symptom of Autism. Now at 7 he excels in school and is doing fine by any measure.

My son, my neighbor with the heart issue, kids with all of these medical conditions all behave or behaved in similar ways but have dramatically different underlying root causes. It's not that they have one condition plus Autism. There are dramatically different underlying root cause for the symptoms they display which leads to an Autism diagnosis which is again a group of symptoms, not an underlying root cause of something.

Researchers need to focus on a few things. First any root cause, real medical issue must be identified and treated. This may be a significant genetic or other medical issue or it may be more basic like a food or environmental allergy. New medical treatments are needed in these areas. Second, while the underlying medical or genetic issues are totally different, an Autism diagnosis should provide access to different educational options and techniques that are aligned with their needs. Nearly all of these children regardless of the diverse root causes of their 'Autism' will benefit from having an appropriate education aligned with their learning style and capabilities.



Sweetleaf
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13 Jun 2018, 11:52 am

Well I have comorbid conditions anxiety, depression, PTSD so I am pretty sure people with autism can have other conditions as well.


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Daddy63
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13 Jun 2018, 8:05 pm

Anxiety, depression and PTSD are also diagnosed looking at symptoms, not an underlying medical root cause. It's the same point. One doesn't cause the other. Correlation doesn't mean causation.



kraftiekortie
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14 Jun 2018, 7:34 am

Many times, autism does co-exist with other disorders.

Autism is neurological; most of the other disorders are mostly psychological.

A good diagnostician has the ability to diagnose whatever is the “root” disorder. And to know, precisely, the interactions between the various disorders within a person.

Too often, research on autism assumes that it is a monolithic disorder, rather than a spectrum disorder. This skews the results of this research mightily, in my opinion.



eikonabridge
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15 Jun 2018, 2:54 am

Daddy63 wrote:
It drives me nuts every time I read another article about this nonsense. ...

Thanks for pointing out the article. I share your opinion and frustration.

This past weekend I attended an event to raise fund for autism research. Frankly, when I checked the list of researchers/postdocs/PhD students, I get disgusted. These are all vampires sucking blood out of the society and doing next-to-useless research studies. I mean, at some point people have to develop a sense of pride. You can't be proud being parasites of the society, consuming dollars from the good will of people.

Our society is too blind and arrogant. Look:

autism: 2% (clinical) to 4% (BAP broad autism spectrum)
bipolar: 2% (clinical) to 4% (subclinical)
schizophrenia: 1%
color blindness: 4%
etc.

You add up all these types of genetic conditions, and you end up nearly 10% of population being defective.

Mother Nature has had 4 billion years to do evolution. So, we Homo Sapiens humans, are we the most successful species, or the most defective species? Is Mother Nature really that dumb?

- - -

We invent disorders that are not even there. Our mammal ancestors in the past were tetrachromats, compared to them, we trichromats are all color blind. Strangely, we trichromats don't view ourselves as defective. How come?

If you can get that point, you will also understand how ridiculous it is to consider color blindness (mostly dichromats) autism, bipolarity and schizophrenia as disorders. It's plain racism.

- - -

Nazi Germany systematically sterilized or murdered people with schizophrenia.
http://brucelevine.net/what-happened-after-a-nation-methodically-murdered-its-schizophrenics-rethinking-mental-illness-and-its-heritability/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2800142/

Guess what? One generation afterward, the incidence rate of schizophrenia in Germany was higher than its neighbor countries.

You want to play games with Mother Nature? She is not dumb. She is much smarter than you are. She has all kinds of back-up mechanisms in place.

- - -

The same is true with autism. Mother Nature is not dumb. Autism is polygenic (multiple genetic mutations can lead to the same condition). You can't eradicate it. Not that easily.

So, instead, we should come to accept that autism is meant by Mother Nature. It's part of what's normal.

This begs the question: how in the world do we manage, as a society, to turn perfectly fine children into comatose adults?

What have those millions of dollars in autism research given us in return, huh?

- - -

Autism is poligenic. It's well-known that there are at least a few dozens and as many as a few hundred, or even over one or two thousand gene mutations that can cause autism. This, plus all the epi-genetic factors. (I have presented an "orchestra model" of the genomics of autism before, on Wrong Planet). It's not surprising at all that autism has a large variety of co-morbids.

I mean, a physicist like myself is never puzzled by the large variety of co-morbids, at all. We theoretical physicists know a phenomenon by the name of "renormalization." It's a bit like the Central Limit Theorem: you take any probability distribution on real numbers, and add N copies of itself. Your final distribution will invariably approach the Gaussian (Normal) distribution as N grows, regardless of which initial distribution you have used. In a sense, the shape of the final Gaussian distribution is actually not given by your initial distribution, but by the mere fact that you are repeatedly adding (or averaging) multiple copies of a distribution.

People have to understand that autism is a renormalization process. Then, and only then, will they understand the true meso-scale nature of autism inside the human brain, and stop the futility in genetic studies on the co-morbilities.

I saw all this when my son was 2.5 years old, or over 6 years ago. Ha ha. The rest of the world has a lot of catch up to do. I am way ahead of everyone else.

The net effect? My children grow nicely. Did I mention my son's California MAP (Measures of Academic Progress) test on the English part was at 98th percentile? That's higher than most children. Higher than most of the verbal children. Even if you disregard that, everyone that has met my son can tell you, he is always smiling. A happy boy. Struggling? I don't struggle. I have fun raising my children.

I never once viewed autism as a disorder. To me, I separate the three things:
(a) autism
(b) underdevelopment
(c) physical co-morbids (including epilepsy in some)
very clearly. I don't get confused between the three things. I hate it when people dump anxiety and depression into autism. Autism has nothing to do with those things. People like to blame every single problem on autism. Anxiety and depression happen for neurotypical people as well, in fact, the majority of pill users for these conditions are neurotypical.

I've explained all too many times on how to approach anxiety/depression: modulation. I get tired of repeating, so I won't repeat it again here. The simple fact is: it's a choice. There are simple solutions, but if people choose not to do anything and prefer to swallow pills, that's their choice. Not my problem.

- - -

I look at other parents, and I can only shake my head.

Frankly, if you raise your autistic children, and/or you approach your bipolar and schizophrenic young adults, via modulation, all problems will be gone.

See, on the autism side, my problem is, so far I have not found any other parent that work with their hands as much as I do. (A few weeks ago I built a safety elevator model, spent 5 weekends on it, as a prop for my son's biographical essay and presentation on Elisha Otis, the inventor of the modern safety elevator.) Another problem is, I don't see other parents addressing their children's sad/mad issues, when the children are happy.

I just attended an offsite, team building event. See, large companies organize these events on a regular basis, so the employees can have fun, but at the same time they address the most difficult personnel issues, have the most difficult conversations. I mean, companies have been doing this for decades and decades, if not for centuries. It's a well-known technique. Yet, when it comes to parenting, we all become comatose parents, and don't apply the same technique.

See, I have a happy family and a happy life. My two autistic children are smart and always smiling. I kind of envy them. My childhood was not this happy.

Other people would tell me what things to do. I can't tell you how many people have told me about alternative therapies, diet, supplements, etc. The very funny thing is: their children are underdeveloped, most have gigantic tantrum issues. Their families are suffering. I mean, why do people tell me what to do, when their children and their families are suffering? No thanks. I much prefer my approach. I don't even struggle. I am not lucky. I simply do things that other people refuse to learn and refuse to do.

That other families are suffering, is none of my problem. It's their choice. I've done plenty of explaining. I don't have time to worry about other people's children. I have given them precise instructions and detailed explanations. But if they choose to ignore everything I have said and prefer to suffer, that's not my problem.

So, two main things are:
(1) empty hands from parents mean empty brains in children. Is that even a surprise?
(2) modulation, guys. When your children are happy, do you just let those moments slip away? Is it even a surprise that your children have tantrum issues? Aren't you familiar with your company/organization's team building or offsite events?


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