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The "Black Hole" of woke....

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babybird
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22 Aug 2022, 1:08 am

cyberdad wrote:
babybird wrote:
I was brought up to be prejudice and to discriminate. I worked hard to fight against that but somehow black in people in particular can still smell it on me. Its a cross I will always have to bare I suppose.


People grow and transform over time. I think if you are confident that the space between the time you were bought up and now has been sufficient to let you bloom as a individual who knows what is "not right" then you have nothing to worry about.


Well yeah, I try to be fair and respectful and I try to see things from different people's perspectives and points of views. I'm afraid that's all I can do.


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22 Aug 2022, 1:15 am

CockneyRebel wrote:
The Eat With Pride commercial was pretty special this year. I identify as LGBTQ and even I think this commercial goes too far.



I think it's a good dietary advice advert.


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22 Aug 2022, 1:44 am

babybird wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
If you feel comfortable telling us about the unfortunate situation in your own personal life, please do so. We might then be better able to understand and respond more appropriately to your concerns. (But feel free to ignore this post if you don't feel comfortable discussing it.)


I'm not sure it was actually an unfortunate situation of woke in action that happened against me. I think it was more to do with a mixture of pack mentally and wannabe woke-ists.

It was at a former place of employment. I'm quite a friendly person and I like a laugh and I find it easy to make friends. Usually this isn't an issue and it's never caused a problem anywhere else but at this particular place it did.

Things that I was saying to people were being twisted and pulled out of all proportion. So for example there was a homosexual male there. Now he was quite stereotypically gay but he was also quite "hands on" with the women too. I happened to point this out to a colleague and I said (jokingly) that maybe he's actually pretending to be gay because you just can't always be sure these days. Now I can't see how that can make me homophobic but apparently it did. That's just one example.

From my point of view it should have been him called into question for his "hands on" approach to both men and women in the workplace (one man did complain about him and eventually had to leave) but instead it was my joke about him that got me into trouble and eventually ostracized.

Agreed that it should have been him called into question for his "hands on" approach to both men and women in the workplace.

babybird wrote:
I can only put this down to the way some people's minds have been distorted by woke culture.

I would say, on the contrary, that this workplace wasn't "woke" ENOUGH about the problem of sexual harassment.


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cyberdad
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22 Aug 2022, 2:25 am

babybird wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
babybird wrote:
I was brought up to be prejudice and to discriminate. I worked hard to fight against that but somehow black in people in particular can still smell it on me. Its a cross I will always have to bare I suppose.


People grow and transform over time. I think if you are confident that the space between the time you were bought up and now has been sufficient to let you bloom as a individual who knows what is "not right" then you have nothing to worry about.


Well yeah, I try to be fair and respectful and I try to see things from different people's perspectives and points of views. I'm afraid that's all I can do.


Sounds like you are on the right track then



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22 Aug 2022, 2:29 am

Twilightprincess wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Some irony in that conservatives are the biggest propagators of identity politics

I think it’s the word “politics” that especially gets to me here because it seems to suggest that a person’s gender identity is not a real, valid issue; it’s just “politics.”


Well I get accused of "politicising" an issue when I mention the word "inequality" and get tarred with the "woke" brush.
But when a conservative lampoons advocates as social justice warriors and blame minorities for not fitting into some type of "patriotic ethno-nationalist archetype" they created they are just being good citizens :roll:



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22 Aug 2022, 3:28 am

babybird wrote:
CockneyRebel wrote:
The Eat With Pride commercial was pretty special this year. I identify as LGBTQ and even I think this commercial goes too far.



I think it's a good dietary advice advert.


It's good dietary advice, but the delivery is a bit off. I love how peas are in their spotlight, however.


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22 Aug 2022, 2:58 pm

Mona Pereth wrote:
babybird wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
If you feel comfortable telling us about the unfortunate situation in your own personal life, please do so. We might then be better able to understand and respond more appropriately to your concerns. (But feel free to ignore this post if you don't feel comfortable discussing it.)


I'm not sure it was actually an unfortunate situation of woke in action that happened against me. I think it was more to do with a mixture of pack mentally and wannabe woke-ists.

It was at a former place of employment. I'm quite a friendly person and I like a laugh and I find it easy to make friends. Usually this isn't an issue and it's never caused a problem anywhere else but at this particular place it did.

Things that I was saying to people were being twisted and pulled out of all proportion. So for example there was a homosexual male there. Now he was quite stereotypically gay but he was also quite "hands on" with the women too. I happened to point this out to a colleague and I said (jokingly) that maybe he's actually pretending to be gay because you just can't always be sure these days. Now I can't see how that can make me homophobic but apparently it did. That's just one example.

From my point of view it should have been him called into question for his "hands on" approach to both men and women in the workplace (one man did complain about him and eventually had to leave) but instead it was my joke about him that got me into trouble and eventually ostracized.

Agreed that it should have been him called into question for his "hands on" approach to both men and women in the workplace.

babybird wrote:
I can only put this down to the way some people's minds have been distorted by woke culture.

I would say, on the contrary, that this workplace wasn't "woke" ENOUGH about the problem of sexual harassment.


Thank you. I think I might be getting confusing Woke with something else.


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22 Aug 2022, 4:00 pm

babybird wrote:
I would identify as gender neutral but I'm a bit old school so tomboyish will suffice for me.


Me too. I'm astonished at the amount of offense people take to being accidently called the wrong gender. It means nothing to me. People get really angry about it. I used to talk to a transwoman growing up who was my friend. It was a sensitive subject for her, but she didn't get angry or offended at me like people do these days if I accidently called her He. It's scary how angry people get now and I really can't understand it.

I remember suggesting to my old close friend who was a lesbian that she try dating a man I knew. She didn't get angry or outraged, she told me she wasn't interested. She wasn't offended at all.

It seems to be a culture now where people try to blame and shame others. I read text on a pizza box today that it was recyclable and that you had no excuses, so dispose of it properly. It was ordering me to do the right thing. :P It's stupid really. What happened to politeness and manners?



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22 Aug 2022, 4:18 pm

babybird wrote:
I'm not sure it was actually an unfortunate situation of woke in action that happened against me. I think it was more to do with a mixture of pack mentally and wannabe woke-ists.

It was at a former place of employment. I'm quite a friendly person and I like a laugh and I find it easy to make friends. Usually this isn't an issue and it's never caused a problem anywhere else but at this particular place it did.

Things that I was saying to people were being twisted and pulled out of all proportion. So for example there was a homosexual male there. Now he was quite stereotypically gay but he was also quite "hands on" with the women too. I happened to point this out to a colleague and I said (jokingly) that maybe he's actually pretending to be gay because you just can't always be sure these days. Now I can't see how that can make me homophobic but apparently it did. That's just one example.

From my point of view it should have been him called into question for his "hands on" approach to both men and women in the workplace (one man did complain about him and eventually had to leave) but instead it was my joke about him that got me into trouble and eventually ostracized. I can only put this down to the way some people's minds have been distorted by woke culture. I would like to think that I'm OK wilith homosexuality but in this case I believe that him being homosexual made it ok for him to sexually harass people but me making a joke about him maybe pretending to be gay so he could touch up women wasn't OK.

I mean I can see how my comment may have been a tad offensive but it still doesn't make me a homophobe.



I've noticed with NTs how they subtly use language to hint at things in conversation, in a mild way so they don't offend. It's interesting how this subtlety is missing with many of these people. They are very direct and aren't able to pick up on subtleties in language. It's almost like a form of autism or other MH condition where they can't understand language and are able to read between the lines.

Example: A boy with moderate Asperger's at college would believe people were out to trick him or taunt him, when they were not. He had moderate ASD, and was not able to interpret subtle language, and jokes. He believed light hearted jokes were made at his expense.

I have observed the above mindset in most trans and many gay people. Many if not most have MH problems, it just comes with the territory. It's like the world is picking up on it and is copying it. It is unusual.



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22 Aug 2022, 4:51 pm

Tweety_Pie wrote:
I've noticed with NTs how they subtly use language to hint at things in conversation, in a mild way so they don't offend. It's interesting how this subtlety is missing with many of these people. They are very direct and aren't able to pick up on subtleties in language. It's almost like a form of autism or other MH condition where they can't understand language and are able to read between the lines.l.


I once had the misfortune to hang around with a woman who I can only describe as "Uber-NT", She was ultra confident and despised people (male or female) who were unable to pick up on subtly in conversation. It was kind of like being on a certain wavelength that you can only get by hanging around with the same people in the same circles probably from being with the "it-girls" in highschool.

When ever I spoke with her and one of her "buddies" came around they would switch to pig-latin and I knew they were talking about me. I learned fairly quickly to avoid such people because they were toxic.



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22 Aug 2022, 5:04 pm

cyberdad wrote:
Tweety_Pie wrote:
I've noticed with NTs how they subtly use language to hint at things in conversation, in a mild way so they don't offend. It's interesting how this subtlety is missing with many of these people. They are very direct and aren't able to pick up on subtleties in language. It's almost like a form of autism or other MH condition where they can't understand language and are able to read between the lines.l.


I once had the misfortune to hang around with a woman who I can only describe as "Uber-NT", She was ultra confident and despised people (male or female) who were unable to pick up on subtly in conversation. It was kind of like being on a certain wavelength that you can only get by hanging around with the same people in the same circles probably from being with the "it-girls" in highschool.

When ever I spoke with her and one of her "buddies" came around they would switch to pig-latin and I knew they were talking about me. I learned fairly quickly to avoid such people because they were toxic.


Many NTs and auties have been like that with me too. It's maddening, especially if they're ND in some way. It's like being snooty at a deaf person for being deaf.

From either side, it looks like people are looking down on and hating others for thinking differently. It would be nice if people didn't try so hard to divide themselves as being better than others.



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22 Aug 2022, 9:59 pm

I see the NPCs are out in force spreading the usual denials; it's not happening, well maybe it's happening a little but it's exaggerated by conservatives, it's good that it's happening, etc. Amazing that the same people who introduced the word "gaslighting" to the mainstream audience are so adept at it, almost like they were familiar with the technique through frequent use.

It's such an easy lie to disprove too, just look at the way any Democrat hems and haws when asked to define a woman in public these days (apparently you need to be a biologist now?), the constant outrage archeology being performed on public figures in order to demand apologies for decades old "transgressions" that were completely benign at the time, the countless tales of ordinary people forced out of jobs for breaking taboos that didn't exist mere months before, or any number of other indicators that things have gone a bit off the rails. I'm normally a big fan of Hanlon's Razor, but it's really hard not to see malice here, like many of these people know that wokeness is poisonous to most normies who resent the constant moralizing and shifting standards, but think if they can just keep pretending it's all a figment of the rightwing imagination they'll never have to pay the political price for it, even as they chafe under it themselves.

The ratchet effect is also very real, it can easily be seen in the utter humorlessness of the woke, particularly within their own ranks; they can't make fun of each other for going too far because none of them knows what "too far" thing that seems absurd today will be gospel tomorrow and grounds for cancellation, so they just have to treat everything seriously out of self preservation, allowing the most extreme people to push the group further and further out of bounds.


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22 Aug 2022, 10:33 pm

Dox47 wrote:
"transgressions" .

Associating "trans' with a negative concept, transphobic!! !!, You say you were truly using the term in a descriptive innocent way. You need to "do the work" to understand your cisprivilege.


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23 Aug 2022, 12:48 am

I wonder what will happen when we get to the other end.


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23 Aug 2022, 2:13 am

Tweety_Pie wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Tweety_Pie wrote:
I've noticed with NTs how they subtly use language to hint at things in conversation, in a mild way so they don't offend. It's interesting how this subtlety is missing with many of these people. They are very direct and aren't able to pick up on subtleties in language. It's almost like a form of autism or other MH condition where they can't understand language and are able to read between the lines.l.


I once had the misfortune to hang around with a woman who I can only describe as "Uber-NT", She was ultra confident and despised people (male or female) who were unable to pick up on subtly in conversation. It was kind of like being on a certain wavelength that you can only get by hanging around with the same people in the same circles probably from being with the "it-girls" in highschool.

When ever I spoke with her and one of her "buddies" came around they would switch to pig-latin and I knew they were talking about me. I learned fairly quickly to avoid such people because they were toxic.


Many NTs and auties have been like that with me too. It's maddening, especially if they're ND in some way. It's like being snooty at a deaf person for being deaf.

From either side, it looks like people are looking down on and hating others for thinking differently. It would be nice if people didn't try so hard to divide themselves as being better than others.


They think they are more sophisticated :roll:



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23 Aug 2022, 2:16 am

Dox47 wrote:
I see the NPCs are out in force spreading the usual denials; it's not happening, well maybe it's happening a little but it's exaggerated by conservatives, it's good that it's happening, etc. Amazing that the same people who introduced the word "gaslighting" to the mainstream audience are so adept at it, almost like they were familiar with the technique through frequent use.

It's such an easy lie to disprove too, just look at the way any Democrat hems and haws when asked to define a woman in public these days (apparently you need to be a biologist now?), the constant outrage archeology being performed on public figures in order to demand apologies for decades old "transgressions" that were completely benign at the time, the countless tales of ordinary people forced out of jobs for breaking taboos that didn't exist mere months before, or any number of other indicators that things have gone a bit off the rails. I'm normally a big fan of Hanlon's Razor, but it's really hard not to see malice here, like many of these people know that wokeness is poisonous to most normies who resent the constant moralizing and shifting standards, but think if they can just keep pretending it's all a figment of the rightwing imagination they'll never have to pay the political price for it, even as they chafe under it themselves.

The ratchet effect is also very real, it can easily be seen in the utter humorlessness of the woke, particularly within their own ranks; they can't make fun of each other for going too far because none of them knows what "too far" thing that seems absurd today will be gospel tomorrow and grounds for cancellation, so they just have to treat everything seriously out of self preservation, allowing the most extreme people to push the group further and further out of bounds.


If you ever have a child who is trans and they are suicidal in their teens I'm 100% sure you wouldn't expose your "old timey" outdated views with them.