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Dengashinobi
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21 Feb 2023, 1:20 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Mona Pereth wrote:
Be that as it may, the person you were replying to, stratozyck, is an actual economist, thus in a better position than you to evaluate whether Keynes's "entire work is pseudoscience" or whether "his approach is largely abandoned basically everywhere."


This is why a big portion of people informed by the Chicago school (and similar) appear more like the Cult of The Invisible Hand instead of a credible school of economic thought.

These days, not only are we all Keynesians (as Milton Friedman sort-of said), but we're also all informed by the Chicago school. They're both key parts of the new neoclassical synthesis. The Austrians are closer to being a cult.

Dengashinobi wrote:
How is keynesian economics foundational part of macroeconomics? Any examples of major contemporary keynesian policies today? Even if there are, it's more likely policies made by democrats who want to appear as if they are helping the economy. There is no shortage of crony economists who want to further their carear by entertaining the desires of an economically illiterate voter base. Keynesianism is as obsolete as lobotomy.

Some key elements of Keynesianism that are important to modern economics include the idea of economic stimulus during downturns, price "stickiness", and the idea of imperfect competition. New Keynesianism is one of the major components of the new neoclassical synthesis, which is taught to undergraduate economists throughout elite universities, including in, for example, Greg Mankiw's textbook. The idea of cutting taxes to stimulate the economy is itself Keynesian.

Most economists don't have any real exposure to the "voter base". Nobody knows who Austan Goolsbee is.

There are two ways for an economist to become somewhat famous:

1) be really weird and also have the ear of a major politician (like that guy from Cardiff University who kept giving Liz Truss bad advice)

2) write a book (best case scenario is that this makes you as famous as Steven Levitt)

For real success you need both, like Keynes and Friedman. I don't think nyone active today is that famous.


Yes Keynesianism is still tought here and there, but overall is obsolete, especially if you take into account that it used to be the absolute mainstream a few dacades ago. Milton Friedman's remark refers probably to monetarism being yet another state interventionist policy like Keynesianism used to be. But Monetarism is not Keynesianism.

I said the bit about the voter bade in anticipation of examples of Keynesian policies practiced today by the government. Crony economists can be hired from politicians with a certain agenda.



The_Walrus
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21 Feb 2023, 2:27 pm

Well Keynesianism from Keynes' time, yes, is not practiced today, just as Adam Smith and David Ricardo's classical economics is not practiced today. However, both are foundational to modern economics, and have been integrated with other ideas like public choice theory to form mainstream economics. They are not just "taught here and there", they are taught everywhere, unless you're being taught by a Marxian or a member of the Austrian School.

A major part of Keynesianism is the need for centralised co-ordination of microeconomic policy, which has led to the creation of the World Bank and the IMF. The movement for independent central banks, similarly, is a Keynesian one.

I mean, when someone like Greg Mankiw (who is a right-wing economist, adviser to Bush and Romney, and author of the most popular undergraduate textbook) describes himself as a "New Keynesian" then it's clear that Keynesianism isn't just the preserve of left-wing cranks like Ha-Joon Chang, or right-wing cranks like Patrick Minford. It's mainsteam.



AngelRho
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21 Feb 2023, 5:40 pm

The_Walrus wrote:
It's mainsteam.

Mainsteam like steam locomotives? Or Mainsteam like the Titanic?



Pepe
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21 Feb 2023, 10:09 pm

ToughDiamond wrote:
Pepe wrote:
ToughDiamond wrote:
Pepe wrote:
You do know that there is indeed a dark "underground" power group covertly controlling "social evolution", right?

No, and I doubt you do either.
Quote:
I don't intend to elaborate, here.
It has NEVER been fruitful in the past.
Perhaps in another thread. 8)

Good luck with that.


Are you religiously inclined?

About 0.0000000000000000000000000001%


My point is that there are billions of ppl believing in an invisible man in the sky, while I base my beliefs on reason, personal experience, and understanding human psychology.
Just sayin'. ;)



Dengashinobi
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22 Feb 2023, 3:53 am

The_Walrus wrote:
Well Keynesianism from Keynes' time, yes, is not practiced today, just as Adam Smith and David Ricardo's classical economics is not practiced today. However, both are foundational to modern economics, and have been integrated with other ideas like public choice theory to form mainstream economics. They are not just "taught here and there", they are taught everywhere, unless you're being taught by a Marxian or a member of the Austrian School.

A major part of Keynesianism is the need for centralised co-ordination of microeconomic policy, which has led to the creation of the World Bank and the IMF. The movement for independent central banks, similarly, is a Keynesian one.

I mean, when someone like Greg Mankiw (who is a right-wing economist, adviser to Bush and Romney, and author of the most popular undergraduate textbook) describes himself as a "New Keynesian" then it's clear that Keynesianism isn't just the preserve of left-wing cranks like Ha-Joon Chang, or right-wing cranks like Patrick Minford. It's mainsteam.


Ok, so we are not talking about Keynesianism but about New Keynesian economics. Two different things. New Keynesian economics apparently is two thirds Monetarism mixed with what could be salvaged from Keynesianism plus some concepts from Wicksell and some original output. Its more like New Monetarism.
Yes Monetarism is mainstream.

Adam Smith's and Ricardo's work are still relevant today, unlike Keynesianism which was throuwn to the garbage bin except for a few concepts retained by the New Keynesian economics that are also questionable or useless more precisely.

The world bank and IMF were founded at a time when Keynesianism reigned. That does not make their policy Keynesian today. Also I wouldn't mention those two corrupt and ineficient institutions as favourable to any cause.



Foxinator
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23 Feb 2023, 11:24 pm

Nietzsche is my absolute favorite Philosopher. He is morbid, yet incredibly insightful. I love how Nietzsche gets deep into the core of Human Existence, and presents his view in an insightful, yet somewhat humorous manner. I also love his Mustache. Although I'm not a full blown Nihilist, I still believe Nietzsche has an incredible perspective.



Pepe
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23 Feb 2023, 11:54 pm

Foxinator wrote:
Nietzsche is my absolute favorite Philosopher. He is morbid, yet incredibly insightful. I love how Nietzsche gets deep into the core of Human Existence, and presents his view in an insightful, yet somewhat humorous manner. I also love his Mustache. Although I'm not a full blown Nihilist, I still believe Nietzsche has an incredible perspective.


He is more in sympathy with NT society, unfortunately.



RetroGamer87
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24 Feb 2023, 6:57 am

Philosophy? Tell me when they figure out which philosophy is the correct one.


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