Why Christianity is so Persistant

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I think posible your idea of a "large porportion" of people in th US living in abject poverty is a little much what exactly are you compairing to? Then theres Cuba if it's such a great place why do people risk their lives in those makesift boat to get to Fla.? I do think a mix of both good social policy and capatlisim would work best . But this is the thread about Chirstainty beeing so persistant. Well is not conversion a big part of some Christian religion that send out lots of missonaries to repressed poor contries giving them the carot of an end to their suffering and aid. That being said I wish people didn't have to blackmail people with aid it should just be feely given no strings religous or otherwise attached.








On the I agree with you completely

12% of the US live below the poverty line (as agreed by the UN) and more of the population by percentage are incarcerated than any other country with over 2 million US citizens in jail at this time, if your a black male between your 20's and 30's in the US you are statistically 12% likely to reside in the slammer, that's over a 1 in 10 likelyhood.

Cuba has suffered under US sanctions and is a "third world" country. The average citizen there has benefited out of the removal of the american backed capatilist dictator and implementation of socialism but it is still a third world country and a lot poorer than the US so i guess some Cuban's understandably want a piece of the American pie. You wont see many people leaving countries hat have social capatilism to go to the US. Most of these countries, such as Norway and Denmark, have 0% of the population under the poverty line and even the unemployed and disabled live comfortably with good housing. I cant see why countries like ours cant implement these models?

Socialries are also bigger givers of aid percentage wise than the US and Britain despite the fact that they arent as religious as us and most aid isnt given in the name of religion. Despite this i recognise that religion can help give you a good moral grounding if taught the right way and that religious people can be some of the most charitable people on earth.

My problem is that the most religious areas nin the US are one's that vote Bush and want to take and give little to those less fortunate than them. Religious organisations and their followers here can often be very conservative in terms of policy and tome ey cant be true christians if they dont "love thy neighbour as thyself" or help those who are in unfortunate positions than themselves and charity work doesnt cover it, social reform so that everyone can live with some dignity would go a lot further to helping our fellow man and woman.

I for a long time lived at or below that level we didn't have a car only black and white tv but I never considered us helplessly poor. Poor is relative to the contry your in.



This is indeed a sad statement especially since a large percentage is nonviolent drug offences. Or becuse of poor public defenders. As for Cuba at least we did not used to put people in jail for disageeing with the govenment but thins have changed.



I feel the same way and no longer live in one of those areas. but even in those areas there are still sane people so there is hope

I agree that poor can be relative to the country (remember that the UN poverty line is agreed as an international standard definition of living in poverty, maybe it was an exageration to say that there is so many living in abject poverty in the US but to me there is no excuse for it's existence in the girst place in a country and world that isnt short on resources)your in but there are people in the west that live in almost third world conditions that along with poverty have social issues that make it hard to be a productive and upstanding citizen.

While id like to see more transparency and flexibility in the current Cuban administration, i dont believe, as far as i know, that people that anti-government campaigners (of which there is few) are being assasinated as they were under American-led administration.

What they said.

There is no excuse for it and people who have these problems should if at all possible by made to feel like they are a menber of socity and should be taken care of.

As for Cuba I don't think its the same as It used to be I think its mellowing with age.

Actually, "Survival of the Fittest" and Capitalism go hand in hand.
Niezsche spawned his "God is dead" from this and then we arrive at Ethical Egoism.

Marx created his Communist Manifesto from Heggel's dialectical reasoning using economic theory.



I agree with everything you said here.



Where as in Communism the state is not subject to the will of the people and the state's rights are above the people?



Ah yes, thought so. I prefer that peoples rights as a whole are greater than the individual and the state is subject to the will of the people. What is that called, Utopian Socialism? Liberalism?



I am glad you said some . Humankind is a very pervasive force but we are mortals. If we continue to abuse our world and suck it dry then we will pay the consequences. I like the goodness aspect in the bible, that we should use our hearts more then our selfish minds.
I will find it hard to believe that making money is "better for the greater good" then helping others, and ecosystems. I think you will have alot in common with most environmentalists and First Nations groups. I am more realistic. I find the key to this world is balance of everything. (I should get into taoism).



What truth, and who is truly Christian? I thought Christian means a belief in Christ.



Are you referring to the Civil Rights movement, multiculturalism, 60's, MOD?
Why do you label evolutionists as communists?

The movement I see currently is one of balance and at peace with nature/surroundings. Survival of the fittest is a principle that is followed by predator vs prey. I am partly an evolutionist and I think the principle is correct. I am highly for human rights. Am I a bad person because I think that survival of the fittest is how we got here today?

We are predators. We have fought many wars in the past. Some of them were comitted by "Christians." However, I don't think that goodness was invented by western philosophy or by Christ (unless by your definition Christ is God). Chinese philosophy and Budhism thought of goodness a long time ago. Before that maybe some African Tribes, and if the Bible is correct, they got it from God.

Constantine is the reason why Christianity survived. European conquest is the reason why it is so pursistant. The reason why Europe was so powerful in history is because of Geography
(Guns Germs and Steel, Jared Diamond). If you combine that with the fact that many missionaries felt the need to "save" people.

Ok where do I stand in this thread? Has everyone really ignored me as everyone really missed me at all for five days? Come on some body has to miss the arguements.

Eamonn wrote: My problem is that the most religious areas nin the US are one's that vote Bush and want to take and give little to those less fortunate than them. Religious organisations and their followers here can often be very conservative in terms of policy and tome ey cant be true christians if they dont "love thy neighbour as thyself" or help those who are in unfortunate positions than themselves and charity work doesnt cover it, social reform so that everyone can live with some dignity would go a lot further to helping our fellow man and woman.


The great social reforms of the early 1900s were started by Christians. The great abolitionists were Christians. America gives alot of $$$$ to other countrys in loans that are never paid and humanitarian aid. Christian organizations and missions contribute greatly to the betterment of mankind. I would say there are alot of Christains who practice what they preach but some would prefer to criticise and point out the error amidst all of the glaring goodness.

Thanks for not flaming me. I think I love you.

Mithrandir wrote: Are you referring to the Civil Rights movement, multiculturalism, 60's, MOD?
Why do you label evolutionists as communists?

The movement I see currently is one of balance and at peace with nature/surroundings. Survival of the fittest is a principle that is followed by predator vs prey. I am partly an evolutionist and I think the principle is correct. I am highly for human rights. Am I a bad person because I think that survival of the fittest is how we got here today?

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Ø This revival caused women to rethink traditional female roles. Exhorted to give their testimonies and spread the gospel, women were given a public platform. Women’s movements began to emerge such as the Female Moral Reform Society, which attempted to remedy the rising problem of prostitution in cities. The society opened shelters and helped women find jobs. The society pushed for criminalization of prostitution and the solicitation of prostitutes. (Norton pp 274-75)
Ø Institutional reform was a priority of religious activist Dorothea Dix, a former preschool and Sunday school teacher, who worked to improve the treatment and housing of the insane and criminals. She helped found 32 homes for the mentally ill. (www.mfh.org)
Ø Oberlin College in Ohio, affiliated with evangelist Charles G. Finney, became the first college to admit women in 1833. In 1836, Wesleyan College in Georgia became the first college exclusively for women. (Lowman, pp 231)

Frederick Douglass was a Christian and Martin Luther King Jr also.

I did not intend for Evolutionist and Communist to be taken as one and the same.

I do not think that you are a bad person for what you think. Why did you think that I think you are bad? Preconcieved notions about Christians, maybe?

I am all for balanced environmentalism. But there are radicals among us, even high profile spokespersons for the movement who are a bit....well, whacko. One such person (can't remember his name, sorry) stated that 'we need to reclaim thousands of acres of developed land and restore it to its natural state as a habitat for the animals" I say, Fine. Let's start with his house!

Bland, wait until you earn your wings and become an angel before sticking your head in the clouds. (the united states of) America has econimic policies that make things worse for the poor and back's wars and suffering when it is in their own economic interest. A few million in handouts here and there wont change that. Most of your points are factually innacccurate and show the typical arrogance and ignorance of a yankee christian, but you invented peace and freedom didnt you so it's ytour right to take it away and re-write history if it so suits you.

BTW, just because your very very gravely wrong in your political beliefs wont stop me loving you either. Who says that an angel and a spawn of satan cant be friends or lovers, i mean Lucifer is a fallen angel anyway, isnt he?

Bland I don't agree with many of your points but this one is great The only problem is that they would have enough money to buy a new one unlike the others displaced.

Eamonn wrote: BTW, just because your very very gravely wrong in your political beliefs wont stop me loving you either. Who says that an angel and a spawn of satan cant be friends or lovers, i mean Lucifer is a fallen angel anyway, isnt he?



It's all about Yin and Yang, baby!


As for the rest of your post, you are sadly mistaken. You have fallen for the anti-American propaganda hook, line, and sinker. That's okay, what else should I expect from a country where men where skirts?

Yes, eamonn, you skirt-wearing spawn of the serpent's scrotum. Listen to the man!

That's a great one! I think it should go down in WP history as a "Quotable Quote"!

They can't that's what I got to say to Lucifer and the other God loving angels will never ever be friends they will until the end of time and beyond be enemies. You're just getting things all screwed up you know that?