Anybody but Trump!

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04 Aug 2016, 9:54 am

Adamantium wrote:

Not wanting to derail this thread, but:

ZenDen wrote:

I think the Dali Lama offered a simple and effective solution: Accept the refugees and care for them, and when the conflict in their country is over, send them home. Constructing humane living conditions is not a problem. Why does everyone make things more complicated than they need to be?

Things get complicated all by themselves.

What is the status of children born to the refugees while they are temporary residents?

What happens when the conflict in their country isn't over after decades and shows no sign of being over in the foreseeable future?

What is the status of a third generation "refugee" who knows only the language and culture of the host country and whose parents have never seen the land their grandparents fled from as refugees?

Then I guess we shouldn't let refugees in to begin with because the truth is that they never leave.

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04 Aug 2016, 9:56 am

Mootoo wrote:

It'd be awesome if they force the pisser to resign, I heard they're speculating about what would happen in such an event... I assume not like the anti-democratic Tories here, as presidential elections are still required.

And I did read that he apparently wants journalists in such meetings to be highlighted and ridiculed... what happens if one of them is attacked or even killed? I seriously hope he gets blamed along with the aggressor (though it wouldn't be surprising if he sends out the first punch, as he always says he loves doing...)

"They" have tried to push this narrative multiple times over the last year, they've been trying to say it since before Trump even ran. Not gonna happen, you are being brainwashed by the media if you honestly believe this drivel.

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04 Aug 2016, 10:01 am

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Donald Trump will be attending a rally in my hometown today. Oh Boy

Hopefully it will be (relatively) uneventful.

It may not be fair to say that Trump causes violence & mayhem, or that he encourages violence & mayhem, but the fact is that he attracts violence & mayhem. Again just like Hitler. I wonder if he would require Muslims to sew crescents on their clothing or hang signs on their shops to pave the way for another Kristallnacht.

How about you actually go to the event and judge it for yourself?

The only people that cause trouble and are violent at these events are the George Soros-paid agitators, Trump really doesn't talk that much about the crap the media tries smear him with.

The event was what I was expecting. There were confrontations inside & outside the venue. AND two people were forced to leave because they were wearing T-shirts criticizing Trump-- apparently he doesn't care about freedom of expression.

After the rally, Trump's camp engaged in damage control, and the RNC leadership denied that they were looking for ways to replace him on the ballot. But I always say "Never believe anything until it's officially denied."

Oh the humanity, they forced TWO people to leave from a private event? Were you there or are you just reading what you want to read? What do you think would happen if I showed up to a Hillary event and tried to interrupt it? How do you think these supposed 'left wingers' react to opinions they don't like? The people initiating any confrontations are not the Trump people and all the real violence that has happened has been with those that oppose Trump, you guys still talk about some near 80 year punching some guy as if it is remotely comparable or relevant.

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04 Aug 2016, 11:09 am

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Donald Trump will be attending a rally in my hometown today. Oh Boy

They weren't being disruptive, they were expressing an opinion. "Freedom of Expression" remember? Unless you're one of Trump's SA Thugs who thinks freedom of expression is just for the people you agree with. Besides, unless you're defending yourself, no one has the right to be punching anyone.

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04 Aug 2016, 11:17 am

No and nobody has the right to be a violent mob because somebody said something you dislike. Trump's rallies are private events, they don't have a right to disturb it anyway. They are free to express themselves outside which some do in the most awful abusive ways, that's not even factoring in the riots and violence these people have perpetrated. I blame paid agitators more anything, what do you think George Soros spends his money on?

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04 Aug 2016, 11:51 am

Jacoby wrote:

No and nobody has the right to be a violent mob because somebody said something you dislike. Trump's rallies are private events.

If Trump's rallies are private, then why is he charging admission & selling tickets?

It's either a private affair--invitation only, or he charges admission & anyone gets in, so he what he gets. He can't have it both ways.

By the way, you still haven't disputed my assertion that you disagree with everyone having Freedom of Speech & Expression

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04 Aug 2016, 12:14 pm

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

No and nobody has the right to be a violent mob because somebody said something you dislike. Trump's rallies are private events.

He doesn't charge admission so I know you didn't go now, it doesn't matter one way or the other as it's still a private event paid for by Trump. Nobody is saying you can't express yourself outside the event but no, you are not owed admission and disruptions are not going to be tolerated under the false guise of 'free speech'. Go to a Hillary rally(with the 50 or so people at them) and start causing issues, you will be removed just the same.

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04 Aug 2016, 12:36 pm

The major disruptors, at the Trump events I've watched, have been from La Raza. They don't like Trump's comments about illegal immigration from Mexico, so they they tie bandannas around their faces and attack Trump supporters; they seem to be very well organized.

MAYBE WE SHOULD PASS A LAW SO THEY MUST BE INVITED INSIDE SO THEY CAN DEMONSTRATE THEIR RIGHT TO FREEDOM AND PROTEST??? Is this what you were suggesting Shadowboxer?? How about if someone wanted to stand up in the middle of a movie and started shouting their objections; OK with you??

Your statements, I feel, make a mockery of our Constitution, laws and their intent. If this is what your idea was, then go for it..it's protected by our Constitution. If not then please notice your comments are actually anti-American by twisting the meaning to serve your argument.

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04 Aug 2016, 12:37 pm

If Trump is holding rallies to sway people to his point of view, he needs to be open to conflicting opinions--Otherwise Trump & his followers are just a group of people marching in lockstep over the same cliff.

Again, you're saying that any opinion you disagree with is "under the false guise of free speech." . You still haven't disputed my assertion.

What qualifies you to determine who can speak their mind & who can't?

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shadowboxer
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04 Aug 2016, 12:51 pm

ZenDen wrote:

Trump tries to pass himself off as a man of the people, but he's managed to offend women, immigrants (legal & otherwise) and our veterans. Who's he going to piss off next? Sure, he has the right to free speech & expression, but simply because you can do something, it doesn't follow that you should. For most people there is a filter between impulse & action called common sense.

I would not go so far as saying that attacks on Trump's supporters are justified, but there's enough blame for everyone involved.

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Last edited by shadowboxer on 04 Aug 2016, 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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04 Aug 2016, 12:53 pm

shadowboxer wrote:

People that cause disruptions for any reason should be removed from the event, do you have the "right to free speech" at a play? Do you think spammers and trolls have a right to free speech on this website? Freedom of speech relates restrictions put on from the government, I'm sure you know this and our being purposely obtuse. Trump has rallies with 10k+ people and does press conferences and q&a's almost every day, when was the last time Hillary ever did one of those?

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04 Aug 2016, 1:02 pm

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Now You're being obtuse. I'm not talking about disrupting a political event
I'm talking about anyone who you happen to disagree with. Anyone who has a conflicting . opinion. You seem to think that they should not have the rights of free speech & expression.

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04 Aug 2016, 1:16 pm

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

now you are making a strawman

give it up

shadowboxer
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04 Aug 2016, 1:22 pm

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

now you are making a strawman

give it up

Ok, denial isn't just a river in Egypt. Admit nothing, deny everything, make counter accusations, but wake up & smell what you're shoveling.

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04 Aug 2016, 1:32 pm

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

now you are making a strawman

give it up

Ok, denial isn't just a river in Egypt. Admit nothing, deny everything, make counter accusations, but wake up & smell what you're shoveling.

Take your own advice. Lying does not help your argument, where do I say or imply that people I disagree with should not have the right to free speech as in shut down by the government? Find me this or as I said, give it up!

shadowboxer
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04 Aug 2016, 1:48 pm

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

Jacoby wrote:

shadowboxer wrote:

now you are making a strawman

give it up

Ok, denial isn't just a river in Egypt. Admit nothing, deny everything, make counter accusations, but wake up & smell what you're shoveling.

The point I was trying to make--The point you missed somehow is that you never actually came out & said that Everyone, whether you personally agree with them or not is entitled to freedom of speech, of expression, and of (peaceful) assembly Once you start drawing the line where do you stop?

With the first link the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, binds us all irrevocably. When one man's freedoms are trod upon, we are all damaged by it.

I'd have thought you'd have figured that out.

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