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khaoz
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19 Jun 2014, 8:26 pm

For the same reason we are in the dark ages in every category of civility. Money. And to those who say the US does not have the "nice" weather Germany has, I think maybe you have never been to Europe.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/how-to/ ... d=65555906



chris5000
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19 Jun 2014, 8:54 pm

Germany is tiny and homogenous compared to the united states



ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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19 Jun 2014, 9:21 pm

What would be interesting is to see one US state go solar. Perhaps Arizona or New Mexico? That would be neat-o.



thomas81
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19 Jun 2014, 10:06 pm

The USA is not a democracy. Its a plutocracy where the oil companies are in charge of the country. No government will ever oppose their will.

The oil companies have huge huge lobbying power in the USA. For the USA to go renewable would be political suicide for the responsible administration.


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TheGoggles
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19 Jun 2014, 10:31 pm

Petroleum conglomerates.



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19 Jun 2014, 10:46 pm

If enough places around the world go solar then how are these oil companies going to make much profit? Demand for their product decreases substantially.
The future of energy is already diversifying as I write this and the oil companies are leading the way. They are branching out into other areas and spending a lot of money on research and innovation. They will become energy companies not entirely dependent on oil.



Jacoby
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19 Jun 2014, 11:11 pm

It says that 90% of those solar panels are installed on private homes, Americans could do the same and supposedly the payment plans are similar to what you'd pay monthly for electricity anyways. Americans can't pay their mortgages tho so most probably can't get financed for solar panels.



NobodyKnows
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19 Jun 2014, 11:16 pm

IIRC, most European plans to go to renewable sources depend on spreading production over several member states and several different technologies. So they will use solar in places like Spain (or even N. Africa), wind (including offshore sites) and various types of hydro-power.

It's not without hitches. Germany will miss their CO2 reduction targets due to their decision to phase out nuclear power. They have to use coal-fired plants to make up for dips in renewable generation, which erases a lot of the benefit. Europe also dosn't have the distribution network that they'll need to make a cross-boarder scheme work.



khaoz
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19 Jun 2014, 11:30 pm

chris5000 wrote:
Germany is tiny and homogenous compared to the united states


what does Germany being homogenous have to do with it? We in the United States are just a community of 50 "Germanys". The problem is the people making enormous amounts of money from fossil fuels who are going to c*ckblock anything that has the potential to cut into their revenue source, environmental consequences be damned. At least around mee, people are opening their minds to wind turbines, which are starting to pop up everywhere.



luanqibazao
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20 Jun 2014, 12:21 am

The problem with the unreliable sources of energy ? solar and wind ? is that nobody has yet found a practical way to store electricity on a large scale. Power has to be delivered in real time as needed. It's not always sunny or windy, so you need to retain a complete reliable energy source as backup. Around here, that's coal.

Suppose you have an "ideal" day, perfectly clear and sunny (or extremely windy). Solar/wind is providing 100% of the power needed and the coal-fired plant is standing idle. Then a cloud bank rolls in, or the wind dies, and that coal-burning plant needs to "ramp up" from zero to maybe 80% capacity in a few minutes. Just like a car accelerating full throttle vs. cruising at highway speed, the plant while "ramping up" burns much more fuel, and creates much more pollution, than if it had been running steadily at 80% all the while. And any benefits accrued in the previous several hours are wiped out.

Maybe solar power would be cost-effective in Phoenix or Death Valley. Maybe there's a place where there's a strong wind almost all the time, and wind turbines would really make sense. As things stand right now, though, for most parts of the US to "go solar" or "go wind" would create more problems than it would solve.



zer0netgain
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20 Jun 2014, 2:03 am

luanqibazao wrote:
Maybe solar power would be cost-effective in Phoenix or Death Valley. Maybe there's a place where there's a strong wind almost all the time, and wind turbines would really make sense.


But then (with wind) you have to deal with the slaughter of birds (many endangered) because they can't account for the speed of the spinning blades and there is no way to ward them off from the wind farms.

The damage to the wild eagle population in the USA from wind power is largely under reported in the mainstream media.



chris5000
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20 Jun 2014, 5:01 am

khaoz wrote:
chris5000 wrote:
Germany is tiny and homogenous compared to the united states


what does Germany being homogenous have to do with it? We in the United States are just a community of 50 "Germanys". The problem is the people making enormous amounts of money from fossil fuels who are going to c*ckblock anything that has the potential to cut into their revenue source, environmental consequences be damned. At least around mee, people are opening their minds to wind turbines, which are starting to pop up everywhere.


America is a bunch of different environment also solar has a huge pollution trail same with wind and wind also has downsides like killing birds and changing wind patterns



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20 Jun 2014, 8:03 am

Image


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ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo
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20 Jun 2014, 8:42 am

chris5000 wrote:
khaoz wrote:
chris5000 wrote:
Germany is tiny and homogenous compared to the united states


what does Germany being homogenous have to do with it? We in the United States are just a community of 50 "Germanys". The problem is the people making enormous amounts of money from fossil fuels who are going to c*ckblock anything that has the potential to cut into their revenue source, environmental consequences be damned. At least around mee, people are opening their minds to wind turbines, which are starting to pop up everywhere.


America is a bunch of different environment also solar has a huge pollution trail same with wind and wind also has downsides like killing birds and changing wind patterns


I have actually seen these wind mills and I can tell you they are so big, cumbersome and so far out in the middle of nowhere they are harmless unless you install a ridiculously large amount of them.

You would think: Oklahoma = big oil. No windmills. Oklahoma is actually leading the nation in wind energy and has plenty of them.



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20 Jun 2014, 10:06 am

One can always make up for shortfalls in renewables using natural gas. No need to use coal.

But, if you're using solar, you don't need big distribution networks. The sun shines on the rich and poor alike. Either use batteries to store excess energy - the electric cars industry helps here - or use a gas generator to create power when the sun isn't shining (hopefully, we'll get microturbines...). You don't need more than local microgrids, and probably won't need many of those.



chris5000
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20 Jun 2014, 10:13 am

ooOoOoOAnaOoOoOoo wrote:
chris5000 wrote:
khaoz wrote:
chris5000 wrote:
Germany is tiny and homogenous compared to the united states


what does Germany being homogenous have to do with it? We in the United States are just a community of 50 "Germanys". The problem is the people making enormous amounts of money from fossil fuels who are going to c*ckblock anything that has the potential to cut into their revenue source, environmental consequences be damned. At least around mee, people are opening their minds to wind turbines, which are starting to pop up everywhere.


America is a bunch of different environment also solar has a huge pollution trail same with wind and wind also has downsides like killing birds and changing wind patterns


I have actually seen these wind mills and I can tell you they are so big, cumbersome and so far out in the middle of nowhere they are harmless unless you install a ridiculously large amount of them.

You would think: Oklahoma = big oil. No windmills. Oklahoma is actually leading the nation in wind energy and has plenty of them.

the only way wind is viable is by installing a large amount
they are also very noisy
they throw ice thousands of feet
kill birds
change the wind patterns in the area having effects on the weather

nuclear power is the only real solution anyone that says otherwise really has no idea what nuclear power really is
people seem to think nuclear = the 60s heavy water reactor technology