14 dead and 50 injured in mass shooting in Colorado.

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John_Browning
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20 Jul 2012, 6:13 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

John Browning, the guy is a PhD candidate ffs, he had it planned out. Don't you think he would make sure he had a damned good vest on, the best he could afford. The guy is a smart dude and calculating. He had all his basis covered, even a gas mask to protect him from the smoke he unleashed on the crowd. He was not going to be easy to take out. The cops did it only because he was completely out of bullets, I bet, and he was too afraid of getting shot by them.

Just admit this is one case a concealed weapon would not have harmed James Holmes and it might have even hurt an innocent civilian in the theater.

The vest was described as a flak jacket, which is different, either way running or hiding sure wasn't a practical means of defense. If I was there and packing I would have preferred to try and at least drive him back if I couldn't get a clear shot at him. Running like a stampede of cattle trying to get through the door all at once with their back to the shooter, otherwise known as a 'choke point', was probably part of his plan and a damn efficient tactic to achieve his goals.

I'll admit that defending against an armored adversary in a crowded theater is probably one of the worst scenarios you could realistically come across, but acting on animal instinct and finding yourself caught in a crowd huddled together in a concentrated (efficient use of ammo) crowd is far less appealing than standing your ground and exchanging fire with the attacker. If nothing else, you at least go out dignified and respected.

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Jacoby
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20 Jul 2012, 6:16 pm

News saying he took 100mg of vicodin before the shooting. That's a lot.

John_Browning
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20 Jul 2012, 6:23 pm

wayne_da_doctor wrote:

Where did he get the cash for such an arsenal is what am wondering ? and how the regulations concerning each weapon was handled.

Regulations were followed regarding the sales: he was old enough, there was nothing prohibiting from purchasing a gun (his only court record was a speeding ticket- nothing criminal or psychiatric), and everything he had was legal under Colorado state law. Few states have any regulations on body armor beside felons better not get caught with it, and gas masks are not restricted. Most tear gas grenade manufacturers sell straight to law enforcement agencies so they are hard to come by even in states that don't ban them, so I'm not sure where he got them unless he made them. Tear gas is made from a concentrated extract from hot peppers so it's not really rocket science.

John_Browning
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20 Jul 2012, 6:25 pm

Jacoby wrote:

News saying he took 100mg of vicodin before the shooting. That's a lot.

He must really have anticipated getting shot by a moviegoer!

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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20 Jul 2012, 6:27 pm

John_Browning wrote:

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

What if you accidentally shoot someone besides the shooter? You have to live with it the rest of your life.

wayne_da_doctor
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20 Jul 2012, 6:29 pm

maybe he was going for a hostage situation at 1st ?

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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20 Jul 2012, 6:33 pm

With all that Vicodin, I am surprised he could keep his eyes open...

wayne_da_doctor
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20 Jul 2012, 6:55 pm

Something doesn't sit right, keep your eyes peeled everyone.

John_Browning
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20 Jul 2012, 7:12 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

What if you accidentally shoot someone besides the shooter? You have to live with it the rest of your life.

Then it is still morally justifiable using a mathematical doctrine that he was going to shoot a lot more people if you didn't do what you did. In most states the active shooter would be legally responsible for the defender's stray bullet since it happened as a direct result of a felony he committed.

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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20 Jul 2012, 7:24 pm

John_Browning wrote:

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

What if you accidentally shoot someone besides the shooter? You have to live with it the rest of your life.

The law doesn't necessarily see it that way. It could be considered negligent on the part of the shooter.

aghogday
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20 Jul 2012, 8:09 pm

According to ABC news, Holmes told the authorities he was the Joker, after the crime, and had colored his hair and beard red.

A red flag, for a break from reality, and Psychosis. Psychopathy and psychosis are two completely different issues.

Remains to be seen what if any diagnosis will be given, and if there is a diagnosis of schizophrenia, it wouldn't be unusual for it to go unidentified up until this point as the condition often presents itself in young adulthood, as was the case for Jared Loughner.

Violence is correlated among schizophrenics whom abuse drugs. This was an issue associated with Loughner, and a potential issue associated with this individual, with reports of use of Vicodin.

The picture below is not a mug shot, as a mug shot has not yet been released. A medical school picture along with an earlier picture in high school.

Looks like a very bright, kid, and anything but violent, but the later picture from Medical school, brought to mind the Loughner picture, with a smile that looks almost identical. Just a coincidence, but apparently others have noticed it as well.

And I finally figured where I had seen the look on Loughner's face below

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia#Violence

If psychosis was an issue, dark media influences of fantasy, along with easily accessible drugs and easily accessible military style weaponry, didn't help.

Interesting that no one was carrying a concealed weapon in the theater. Not likely to be the case, so much in the future, as that was one place that most people still felt safe.

And the high school picture proves, there is no way to predict what one is going to do in the future, judging from their present behavior or appearance.

There is no likely answer other than the reality that the world is not always a predictable place to live in. It's still extremely rare that something like this happens, but it won't likely be the last time.

By the way the last picture is not presented to make light of the issue, it is to illustrate dark fantasy, which does unfortunately match reality at times.

And perhaps there is some merit in watching the diet one feeds their mind.

Self fulfilling realities.

The potentials for the future become almost unlimited.

John_Browning
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20 Jul 2012, 8:30 pm

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

John_Browning wrote:

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

What if you accidentally shoot someone besides the shooter? You have to live with it the rest of your life.

The law doesn't necessarily see it that way. It could be considered negligent on the part of the shooter.

Typically the perpetrator gets charged over anything that happens to someone during or as the result of their crime in most states. In most of the country, good luck trying to find a jury that would convict someone that stopped an active shooter, or even a DA that would file charges.

Ghostgirl
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20 Jul 2012, 8:35 pm

User1 wrote:

Ghostgirl wrote:

It never fails to surprise me that the same old red puffy faced blowhard right wingers here warning us of an impending left-wing conspiracy to take away
their guns, maybe its time to take them away. I am sure this will rile up alot of the insecure types that think its their god given right to bare arms, but they
are not rational individuals, the people that do these monstrous crimes are supposedly law abiding citizens till they flip out. Maybe the government should
take all guns away, and if these idiots and cowards who hide behind their antiquated second amendment protest then let the guns be pulled from their cold
dead hands as they can't be considered rational beings.

And you're a lot better than them...

Anyone who disagrees with you is an irrational being and should have their rights taken away or be killed if they resist.

- - -

Now maybe it's you who is the irrational one:

There's no "conspiracy" to take away guns, but the Obama administration did allow, through the Fast and Furious program, guns to be sold to Mexican drug cartels. Later:

"June-July 2011: House Democrats submit gun-control legislation, and [b]e-mails surface showing that Fast and Furious was designed to promote gun control."

Source: Operation Fast and Furious Timeline

God given right to bear arms? No, Constitutionally protected right to bear arms:

"A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

US Constitution, Amendment 2

I'm sorry, but the US has 88.8 guns per 100 people. If you think that 88.8 out of every 100 people are mass killing maniacs, you are truly a fool.

Guns Per Capita

You know what's also against the law? Murder. I'm pretty sure a guy who killed about 12 people and left 60 more injured does not give a damn about the laws regarding gun purchases. If you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns, as they buy them on the black market, while law-abiding citizens are left defenseless.

You go right on quoting wikipedia skippy

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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20 Jul 2012, 8:35 pm

John_Browning wrote:

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

John_Browning wrote:

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:

What if you accidentally shoot someone besides the shooter? You have to live with it the rest of your life.

The law doesn't necessarily see it that way. It could be considered negligent on the part of the shooter.

If someone accidentally gets shot and dies because another person is attempting to shoot a shooter, the person attempting it will be held responsible. It won't just be the shooter who is held responsible, though he will as well because of the criminal act laws which state if someone gets killed during the commitment of a crime, the one doing the crime is charged. The person who shoots accidentally could be charged with negligent homicide.

Last edited by ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo on 20 Jul 2012, 9:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Ghostgirl
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20 Jul 2012, 8:42 pm

John_Browning wrote:

Ghostgirl wrote:

You know for every event like this there is at least 10 watching the news getting a hard on and thinking they can do it bigger, which really frightens me.
It never fails to surprise me that the same old red puffy faced blowhard right wingers here warning us of an impending left-wing conspiracy to take away
their guns, maybe its time to take them away. I am sure this will rile up alot of the insecure types that think its their god given right to bare arms, but they
are not rational individuals, the people that do these monstrous crimes are supposedly law abiding citizens till they flip out. Maybe the government should
take all guns away, and if these idiots and cowards who hide behind their antiquated second amendment protest then let the guns be pulled from their cold
dead hands as they can't be considered rational beings.

Look up DC v. Heller and also Warren v. DC. Four years ago the 2nd amendment was ruled an individual right (and still relevant), and the police have no obligation to protect you as an individual.

and you just prove my point, what about the people that were gunned down by this monster, I am sure is was in his rights to gun them down, you and your type just don't get it, what about these people who were murdered my this monster what did the second amendment do for them? Nothing, Get off your high horse you coward

Tim_Tex
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20 Jul 2012, 9:14 pm

The sad thing about these things is that people try to blame political conspiracy theories for these things.

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