Do you believe in UFO's and Aliens?

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Exactly.

But.... Isn't Christianity just another one of the religions that the aliens [anunnaki from the draco galaxy] have formed around themselves? That's what I think, based on past research and reading.. Of course I have no proof, but still. Just wondering why you think Christianity is different.

I can destroy a spaceship full of aliens due to my tantrik powers.

I agree with you that Extraodinary Claims require Extraordinary evidence, However I remain unconvinced that the Ulysses probe is the best we can do in terms of speed. Furthermore, I also cannot help but call into question the certainty of special relativity and the light barrier-in terms of not having seen physical proof of such. But even if it is correct, what Relativity tells is is NOT that its entirely impossible to travel faster than light, but that its impossible to cross the light barrier BY BRUTE FORCE. But I dispute the notion that claims that some UFOs may be (autonomous)Robot Probes from extraterrestrial civilizations rather than spacecraft piloted by actual Aliens themselves. Do you disagree with me on that in particular? I will say that I am NOT a believer in Alien abductions or in the presence of Aliens among us. Also, photographic evidence and eyewitness accounts are certainly not strong enough evidence to rule out terrestrial origins-in fact they do not provide proof that an actual object was even there. But if eyewitness accounts are confirmed by Radar than that shows that what was seen was an actual object.
So yes, the stories in this thread certainly dont prove anything. But I look at UFO incidents on a case-by-case basis before trying to come to ANY conclusions. About the Belgian Flap of 1990 its pretty clear that Something was in the skies that night over Europe and the extraterrestrial hypothesis has yet to be ruled out.....

Probably true, but still, interstellar distances are vast. The amount of energy needed to accelerate a spacecraft to a significant fraction of the speed of light is simply enormous. However, concepts have been drawn up by NASA for potentially plausible interstellar probes with technological knowledge not much above our own (unlike some other similar probe plans); I was just reading about one from the late 80s known as Project Longshot which would use nuclear pulse propulsion for a travel time to Alpha Centauri in only 100 years. Also I think I read somewhere that it would be plausible to set up some kind of light sail driven by ground based lasers or something like that which they claimed could be used to get the craft up to .1c, but I don't remember where I read that. Anywho, we're still dealing with a very long time to traverse interstellar distances under technology which isn't complete BS.


Relativity is right, and FTL is a pipe dream. Granted, we haven't demonstrated the physical impossibility of worm holes, but they aren't looking too good and they wouldn't be much of a travel plan anywho.

WHAT experimental proof is there that nothing can travel faster than light?
Experimental quantum optics is getting closer and closer to sending information faster than light.Your assertion that FTL is a pipedream is BS. Quantum Tunneling DOES allow infinite potential barriers to be penetrated. Im not talking about "wormholes", Im talking about exploiting General Relativity by amplifying gravitational waves to bend spacetime in a localized region. I find your understanding of modern physics to be somewhat shaky, though you vociferously extoll your perspication. :

The aliens have the same religious understanding I have -- that they must submit to the authority of Jesus Christ of Nazareth. I have used this conferred authority to send these aliens packing quite frequently. I personally can't oppose them; I have to have the conferred authority.

However, if a Christian church doesn't understand & exercise their authority, yes, the aliens can take it over and use it for their ends.

Believe it or...topic

I suppose a person can believe in anything, evidence notwithstanding. But I am skeptical of irrefutable evidence that aliens have landed or UFOs have entered our world. I will wait for substantiations form SETI before I get all excited about extraterrestrial life.

Cant comment on the Belgian Triangle incident of 1990? NO ETs were spotted and there was no communication with the Object but its dubious that Aerospace technology of the time was advanced enough to build a vehicle with such manuverability. Nonetheless, if you're waiting for SETI you could be waiting a LOooooooong time my friend . Space is vast, radiowaves are pretty slow AND dont forget the dispersion factor of radio signals as the travel through outer space.

This is a Non Sequitor fallacy. I'm not trying to disrespect you. but if you believe that calling for you to prove your assertions is disrespect, then that is your problem, not mine.


You've used the Fallacies of Digression, Non-Sequitor, and Straw Man in one statement. Actually, I'm a Presbyterian.


You've now expressed the Fallacy of Special Pleading. Is there no Declaration of Independance in the National Archives? Does Lindberg's plane not hang in the Smithsonian? Who is buried in Grant's tomb?


No, this is part of the Scientific Method. You've expressed a Half-Truth Fallacy by leaving out the rest of the method, which includes actually testing the hypothesis and peer-group review of the results. You don't stop at the hypothesis just because you've cherry-picked a few unrelated facts to support it. You have to actually demonstrate that your hypothesis is worthy of even being called a Theory.


You've committed the Fallacy of Appeal to Faith. if you rely on faith as the basis of your argument, then we can gain little from further discussion. Faith, by definition, relies on a belief that does not rest on logic or evidence, and is the antithesis of the scientific method - reliance on faith has kept more people ignorant, and prodiced more crackpot theories than all any public school administrator could ever hope for. Faith depends on irrational thought and produces intransigence. Faith proves nothing. Faith in an almighty sky-fairy does not prove that such a being exists. Faith in invisible dragons does not prove their existance. Faith in the Illuminati does not prove their existance.


You've made the Fallacy of Suppressed Evidence. Anyone can be accused of lying, but a mere accusation does not prove guilt, nor does it imply a conviction.


Fallacy of Suppressed Evidence again. Accusations are not proof, they are merely assertions or claims. Without irrefutable evidence of collusion, there can be no mistrial or acquital, regardless in one's faith in the alleged validity of the claim.


More Suppressed Evidence Fallacies. If you believe these implications, then the burden is upon you to provide the evidence.


How very cute ... an "Ad Hominem" attack, an "Argumentum Ex Silentio" fallacy, and an "Argumentum Ad Ignorantiam" fallacy all in one statement. You should run for public office.


"Confidence" in this context means "the quality or state of being certain" (syn. "certitude"). You have thus committed the fallacy of Equivocation by implying that "Certainty" and the "Belief in things unprovable" are the same thing, thus rendering your assertion null and void. And why would anyone want to make up their statistics, anyway? That's a sleezy way to propagate a belief.


It takes much more than a collection of misleading statements and fallacious assertions to convince me of anything.

As I said before, you should run for public office ... or maybe start a multi-level marketing scheme ... you could be a success in either case.

But since you are not saying anything more to me, then I guess I'll just have to be rude and refute your faith-based assertions without being asked.

Neener. Neener. Neener.

What aliens? You have not yet proven their existance. Until you've done so, any statements regarding thier abilities is null and void.



You can either oppose these alleged beings, or you can't. "Sending them back" is opposition. Denying that opposition implies collusion in their departure.

Just whose side are you on, anyway?


This statement is rendered null and void by your failure to prove the existance of thes "Aliens" you speak of.

Evidence, Please?

The Annunaki myth of the ancient Babylonians has recently been grafted onto the present-day Nibiru myth, which states that the Anunnaki of Nibiru are coming back to Earth soon. Planet X (or Nibiru) is going to pass by Earth, in May or June of 2003, on its 3,600 year orbit around our sun, causing earthquakes, tidal waves, severe flooding, food shortages due to climatic conditions, diseases, meteor fire storms, volcanic eruptions and the like resulting in a great catastrophic infliction of loss of life on Earth.

Well, May and June of 2003 have come and gone over 5 years ago, and there was no sighting of "Planet X" at the time, nor did any natural disasters occur during that time or since then with any greater frequency. Some might say that "Global Warming" is caused by "Planet X", but this has been going on since the end of the most recent ice age.

Some people will believe anything.

Ball lightining in itself is a rare phenomenon only recently deemed true by the scientific community.

Glad we shared that little experience.


Well, I think this sentence slightly confuses the way epistemology works in science (i.e. your implying that we prove a universal, but this is not the way things work in, say, a falsificationist approach to science) but I assume you mean something better than that...


Citation? Even if you could send information, you'd still have a ways to go before you could send an object.


Again, citation? I figured you weren't talking about wormholes, but the proposals for FTL travel I've heard of are even worse, it is my impression.


Quite likely, given that I studied little more physics than it took to satisfy the requirements for my math degree, but I am aware that the prevailing theories on the matter are not favorable to the idea of FTL; claims to the contrary are still not well grounded and therefore constitute bad argument premises. FTL travel still stands as the hope of a theoretical possibility.


I have done no such extolation of perspicacitousness.

I believe that aliens may be out there somewhere. As for UFOs and alien abductions, I'm not sure.

twoshots:
As far as Relativity is concerned, surely you realize we are NOT talking about philosophy here were are talking about Science which requires Experimental verification on a theory before it can be accepted as fact Are you familiar with the mathematics of Special and General Relativity? Such as the Lorentz Transformation and the Einstein Filed Equations??
Modern Astrophysics has made observations which are consistent with General Relativity: such as Gravitational Lenses and Black Holes. A good example of the former is the (so-called) Eintstein Cross. But speaking of FTL and information here are some interesting links: http://wc0.worldcrossing.com/WebX?14@@.1de13e11/4. If an object is traveling at superluminal velocity the Lorentz Factor becomes a complex number with a non-zero real part. What that suggests is that the velocity of light is an asymptotic barrier-essentially an infinite potential barrier.

Science involves philosophy(scientific foundations began in philosophy, ya know), but his point is valid, you cannot empirically verify a universal within science. What experiment can prove that nothing can ever do something? Only an experiment that tested all things, and well, that is impossible especially given that it is unlikely we will ever know all things.