To religious people. Will atheists go to hell or heaven?

Page 16 of 18 [ 275 posts ] Go to page Previous 1 ... 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18 Next

Previous topic | Next topic

tharn
Snowy Owl

Joined: 21 Apr 2008
Age: 45
Gender: Male
Posts: 168
Location: Iowa

05 Jun 2008, 2:24 pm

Speckles wrote:

Hmm, I can only think of two things off the top of my head that I have personally read that create a reasonable heaven and hell concept. The closest to the traditional view is in the last book of the Narnia series. The next is the webcomic Jack; it focuses on hell, and is one of the most disturbing things I have ever read (consider yourself warned).

Jack is one of my favorite web comics - if not my absolute favorite!

Though Johnny the Homicidal Maniac has a special place in my heart. *ahem* That diversion aside, I think my first inclination toward this reading of the afterlife was the result of reading a dialog by Raymond Smullyan, Is God a Taoist?

Ragtime
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 2 Nov 2006
Age: 46
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,927
Location: Dallas, Texas

05 Jun 2008, 2:39 pm

Pandora wrote:

I don't see how Ragtime can be so sure he will go to heaven. That is very presumptuous. He might, he might not. None of us know for sure, especially not him.

It's not presumptuous at all; Jesus gave His believers complete assurance:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

Plus about 8 more instances of the same absolute promise I just re-listened to on my Bible mp3's this week.

_________________
Christianity is different than Judaism only in people's minds -- not in the Bible.

burnse22
Deinonychus

Joined: 6 Apr 2008
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 383

05 Jun 2008, 2:45 pm

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

_________________
"Was that the bad thing?"
"Floss is boss. Floss is boss! FLOSS IS BOSS!! !"

Orwell
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 8 Aug 2007
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,518
Location: Room 101

05 Jun 2008, 2:47 pm

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

Well, what exactly are you to believe? How can you be sure you're believing the right thing? And what if you're not baptized the right way?

_________________
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

Ragtime
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 2 Nov 2006
Age: 46
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,927
Location: Dallas, Texas

05 Jun 2008, 2:53 pm

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

Nothing in the eternal realm. It is an outward showing of faith.

_________________
Christianity is different than Judaism only in people's minds -- not in the Bible.

makuranososhi
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 May 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,805
Location: Banned by Alex

05 Jun 2008, 2:53 pm

Ragtime wrote:

Pandora wrote:

I don't see how Ragtime can be so sure he will go to heaven. That is very presumptuous. He might, he might not. None of us know for sure, especially not him.

QED; biblical citations are articles of faith, not evidence. They are valid for explaining your beliefs, but I find them useless for practical discussion, it will always return to what was writ centuries past, the texts selected from a great many books, prophecies and narratives to create a codified and common version of one form of a religion, and an expectation that these these short stories and parables (which have great value in understanding others and some ideals that I can find appreciable) be accepted as absolute truth.

M.

_________________
My thanks to all the wonderful members here; I will miss the opportunity to continue to learn and work with you.

For those who seek an alternative, it is coming.

So long, and thanks for all the fish!

burnse22
Deinonychus

Joined: 6 Apr 2008
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 383

05 Jun 2008, 2:53 pm

Orwell wrote:

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

Well, what exactly are you to believe? How can you be sure you're believing the right thing? And what if you're not baptized the right way?

I wonder how many denominations of Christianity quote Jesus in the same way, each claiming that their beliefs are the only true beliefs.

_________________
"Was that the bad thing?"
"Floss is boss. Floss is boss! FLOSS IS BOSS!! !"

burnse22
Deinonychus

Joined: 6 Apr 2008
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 383

05 Jun 2008, 2:55 pm

Ragtime wrote:

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

Nothing in the eternal realm. It is an outward showing of faith.

Eh? So it doesn't matter if you're baptized or not? What's so important about it then?

_________________
"Was that the bad thing?"
"Floss is boss. Floss is boss! FLOSS IS BOSS!! !"

Orwell
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 8 Aug 2007
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 12,518
Location: Room 101

05 Jun 2008, 3:01 pm

burnse22 wrote:

Orwell wrote:

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

Well, what exactly are you to believe? How can you be sure you're believing the right thing? And what if you're not baptized the right way?

I wonder how many denominations of Christianity quote Jesus in the same way, each claiming that their beliefs are the only true beliefs.

Most. We've had wars over it. That's actually why my family is in America rather than our ancestral home in Scotland; we happened to be on the losing side of one of those wars.

_________________
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

Fnord
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 6 May 2008
Gender: Male
Posts: 60,939
Location:

05 Jun 2008, 3:04 pm

MR_BOGAN wrote:

Will atheists go to hell or heaven?

Hell.

makuranososhi
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 May 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,805
Location: Banned by Alex

05 Jun 2008, 3:07 pm

Fnord wrote:

MR_BOGAN wrote:

Will atheists go to hell or heaven?

Hell.

And what about Valhalla? I mean, the travel brochures do look rather swell... I jest, somewhat.

M.

burnse22
Deinonychus

Joined: 6 Apr 2008
Age: 36
Gender: Male
Posts: 383

05 Jun 2008, 3:09 pm

Orwell wrote:

burnse22 wrote:

Orwell wrote:

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

Well, what exactly are you to believe? How can you be sure you're believing the right thing? And what if you're not baptized the right way?

I wonder how many denominations of Christianity quote Jesus in the same way, each claiming that their beliefs are the only true beliefs.

Most. We've had wars over it. That's actually why my family is in America rather than our ancestral home in Scotland; we happened to be on the losing side of one of those wars.

Which war was that? The Jacobite Rising?

_________________
"Was that the bad thing?"
"Floss is boss. Floss is boss! FLOSS IS BOSS!! !"

Last edited by burnse22 on 05 Jun 2008, 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ragtime
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 2 Nov 2006
Age: 46
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,927
Location: Dallas, Texas

05 Jun 2008, 3:10 pm

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

burnse22 wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."
(Mark 16:16)

So what happens if you believeth but are not baptized?

Nothing in the eternal realm. It is an outward showing of faith.

Eh? So it doesn't matter if you're baptized or not? What's so important about it then?

Can you read?

_________________
Christianity is different than Judaism only in people's minds -- not in the Bible.

Phagocyte
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,757

05 Jun 2008, 3:15 pm

Ragtime wrote:

Can you read?

I think that's rather unnecessary. But I understand what you're saying, it's more of a symbolic thing to do to demonstrate one's faith, right?

_________________
Un-ban Chever! Viva La Revolucion!

greenblue
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 25 Mar 2007
Age: 49
Gender: Male
Posts: 7,896
Location: Home

05 Jun 2008, 3:31 pm

makuranososhi wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Pandora wrote:

I don't see how Ragtime can be so sure he will go to heaven. That is very presumptuous. He might, he might not. None of us know for sure, especially not him.

QED; biblical citations are articles of faith, not evidence.

Also a matter of interpretation, the phrase "He that believeth" can be taken differently depending on the denomination a christian belongs to, adding another problem to the discussion.

_________________
?Everything is perfect in the universe - even your desire to improve it.?

makuranososhi
Veteran
Veteran

Joined: 12 May 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,805
Location: Banned by Alex

05 Jun 2008, 3:36 pm

greenblue wrote:

makuranososhi wrote:

Ragtime wrote:

Pandora wrote:

I don't see how Ragtime can be so sure he will go to heaven. That is very presumptuous. He might, he might not. None of us know for sure, especially not him.

QED; biblical citations are articles of faith, not evidence.

Also a matter of interpretation, the phrase "He that believeth" can be taken differently depending on the denomination a christian belongs to, adding another problem to the discussion.

Faith is some that stands alone; it is intensely personal and powerful. It is not fact or evidence, however... You make a very good point, and I thank you - faith will always be subjective... As a rule, I don't argue for faith or religion; I argue against the blanket assertions made my followers of their various tenets as absolutes.

M.

Page 16 of 18 [ 275 posts ] Go to page Previous 1 ... 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18 Next

Jump to:

To religious people. Will atheists go to hell or heaven? Post Reply New Topic

To religious people. Will atheists go to hell or heaven?